demanding proof of God

CarloMagnus · #1 Aug 1, '12, 5:52 pm

So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God's existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,"This is not proof."

I'm sure this doesn't belong here, I'll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn't know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don't know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl

Stylites · #2 Aug 1, '12, 6:15 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarloMagnus

So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God's existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,"This is not proof."

I'm sure this doesn't belong here, I'll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn't know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don't know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl

Lucky person!

Crowbar · #3 Aug 1, '12, 6:30 pm

In one of his talks, Fr. Larry Richards says his proof is that he spends time with God and knows Him. That might not convince an atheist but it sounds good to me.

ccmnxc · #4 Aug 1, '12, 6:32 pm

You could read up on miracles, especially ones that have been examined by scientists that haven't been able to explain it in any other ways (eucharistic miracles, stigmata, cloak of Juan Diego, etc.) However, their idea of "proof" might not be reasonable or possible. If that's the case, it is their fault, not yours or God's.

eightandsand · #5 Aug 1, '12, 6:34 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarloMagnus

So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God's existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,"This is not proof."

I'm sure this doesn't belong here, I'll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn't know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don't know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl

Ask the atheist, "What kind of proof?"

Also, ask the atheist if he has proof of his own existence.

CarloMagnus · #6 Aug 1, '12, 6:35 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by eightandsand

Ask the atheist, "What kind of proof?"

Also, ask the atheist if he has proof of his own existence.

You're talking about Descartes' philosophy. "Cogito ergo sum", right?

DWGarvin · #7 Aug 1, '12, 6:43 pm

Atheists don't want knowledge, or truth. They want certainty. Well, nobody can have that, so pity him and pray for him.

My suspicion is that he's trying to get you to lose your faith. If he wanted faith, he would say "teach me". Instead, he's saying "prove it to me,", hoping you'll stumble and then begin to have your own doubts.

Trust me, I've gone through my doubting phase(s), and I go through it often. But I keep coming back to Him, no matter what.

Those are my thoughts, anyway.

teenphilo1 · #8 Aug 1, '12, 6:43 pm

http://discovermagazine.com/2011/mar...&b_start:int=0

This might provide an answer. Pretty far-out though.

interestedman · #9 Aug 1, '12, 6:52 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarloMagnus

So, an atheist came up to me the other and demanded that I show the Atheist proof of God's existence. I told him that the efforts of cause and effect were relevant to the circumstances that require the necessity of a being that would will something from nothing. Yet the atheist states,"This is not proof."

I'm sure this doesn't belong here, I'll be content to know where it does so that I can post these sorts of questions there.

I simply didn't know what more to say.

Can someone help me? I just don't know what to say. And I would rather deal with this now before it causes me unnecessary apprehension.

-Karl

If there was real undeniable proof of God religion would be based on science and not faith. For something to require faith, the proof cannot be there.

interestedman · #10 Aug 1, '12, 6:54 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ccmnxc

You could read up on miracles, especially ones that have been examined by scientists that haven't been able to explain it in any other ways (eucharistic miracles, stigmata, cloak of Juan Diego, etc.) However, their idea of "proof" might not be reasonable or possible. If that's the case, it is their fault, not yours or God's.

Well you could certainly say it is God's fault for not letting himself be known. If God exists, he obviously has the ability to prove it in an undeniable fashion.

Delaine75 · #11 Aug 1, '12, 6:55 pm

When non-believers demand that I show proof of God's existence, I typically ignore it simply because with that attitude, probably nothing you show them will be proof enough to them and you'd just be wasting your time and your breath. They have to have a heart and mind open enough to receive what you are telling them. (In my opinion, LOL!)

DoGodsBidding · #12 Aug 1, '12, 6:59 pm

Proof of God is all around us. The beauty and the magnificence of the world that we live in is the work of a Supreme creator. All one has to do is be open to His world.

DGB

DWGarvin · #13 Aug 1, '12, 7:01 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by interestedman

Well you could certainly say it is God's fault for not letting himself be known. If God exists, he obviously has the ability to prove it in an undeniable fashion.

Personally, I believe that God shows his existence every moment of my day. If we choose to ignore those signs, well, then we are like those in Plato's cave, seeing shadows on the wall from a false light, thinking that it's reality.

Anyway, just my thoughts.

irishOntarian · #14 Aug 1, '12, 7:01 pm

Ask him to prove to you that Uranus, after all, he's never been there has he? So what if a few scientists say they've determined its existence. Maybe they're just crazy and have faked the pictures.

Likewise, so what if a lot of saints, plus a whole extra portion of un-canonized people have claimed to have visions of God and his angels. Maybe they just pretended to and then staged the miracles.

slotty · #15 Aug 1, '12, 7:12 pm

My response:

Sorry I can't do that. My God does not impose his will upon any of his creation. He allows us the choice to have a relationship with him. If there were to be undeniable proof of his existance then we would have no choice and the relationship would be forced upon us.

If someone chooses to have a relationship with him and that relationship grows and that is a wonderful thing for that individual.
Conversely if someone had the foundation of the relationship without being able to ever chose... Well it would be akin to constantly holding a gun to your head and demanding that we be friends.