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View Poll Results: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False?
Yes 8 42.11%
No 7 36.84%
Other 4 21.05%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old Oct 1, '05, 12:55 am
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Default Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

...and does it conflict with orthodoxy?
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  #2  
Old Oct 1, '05, 12:58 am
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Yes = True
No = False

...just in case.
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  #3  
Old Oct 1, '05, 1:06 am
HagiaSophia HagiaSophia is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

What documentary? What hypothesis?
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  #4  
Old Oct 1, '05, 2:08 am
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

I recommend reading the following article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Documentary_Hypothesis

From the article:

"The documentary hypothesis is a theory proposed by many historians and academics in the field of linguistics and source criticism that the Five Books of Moses (the Torah) are in fact a combination of documents from different sources rather than authored by one individual. Although the hypothesis is widely accepted, it has a substantial number of critics—especially conservative Bible scholars such as Kenneth Kitchen and Gleason Archer, but also among critical scholars such as R. N. Whybray."

Also, I recommend the book Who Wrote the Bible? by Richard Elliott Friedman.
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  #5  
Old Oct 1, '05, 2:16 am
HagiaSophia HagiaSophia is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

I should like to recommend that when you set up a poll that you be a bit clearer on precisely what it is you are asking about.
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  #6  
Old Oct 1, '05, 2:56 am
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

I was perfectly clear.

I am looking for educated opinions. If you don't know anything about the Documentary Hypothesis, then don't respond. What good is a person's opinion if he does not know anything about the matter? Not much.
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  #7  
Old Oct 1, '05, 4:51 am
thistle thistle is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkal
I was perfectly clear.

I am looking for educated opinions. If you don't know anything about the Documentary Hypothesis, then don't respond. What good is a person's opinion if he does not know anything about the matter? Not much.
You are a very arrogant person!! True or False!!
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  #8  
Old Oct 1, '05, 11:27 am
TOME TOME is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

I have to say in principle that the Documentary Hypothesis is True. I believe that scholars using all the literary, historical and archeologicals at their disposal have developed a reasonable theory with the standard explanation using the JEPD models. I believe there is enough evidence to support this.

I am really going to have to read up on the criticism of this theory, however, from what I do remember people's attacks on this theory almost always goes to specific points and rejects the whole principle. For example, and this is just a made up example, if those who held that certain passages were from the E source based on what was know at the time, if later evidence is developed that shows this particular passage has a different source, then what was believe to be fact wasn't but that doesn't mean that the principles which lead to this faulty conclusion were in themselves wrong, it has more to do with the data upon which these principles were applied.

In other words, those who reject this theory, especially those who take a literal approach to the Bible, fail to comprehend that Scriptural Studies, like all studies in history and science is a dynamic reality, which is always growing or deeping in its understandings but always guided by basic principles.
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  #9  
Old Oct 1, '05, 2:52 pm
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thistle
You are a very arrogant person!! True or False!!
Why am I arrogant?

I also made available the option 'Other' for a person who wanted to explain why in a post.
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  #10  
Old Oct 1, '05, 2:54 pm
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Join Date: June 23, 2004
Posts: 213
Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TOME
I have to say in principle that the Documentary Hypothesis is True. I believe that scholars using all the literary, historical and archeologicals at their disposal have developed a reasonable theory with the standard explanation using the JEPD models. I believe there is enough evidence to support this.

I am really going to have to read up on the criticism of this theory, however, from what I do remember people's attacks on this theory almost always goes to specific points and rejects the whole principle. For example, and this is just a made up example, if those who held that certain passages were from the E source based on what was know at the time, if later evidence is developed that shows this particular passage has a different source, then what was believe to be fact wasn't but that doesn't mean that the principles which lead to this faulty conclusion were in themselves wrong, it has more to do with the data upon which these principles were applied.

In other words, those who reject this theory, especially those who take a literal approach to the Bible, fail to comprehend that Scriptural Studies, like all studies in history and science is a dynamic reality, which is always growing or deeping in its understandings but always guided by basic principles.

Thank you very much for your input. I also want to read the critics of the Documentary Hypothesis. I have read summations of their beliefs, but nothing in great detail. I know a lot of them have orthodox beliefs but there are some critical scholars out there that disagree. They are in the minority, though.

But what about my other question? Does the Four-Source theory conflict with orthodoxy?
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  #11  
Old Oct 1, '05, 4:26 pm
Joe Kelley Joe Kelley is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkal
I was perfectly clear.

I am looking for educated opinions. If you don't know anything about the Documentary Hypothesis, then don't respond. What good is a person's opinion if he does not know anything about the matter? Not much.
I take it you have a low opinion of elections and their outcomes.
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I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse; therefore choose life, that you and your descendants may live,
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  #12  
Old Oct 1, '05, 5:41 pm
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

I think that these are two different matters. I think one need only a surface knowledge of the candidates and issues of a certain election for a vote to be reasonable. However, in academic matters, a surface knowledge of the issue is not good enough for your opinon to be really valuable.

And please do not roll your eyes at me like a 13 year old girl when or if you think that my beliefs and opinions do not align with yours. Is this a mature response?
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  #13  
Old Oct 1, '05, 6:17 pm
Gottle of Geer Gottle of Geer is offline
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Smile Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkal
...and does it conflict with orthodoxy?
Other - since hypotheses can be valid or not, but not true or not, as only a direct statement can be true, or not. Too many statements, of differing logical status, make up too many forms of the Documentary Hypothesis, for it - they - to be true or false. It's like asking "Do wheels have spokes ?" - there is too much detail to allow for a simple, straightforward no/yes answer.
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  #14  
Old Oct 1, '05, 6:35 pm
clarkal clarkal is offline
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Join Date: June 23, 2004
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Default Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gottle of Geer
Other - since hypotheses can be valid or not, but not true or not, as only a direct statement can be true, or not. Too many statements, of differing logical status, make up too many forms of the Documentary Hypothesis, for it - they - to be true or false. It's like asking "Do wheels have spokes ?" - there is too much detail to allow for a simple, straightforward no/yes answer.
Thanks for your input.
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  #15  
Old Oct 1, '05, 6:38 pm
Gottle of Geer Gottle of Geer is offline
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Smile Re: Documentary Hypothesis: True or False, and...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkal
Thank you very much for your input. I also want to read the critics of the Documentary Hypothesis. I have read summations of their beliefs, but nothing in great detail.
Then you will never be able to understand it properly. Some issues can't be skimmed, if we want to understand why people make the judgements about them that they do.

Would people really understand Catholicism, if they read only the critics of it ? If not - why read only the critics of those who hold this or that form of the DH (of which there is more than one ?)

A survey of positions can be found in the English translation of Claus Westermann's commentary on Genesis 1 - 11; trans. John J. Scullion SJ (Minneapolis: Augsburg Publishing House, 1974)



https://www.eisenbrauns.com/ECOM/_1ML183XMN.HTM

Quote:
I know a lot of them have orthodox beliefs but there are some critical scholars out there that disagree. They are in the minority, though.

But what about my other question? Does the Four-Source theory conflict with orthodoxy?
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