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  #1  
Old Jan 5, '13, 11:45 pm
Tx3bro Tx3bro is offline
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Default Does the old testament still apply?

We don't stone gays like it says to and leviticus and what not,so does it still apply and if so to what extent?
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  #2  
Old Jan 6, '13, 1:04 am
thistle thistle is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

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We don't stone gays like it says to and leviticus and what not,so does it still apply and if so to what extent?
We retain the moral laws which are the 10 Commandments. We are not bound by particular punishments that were handed out then.
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  #3  
Old Jan 6, '13, 1:31 am
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JerryZ JerryZ is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

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We don't stone gays like it says to and leviticus and what not,so does it still apply and if so to what extent?
Hmmm. Jesus showed the adulterous woman compassion and forgiveness, but I did not read him telling her to continue in her adulterous ways. Nope He told her to "go in peace but sin no more".

The lesson here is we forgive the sinner but the sin remains.

In Leviticus, adulterers caught in the act were stoned to death.

We no longer do that, but adultery remains a grave sin.

I believe that is the key to read the OT in light of the NT.
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Old Jan 6, '13, 4:58 am
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odhiambo odhiambo is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

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Originally Posted by Tx3bro View Post
We don't stone gays like it says to and leviticus and what not,so does it still apply and if so to what extent?
I guess Saint Augustine answered this question for us when he said the following:
“The New Testament lies hidden in the Old Testament and the Old Testament is unveiled in the New Testament"
St. Augustine
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  #5  
Old Jan 6, '13, 6:59 am
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JRKH JRKH is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

From a Scriptural standpoint allow me to offer two passages that helped me a lot.

The first is Mt 18:15-18 and in particular Jesus giving authority to "The Church" to "bind and loose" "Whatever" - and that we are to "Listen to the Church".
The second is Acts 15 - the council of Jerusalem. This council was dealing with the very matter that you speak of...whether the requirements of the Mosaic Law remained in force...
The Church - in council - and exercising their Christ granted right to bind and loose - said no - the mosaic Law was not to be extended to the Gentile converts - effectively nullifying the keeping of the "Mosaic Law" as necessary for salvation.

As mentioned above, we do retain the 10 commandments - largely because a) they were written by the very finger of God and, b) they concisely present the Law of Love that Jesus speaks of in Mt 22:36-40.

Hope this helps a bit...

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  #6  
Old Jan 6, '13, 7:56 am
Dolezal Dolezal is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

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Originally Posted by Tx3bro View Post
We don't stone gays like it says to and leviticus and what not,so does it still apply and if so to what extent?
No, the law of Moses does not apply to us (Christians) or anyone else (Jews). The law was set "because of transgressions, until the seed (Jesus Christ) would come to whom the promise had been made" (Galatians 3:19). Moses' covenant was therefore abrogated (Galatians 3-5). (Not to be confused with Abraham's covenant, which has been fulfilled (become the New Testament) (Romans 4, Galatians 3-5).)

Justin Martyr, Dialogue with Trypho, 11: "Now, law placed against law has abrogated that which is before it, and a covenant which comes after in like manner has put an end to the previous one."

Chrysostom, Homily on Romans, 6:12: "Yet surely Paul’s object everywhere is to annul this Law. And with much reason; for it was through a fear and a horror of this that the Jews obstinately opposed grace."

Homily on Galatians, 3: "And so while no one annuls a man’s covenant, the covenant of God after four hundred and thirty years is annulled; for if not that covenant but another instead of it bestows what is promised, then is it set aside, which is most unreasonable."
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  #7  
Old Jan 7, '13, 9:06 pm
sirach2v4 sirach2v4 is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

this is a complex question and the Pontifical Biblical Commission (under Joseph Ratzinger) gave an answer to this about ten years ago.

This document which can be downloaded describes itself as the beginning of an understand of this topic

[The answer to the title question is YES; this document is a start to describing HOW]

http://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/PBCJWSCR.HTM
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  #8  
Old Jan 8, '13, 12:05 pm
Actaeon Actaeon is offline
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Default Re: Does the old testament still apply?

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Originally Posted by Tx3bro View Post
We don't stone gays like it says to and leviticus and what not,so does it still apply and if so to what extent?
To understand how the old testament continues to apply, we must consider that when the Scriptures say "the law" they do not always mean the same thing. That is to say, there are multiple KINDS of law. Let's delve into those:

1) Moral (Divine) Law. Commonly referenced as the 10 commandments (although Judeo-Christian moral teaching espouse a much wider view of the moral law), the moral law is objective law given by God. It is universal, eternal, and true.
2) The Levitical Law. This law serves two purposes. Functionally, it serves as a unitive law for humanity and gives behavioral norms. Punitively, it prescribes physical punishments for sin.
3) Rabbinic Law. This was a collection of codes by the Jewish church leadership which supplemented Levitical and/or Moral law. For example, the moral law says to honor the sabbath. Rabbinic law said that since no work could be done on the Sabbath, that even touching a tool was considered sinful.
4) Secular law. This is the law made for secular governance by the state. It is temporal, but all Christians are charged with following the valid laws of the state (render unto Caesar what is Caesar's).

As regards which of those forms of law are still in effect in the new covenant, Levitical law has been fulfilled in the Sacrifice on the cross. No longer are we required to attend to animal sacrifice for the repatriation of sins or to carry out the physical punishments of sin on those who are called to reconcile with God. Rabbinic law was NEVER valid, and Christ condemns it repeatedly. Moral law is eternal, what is moral before the sacrifice is still moral, and what was immoral before is still banned to us now (Note, this does NOT include the functional disciplines or punitive measures of levitical law). Secular law is in effect in whatever cases they apply given the considerations of time, jurisdiction, and validity.
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