Book 01: Sect. 01: Ch. 15: Works Done In Charity

Scout · #1 Aug 18, '05, 11:02 am

Ch 15: Works Done In Charity

Scout

The online version of Section 1: Chapter 15 is available here:
http://www.ccel.org/ccel/kempis/imitation.ONE.15.html

WanderAimlessly · #2 Aug 18, '05, 6:23 pm

How many times have we heard that the “ends justify the means”. Relativism that permeates this world allows us, it seems, to do anything we want if it makes us feel good. We should not do evil for the good of us or our fellow man.

Charity is doing good for our fellow man and to glorify God. We do not do it to glorify ourselves.

PF

CarolAnnSFO · #3 Aug 18, '05, 6:35 pm

"...but whatever is done out of charity, no matter how small and insignificant, is profitable in the eyes of God, Who looks not so much at what we do, as to the love with which we do it."

We don't always have to involve ourselves with the big, "glamour" ministries -- the ones that everyone sees -- sometimes it really is about offering someone a cup of water.

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ncjohn · #4 Aug 19, '05, 1:46 pm

It's Mother Teresa all over: "We can do no great things; only small things with great love."

WanderAimlessly · #5 Aug 20, '05, 7:46 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarolAnnSFO

We don't always have to involve ourselves with the big, "glamour" ministries -- the ones that everyone sees -- sometimes it really is about offering someone a cup of water.

I actually prefer to be behind the scenes. The limelight was, and still is, not attractive to me.

PF

antiaphrodite · #6 Aug 20, '05, 10:26 pm

Without charity external work is of no value, but anything done in charity, be it ever so small and trivial, is entirely fruitful inasmuch as God weighs the love with which a man acts rather than the deed itself.

comforting thought. sometimes i feel so helpless.

Quaere Verum · #7 Sep 11, '05, 2:58 pm

I found this to be a very interesting section and hope someone is still out there to discuss it. Kempis states, "Without love, the outward work is of no value; but whatever is done out of love, be it never so little , is wholly fruitful." I have a question about this.

What if I were to perform a work, small or great, but I do it out of obligation? Let's consider our current situation in this country - those affected by Hurrican Katrina. Let's say I donate an abundance of items from my home, buy supplies, help out at a shelter, even take in a family but I really do not feel the love behind the act but just know it should be done? I act in a great way; let's even say I'm not seeking recognition just doing what's needed. How can we say it is of "no value" as Kempis says? I would think that to the people on the receiving end, it was of great value. Is Kempis referring then to it being of "no value" to my soul rather than of "no value" whatsoever?

Quaere Verum
Seek the Truth

Grace and Glory · #8 Sep 11, '05, 7:51 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaere Verum

Kempis states, "Without love, the outward work is of no value; but whatever is done out of love, be it never so little , is wholly fruitful." ...
What if I were to perform a work, small or great, but I do it out of obligation? Let's consider our current situation in this country - those affected by Hurrican Katrina. Let's say I donate an abundance of items from my home, buy supplies, help out at a shelter, even take in a family but I really do not feel the love behind the act but just know it should be done? I act in a great way; let's even say I'm not seeking recognition just doing what's needed. How can we say it is of "no value" as Kempis says? I would think that to the people on the receiving end, it was of great value. Is Kempis referring then to it being of "no value" to my soul rather than of "no value" whatsoever?

First of all, you don't have to "feel the love behind the act." Feelings aren't really ours; they happen to us. That's why we used to call them the passions: we endure them. We can try to influence our feelings, but our feelings aren't always a reliable guide. If you act in another's best interest, in the hope of helping them, without a desire to make yourself look better, your action is done in love, whether or not you feel like it is. For example, during Lent, we sacrifice for love of God, but we probably don't feel especially warm and fuzzy when the dessert we gave up is sitting right there, beggin us to eat it.

Quaere Verum · #9 Sep 12, '05, 5:54 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grace and Glory

First of all, you don't have to "feel the love behind the act." Feelings aren't really ours; they happen to us. That's why we used to call them the passions: we endure them. We can try to influence our feelings, but our feelings aren't always a reliable guide. If you act in another's best interest, in the hope of helping them, without a desire to make yourself look better, your action is done in love, whether or not you feel like it is. For example, during Lent, we sacrifice for love of God, but we probably don't feel especially warm and fuzzy when the dessert we gave up is sitting right there, beggin us to eat it.

Very well put Grace & Glory. Thanks!

Grace and Glory · #10 Sep 13, '05, 3:42 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaere Verum

Very well put Grace & Glory. Thanks!

You're welcome!

Fitz · #11 Sep 19, '05, 2:17 pm

"On the contrary, he who has true and perfect charity seeks self in nothing, but searches all things for the glory of God."

Coming from a generation raised during a time of self actualization and finding one's self, this really hits home. I knew that living life only for one's self was wrong, but the extent to which we are to be only acting for the glory of God is much more than I can relate to most of the time. How often do we say, you owe it to yourself? Gosh, we have gotten so self centered and so very selfish.

LSK · #12 Sep 22, '05, 1:10 pm

"On the contrary, he who has true and perfect charity seeks self in nothing, but searches all things for the 21 glory of God. Moreover, he envies no man, because he desires no personal pleasure nor does he wish to rejoice in himself; rather he desires the greater glory of God above all things. He ascribes to man nothing that is good but attributes it wholly to God from Whom all things proceed as from a fountain, and in Whom all the blessed shall rest as their last end and fruition."

So, again, the challenge seems to be the constant subjegation of self, whether it be in personal opinion or actual works. It is more important to be God-focused than man-focused, and yet if our focus on the Creator does not include love and service to His Creatures we are missing a large chunk of the message.

Right?

Jim95437 · #13 Nov 7, '05, 7:36 am

Now, that which seems to be charity is oftentimes really sensuality, for man’s own inclination, his own will, his hope of reward, and his self-interest, are motives seldom absent. On the contrary, he who has true and perfect charity seeks self in nothing, but searches all things for the greater glory of God.

I fall so short in this area. My hope and prayer is that the desire and striving for true charity will fit, somehow, into the Lord's will. True and perfect charity is at the very end of a long uphill climb for me. And I wish I was sprinting instead of crawling.