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  #1  
Old Dec 7, '12, 8:43 pm
LEMAITRE LEMAITRE is offline
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Default Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches



"BRITAIN will announce plans next week to allow gay marriages in churches and other religious buildings, officials say, although Prime Minister David Cameron insists no faith group would be forced to hold them.

Culture Secretary Maria Miller will unveil ministers' responses to a consultation earlier this year, which will propose that religious organisations should be able to "opt-in" to hold same-sex weddings, according to a government source.

Amid strong opposition from the Church of England and Roman Catholics, however, as well as many members of Cameron's Conservative Party, Miller will stress that no religious groups will be forced to conduct gay weddings.

"I'm a massive supporter of marriage and I don't want gay people to be excluded from a great institution," Cameron told reporters during a visit to a car factory on Friday.

"But let me be absolutely 100 per cent clear, if there is any church or any synagogue or any mosque that doesn't want to have a gay marriage it will not, absolutely must not, be forced to hold it.

"That is absolutely clear in the legislation.

"Also let me make clear, this is a free vote for members of parliament but personally I will be supporting it."

Gay couples have had the right to hold a civil partnership since 2004 but campaigners have pushed for full equality with heterosexual couples.

The Church of England repeated its opposition in a statement on Friday.

"We believe that redefining marriage to include same-sex relationships will entail a dilution in the meaning of marriage," it said.

In its submission to the public consultation in June, the Church said legalising gay marriage could force it out of its traditional role of conducting weddings on behalf of the state.

However, the Quakers welcomed Friday's news, saying they had been campaigning since 2009 for all marriages in Quaker meeting houses to be legally valid.

"We are waiting for the law to catch up," said recording clerk Paul Parker, adding, "For Quakers, this is an issue of religious freedom and we don't seek to impose this on others."

"The government is committed to bringing equal civil marriage forward and the consultation results will be announced next week," a government spokesman said.

"We are very clear that religious organisations must be protected and that no religious organisation will be forced to conduct same-sex marriage ceremonies.

"The European Convention on Human Rights guarantees freedom of religion and we will additionally bring in very strong legal locks to ensure the protection is watertight."



http://www.news.com.au/world/britain...-1226532696442
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  #2  
Old Dec 7, '12, 8:46 pm
vera dicere vera dicere is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

I find this kinda odd, because you'd think if a church wants to offer a same sex "marriage" service they'd do so if SSM was legalised. Why should a secular law say "if you're a church, you can't marry Bruce and Barry unless you opt in".

Down here we have civil unions [a "marriage equality" bill is before a select committee and will sadly, likely become law ] But we already have churches that offer "same sex civil union blessings", Christian ones, I'm talking about too. Some Christian churches seem to base their whole existence on the gay relationship thing.

As long as the law, all laws pertaining to this mess, ensure the rights of religious institutions to say no then really what more can we ask for? I do think they're treading on dangerous terrority, and do think that if gay marriage is legalised, it won't be long before Bruce and Barry are suing teh Catholic Church or whatever Christain church who refuses to "marry" them.

I still think the whole thing is a disgrace. Ignorant and completely mindless in regards to what marriage actually is.
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  #3  
Old Dec 7, '12, 9:31 pm
LEMAITRE LEMAITRE is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

The Quakers are ecstatic about the decision.
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  #4  
Old Dec 7, '12, 10:28 pm
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DaddyGirl DaddyGirl is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

That sounds pretty fair. Seems like each church/synagogue that wants to perform such marriages can do it, and if they do not want to, they don't have to.
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  #5  
Old Dec 7, '12, 10:30 pm
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iloveangels iloveangels is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyGirl View Post
That sounds pretty fair. Sounds like each church/synagogue that wants to perform such marriages can do it, and if they do not want to, they don't have to.
How long do you think that arrangement will last, DaddyGirl?
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  #6  
Old Dec 7, '12, 10:35 pm
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DaddyGirl DaddyGirl is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

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Originally Posted by iloveangels View Post
How long do you think that arrangement will last, DaddyGirl?

I imagine that if everyone stays kind, fair, and respectful of each other, a meeting-halfway like this could last quite a long time.
You are in agreement?
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Old Dec 7, '12, 10:59 pm
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iloveangels iloveangels is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

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Originally Posted by DaddyGirl View Post
I imagine that if everyone stays kind, fair, and respectful of each other, a meeting-halfway like this could last quite a long time.
You are in agreement?
Right. I repeat, how long do you think this arrangement will last, DaddyGirl?
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  #8  
Old Dec 8, '12, 12:28 am
Santi2 Santi2 is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

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Originally Posted by vera dicere View Post
As long as the law, all laws pertaining to this mess, ensure the rights of religious institutions to say no then really what more can we ask for?
Safeguard is a farce in this country. Any rights preserved for religious institutions do not include rights of the individuals e.g. Catholic teachers in non-faith schools, etc. Also, those safeguarded rights only extend to Bishops and priests who do not wish to perform same-sex "marriage" but , under our equality laws (Sexual Orientation Regulations) will not apply to Church premises (implications on registration and registered Authorised Person) and dissenting priests. Being that "perform if they do not wish to do so" is the operative clause coming out of Camoron's mouth and in view of Call to Action and Churches which host their meetings, can we really guarantee that same-sex "marriage" will not take place in Catholic Churches?

In September 2010, +Abp Nichols was asked whether "gay marriages" will be one to happen in the Catholic Church in England and Wales, his response at that time was "I don't know". I was one of many who did not understand what he meant at that time but, I do now.
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Last edited by Santi2; Dec 8, '12 at 12:39 am.
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  #9  
Old Dec 8, '12, 1:06 am
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Sam_777 Sam_777 is offline
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Thumbs down Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

They should be reminded about what happened to Sodom and Gomorrah...........
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  #10  
Old Dec 8, '12, 3:15 am
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Samuel63 Samuel63 is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

What will be the next step in this "development" of marriage I wonder. Steve Ray has an interesting post on his blog site about another related issue in Europe.

http://www.catholic-convert.com/2012...s-on-the-rise/
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  #11  
Old Dec 8, '12, 3:25 am
Santi2 Santi2 is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

Outside the gay crowd - polygamy. Right now our laws have limited application in regard thereto i.e. recognition is extended to polygamous marriages which took place outside of the UK...and even then, only limited to two wives (for social welfare benefit purposes).

Within the gay crowd - lowering the age of consent.
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  #12  
Old Dec 8, '12, 4:57 am
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asd72 asd72 is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyGirl View Post
I imagine that if everyone stays kind, fair, and respectful of each other, a meeting-halfway like this could last quite a long time.
You are in agreement?
The trouble is Cameron can't guarantee it is only for the institutions that want to opt in. All sorts of equality laws are going to come in to play. Already there are many who want equality across the board without respect of what the religion teaches.
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  #13  
Old Dec 8, '12, 8:33 am
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iloveangels iloveangels is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

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Originally Posted by asd72 View Post
The trouble is Cameron can't guarantee it is only for the institutions that want to opt in. All sorts of equality laws are going to come in to play. Already there are many who want equality across the board without respect of what the religion teaches.
They need to separate civil and religious marriage ASAP. Something like they've already done in some countries in Europe.
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  #14  
Old Dec 8, '12, 9:12 am
rossum rossum is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

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Originally Posted by asd72 View Post
The trouble is Cameron can't guarantee it is only for the institutions that want to opt in. All sorts of equality laws are going to come in to play. Already there are many who want equality across the board without respect of what the religion teaches.
That is why the change is being made. By not allowing Quakers, and others, to celebrate same sex marriages the first proposal was infringing their right to freedom of religion, and hence opening itself to challenge. By allowing those churches who wish to to have gay marriages, there is no pressure for other churches to do so. That is the current situation with Civil Partnerships, churches may, but do not have to, perform them.

Similarly, there is no law in the UK forcing the Catholic Church to marry divorced couples because such couples can get married in other churches if they want a church wedding.

rossum
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  #15  
Old Dec 8, '12, 9:23 am
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iloveangels iloveangels is offline
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Default Re: Britain to allow gay-marriage in churches

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Originally Posted by rossum View Post
That is why the change is being made. By not allowing Quakers, and others, to celebrate same sex marriages the first proposal was infringing their right to freedom of religion, and hence opening itself to challenge. By allowing those churches who wish to to have gay marriages, there is no pressure for other churches to do so. That is the current situation with Civil Partnerships, churches may, but do not have to, perform them.

Similarly, there is no law in the UK forcing the Catholic Church to marry divorced couples because such couples can get married in other churches if they want a church wedding.

rossum
Like I said, how long do you think this little arrangement will last?
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