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  #1  
Old Feb 20, '13, 9:16 pm
mdgspencer mdgspencer is offline
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Default " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

In 1969 Cardinal Ratzinger, who would become Pope Benedict XVI, predicted that in the future the Church will become small and destitute, a minority that will be ignored and humiliated, but that then, he predicted, the Church will find itself and arise with great power as a more spiritual and simple Church.
see http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en...cto-xvi-22434/
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  #2  
Old Feb 20, '13, 9:28 pm
mburn16 mburn16 is offline
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Default Re: "Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

In short, partly yes...partly no. The church is larger, but less influential. It faces greater external scrutiny, but compared to the hundreds of years in which it was subject to the various powers of Europe, is probably more independently secure now than at most points in history.

As for "simple"....been there, done that, for the last few decades...no good.
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  #3  
Old Feb 20, '13, 10:48 pm
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Timothy_Garber Timothy_Garber is offline
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Default Re: "Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Quote:
Originally Posted by mburn16 View Post
In short, partly yes...partly no. The church is larger, but less influential. It faces greater external scrutiny, but compared to the hundreds of years in which it was subject to the various powers of Europe, is probably more independently secure now than at most points in history.

As for "simple"....been there, done that, for the last few decades...no good.
Isn't the fact that the Church is less influential and more rediculed a sign for great decline in the Church? I'm not saying I believe then-Cardinal Ratzinger's "prophecy", but it is something that seems very likely to me.
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  #4  
Old Feb 20, '13, 11:47 pm
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Julia Mae Julia Mae is offline
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Default Re: "Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdgspencer View Post
In 1969 Cardinal Ratzinger, who would become Pope Benedict XVI, predicted that in the future the Church will become small and destitute, a minority that will be ignored and humiliated, but that then, he predicted, the Church will find itself and arise with great power as a more spiritual and simple Church.
see http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en...cto-xvi-22434/
No reason to call it "forgotten," it's very often quoted and has been since he made it.

What's interesting, I think, is to include what he said about the 3rd Secret of Fatima before Pope John Paul II decided to reveal something about it. JohnPaul II said this in 1980:
"We must prepare ourselves to suffer great trials before long, such as will demand of us a disposition to give up even life, and a total dedication to Christ and for Christ … With your and my prayer it is possible to mitigate this tribulation, but it is no longer possible to avert it, because only thus can the Church be effectively renewed. How many times has the renewal of the Church sprung from blood! This time, too, it will not be otherwise. We must be strong and prepared, and trust in Christ and His Mother, and be very, very assiduous in praying the Rosary."
Then-Cardinal Ratzinger in a 1984 interview in Jesus magazine, about the 3rd Secret of Fatima:


Quote:
"Cardinal Ratzinger, have you read what is called the Third Secret of Fatima: i.e., the one that Sister Lucia had sent to Pope John XXIII and which the latter did not wish to make known and consigned to the Vatican archives?"
"Yes, I have read it."
"Why has it not been revealed?"
"Because, according to the judgement of the Popes, it adds nothing new to what a Christian must know concerning what derives from Revelation: i.e., a radical call for conversion; the absolute importance of history; the dangers threatening the faith and the life of the Christian, and therefore of the world. And then the importance of the novissimi.
"Novissimi" is us. Add to this his re-organization of churches in the Archdiocese of Vienna.

I'm not one for turning everything into the Second Coming, but it's apparent between the mystical JPII and the extraordinarily intelligent BXVI, something of a radical change is expected. And soon. I think the Pope is resigning and has made sure there will be a youngish and very strong Pope to lead us through the next decades. I think he stays at the Vatican to make sure the new Pope understands what he believes is coming and why he believes it.

It's time for us to pray. To stop any infighting about viewpoints. To stick hard, in faith, in obedience, in humility. It's time for everyone to just come home. No matter what happens, to believe Our Lord really did want this Church to exist and will protect Her no matter what.
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  #5  
Old Feb 21, '13, 4:42 am
Monte RCMS Monte RCMS is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

The Church is guided by the Holy Spirit.
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  #6  
Old Feb 21, '13, 5:05 am
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JCnMe JCnMe is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Maybe it's just me- but I find it a little audacious for the Vatican to second guess the Blessed Mother's directions-it was meant to be revealed and should have been-perhaps a true test of devotion and service?.....it will find a way to come out at some point by Divine Intervention... that said - I hope the lightning bolt to the Vatican reminded everyone that God still speaks to us in many ways... it was not to punish or mark the end as some would like to believe...but rather to validate that by his actions Pope Benedict had broken the prophecy and changed the direction of the Church... a blessing/validation given in the form of a proverbial "lghtning bolt" that so many seem to require to believe .. Love how God works
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  #7  
Old Feb 21, '13, 5:51 am
Digitonomy Digitonomy is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Not Cardinal but Father Ratzinger at that time.
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  #8  
Old Feb 21, '13, 8:44 am
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CarolNoel CarolNoel is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Interesting. Have not come across this before. Thanks for the thread.
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  #9  
Old Feb 21, '13, 9:43 am
Tigg Tigg is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Quote:
Originally Posted by JCnMe View Post
Maybe it's just me- but I find it a little audacious for the Vatican to second guess the Blessed Mother's directions-it was meant to be revealed and should have been-perhaps a true test of devotion and service?.....it will find a way to come out at some point by Divine Intervention...
I agree with this - who can circumvent God?
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  #10  
Old Feb 21, '13, 9:46 am
Tigg Tigg is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monte RCMS View Post
The Church is guided by the Holy Spirit.
This is certainly true, but "Your ways are not My ways, says the Lord." As more secularism and atheism descend upon us, as we see with our own eyes what is happening internally with the Church, as we learn of more and more heresy and even apostasy, we need to discern now more than ever. God might just allow us further and greater suffering before the purification of His Church becomes a reality. I don't see hearts converting in droves, nor long confession lines, nor the Adoration chapels full. In the end, Mary's Immaculate Heart will triumph but no one knows what we will pass through until that time.
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  #11  
Old Feb 21, '13, 5:17 pm
unafraid unafraid is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

What is real is evident; what is evident is real. Read Chapter Two: Article 7 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It contains the same prophetic information as that which was given by Our Lady of Fatima.

I think then Cardinal Ratzinger was alluding to that fact in his response to the question. Of course , he has lived through the evolution of these things in subsequent years , so his appreciation and understanding of them is obviously more acute now.

He appears to be acting out his role in this unfolding cosmic drama as though he were a man operating under a mystical directive. His calm during this resignation period seems almost preternatural.

Pope Benedict XVI has said that he is entrusting the fate of the Church into the hands of its true master : Jesus Christ. We must all do the same.
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  #12  
Old Feb 21, '13, 7:12 pm
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Julia Mae Julia Mae is offline
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Default Re: " Cardinal Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Quote:
Originally Posted by unafraid View Post
What is real is evident; what is evident is real. Read Chapter Two: Article 7 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church. It contains the same prophetic information as that which was given by Our Lady of Fatima.

I think then Cardinal Ratzinger was alluding to that fact in his response to the question. Of course , he has lived through the evolution of these things in subsequent years , so his appreciation and understanding of them is obviously more acute now.

He appears to be acting out his role in this unfolding cosmic drama as though he were a man operating under a mystical directive. His calm during this resignation period seems almost preternatural.

Pope Benedict XVI has said that he is entrusting the fate of the Church into the hands of its true master : Jesus Christ. We must all do the same.
I agree with you, but I think you meant "supernatural" - which normally I would not point out, but some on this forum use it to mean from a diabolical origin and I don't think you meant that at all.

Quote:
The preternatural or praeternatural is that which appears outside or beside (Latin præter) the natural. In contrast to the supernatural, preternatural phenomena are presumed to have rational explanations that are unknown.[1]

The term is often used to distinguish from the divine (supernatural) while maintaining a distinction from what is known and understood.
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  #13  
Old Feb 21, '13, 7:24 pm
Megan7 Megan7 is offline
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Lightbulb Re: "Ratzinger's Forgotten Prophecy on the Future of the Church"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Julia Mae View Post
No reason to call it "forgotten," it's very often quoted and has been since he made it.

What's interesting, I think, is to include what he said about the 3rd Secret of Fatima before Pope John Paul II decided to reveal something about it. JohnPaul II said this in 1980:
"We must prepare ourselves to suffer great trials before long, such as will demand of us a disposition to give up even life, and a total dedication to Christ and for Christ … With your and my prayer it is possible to mitigate this tribulation, but it is no longer possible to avert it, because only thus can the Church be effectively renewed. How many times has the renewal of the Church sprung from blood! This time, too, it will not be otherwise. We must be strong and prepared, and trust in Christ and His Mother, and be very, very assiduous in praying the Rosary."
Then-Cardinal Ratzinger in a 1984 interview in Jesus magazine, about the 3rd Secret of Fatima:




"Novissimi" is us. Add to this his re-organization of churches in the Archdiocese of Vienna.

I'm not one for turning everything into the Second Coming, but it's apparent between the mystical JPII and the extraordinarily intelligent BXVI, something of a radical change is expected. And soon. I think the Pope is resigning and has made sure there will be a youngish and very strong Pope to lead us through the next decades. I think he stays at the Vatican to make sure the new Pope understands what he believes is coming and why he believes it.

It's time for us to pray. To stop any infighting about viewpoints. To stick hard, in faith, in obedience, in humility. It's time for everyone to just come home. No matter what happens, to believe Our Lord really did want this Church to exist and will protect Her no matter what.

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