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  #1  
Old Jul 10, '13, 12:55 am
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Elizium23 Elizium23 is offline
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Default Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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A faith-based group opposed to the Boy Scouts recent decision to allow gay youth to join has formed their own program for kids and teens in response — but they will also let gay youth and adults participate, leaders said Tuesday.

While the program, which doesn’t yet have a name, will allow gays, it won’t let them “flaunt” it, said John Stemberger, founder of OnMyHonor.net, a coalition opposed to the BSA’s vote in late May to change the controversial membership policy.

“We don’t think sex and politics should be in a program for kids. Those are issues for parents,”said Stemberger, of Orlando, Fla., who left the Boy Scouts along with his two sons over the decision in May.
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  #2  
Old Jul 10, '13, 12:59 am
SMGS127 SMGS127 is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

So let me get this straight. They're upset over allowing gay youth into the organization. So in response, they make their own organization that allows gay youth, also allow gay adults, then argue that they're fulfilling a better faith mission against homosexual conduct in their youth program. Sounds more like a money thing than a morally-guided approach.

Personally, I don't mind allowing celibate gay kids to join the Boy Scouts. It'll be better for their growth as men to learn about chastity from a Catholic group. But this sounds like opportunism to me.
  #3  
Old Jul 10, '13, 6:09 am
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Cider Cider is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

Ya, I don't get it either. What's the point here? It doesn't sound like they are doing anything significantly different than BSA.
  #4  
Old Jul 10, '13, 6:37 am
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

Why should the Boy Scouts be able to hold a monopoly in the field of training kids upon social standards? Like it's an elitist society or something..?

...there can be alternatives.
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  #5  
Old Jul 10, '13, 6:45 am
SamH SamH is offline
 
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by TEPO View Post
Why should the Boy Scouts be able to hold a monopoly in the field of training kids upon social standards? Like it's an elitist society or something..?

...there can be alternatives.
Like the parents?


Who says they hold a monopoly? Personally I'd never send a child to Boy or Girls Scouts. 4H is a much better organization.
  #6  
Old Jul 10, '13, 6:45 am
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by Cider View Post
Ya, I don't get it either. What's the point here? It doesn't sound like they are doing anything significantly different than BSA.
"However, the organization’s membership policy would focus on sexual purity rather than orientation."

“We will be distinctly different from the Boy Scouts although there will be some similarities, for example, rank advancements that have been earned within the BSA will be transferable.”

...so they're not that different at all, except that sexuality and politics would be excluded.
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religion is the highest school of thought. It isnt a security blanket -it is a platform that allows us to reach beyond the restrictiveness of science, politics and philosophy. There is no other framework of logic that can reach farther.
  #7  
Old Jul 10, '13, 6:52 am
CradleJourney CradleJourney is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by TEPO View Post
"However, the organization’s membership policy would focus on sexual purity rather than orientation."

“We will be distinctly different from the Boy Scouts although there will be some similarities, for example, rank advancements that have been earned within the BSA will be transferable.”

...so they're not that different at all, except that sexuality and politics would be excluded.
Which, to me as a parent who's "in the trenches" so to speak, makes no real difference since sexuality and politics are not present in my son's troop ... silly skits and pitiful puns are the norm
  #8  
Old Jul 10, '13, 6:53 am
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by SamH View Post
Like the parents?


Who says they hold a monopoly? Personally I'd never send a child to Boy or Girls Scouts. 4H is a much better organization.
4H always seemed interesting to me growing up. But I'll admit I started off in cub scouts and then found my passion in school sports and just stuck with that.
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  #9  
Old Jul 10, '13, 7:03 am
CradleJourney CradleJourney is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by SamH View Post
Like the parents?


Who says they hold a monopoly? Personally I'd never send a child to Boy or Girls Scouts. 4H is a much better organization.
Personally I think it depends on the individual child, the leaders of a particular chapter, and most importantly how involved the local parents are. The 4H program here either very limited or very disorganized (I still don't understand it though I've tried). Meanwhile, our parish has a very active scout troop and I've found the program really caters to my middle sons personality - it's the chance for him to set fires, do experiments, shoot things, climb things, get dirty, stay outside, make jokes, sing ridiculous songs, build things, compete in contests and learn nifty things like respect and responsibility.
  #10  
Old Jul 10, '13, 7:08 am
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by CradleJourney View Post
Which, to me as a parent who's "in the trenches" so to speak, makes no real difference since sexuality and politics are not present in my son's troop ... silly skits and pitiful puns are the norm
But it's still a 'World Organization' and if its core values on that level have made public that they've progressed toward a more controversial way then perhaps the leadership has overstepped its boundaries?

Exactly who runs Scouts anyways..? http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World...Scout_Movement
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  #11  
Old Jul 10, '13, 7:17 am
CradleJourney CradleJourney is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by TEPO View Post
But it's still an 'International Organization' and if its core values on that level have made public that they've progressed toward a more controversial way then perhaps the leadership has overstepped its boundaries?

Exactly who runs Scouts anyways..? http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World...Scout_Movement
I followed your link and didn't see anything disturbing? It says "The mission of WOSM is "to contribute to the education of young people, through a value system based on the Scout Promise and Scout Law, to help build a better world where people are self-fulfilled as individuals and play a constructive role in society"

Scout Law - A Scout is
trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous,
kind, obedient, cheerful,
thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent.

I don't have any problems with that. For space, I'll skip copying the Scout Promise, but I don't have any problems with that either.

If you mean that they decided to let homosexual boys join - well, so does the Catholic Church. If you mean individuals, including some leaders, in the organization are not living up to the ideals of the organization, and that they may be behaving in a manner not consistent with those ideals - well, that happens in the Catholic Church as well.

So I'm not trying to be contrary - I just don't see the problem?
  #12  
Old Jul 10, '13, 7:21 am
Prodigal_Son Prodigal_Son is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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"However, the organization’s membership policy would focus on sexual purity rather than orientation."
OK, honestly I haven't looked at any other material on their site. But this is important.

This is EXACTLY what the whole Boy Scout mess is ignoring. They conflate sexual orientation with sexual activity. It is possible to have sexual holiness despite a homosexual orientation. Thus, it is possible to be an excellent Boy Scout leader despite being homosexual.

Or do people's temptations control their destiny? Which one is it?
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  #13  
Old Jul 10, '13, 7:45 am
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Sailor Kenshin Sailor Kenshin is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by SMGS127 View Post
So let me get this straight. They're upset over allowing gay youth into the organization. So in response, they make their own organization that allows gay youth, also allow gay adults, then argue that they're fulfilling a better faith mission against homosexual conduct in their youth program. Sounds more like a money thing than a morally-guided approach.

Personally, I don't mind allowing celibate gay kids to join the Boy Scouts. It'll be better for their growth as men to learn about chastity from a Catholic group. But this sounds like opportunism to me.
Please --- and I am in no way criticising either the OP or yourself---stop referring to homosexuality as 'gay.' That word means light, carefree, joyous, frivolous, and there is nothing GAY about homosexuality.
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  #14  
Old Jul 10, '13, 8:08 am
Prodigal_Son Prodigal_Son is offline
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by CradleJourney View Post
If you mean individuals, including some leaders, in the organization are not living up to the ideals of the organization, and that they may be behaving in a manner not consistent with those ideals - well, that happens in the Catholic Church as well.
This brings up an interesting point. In the Boy Scouts, if a Boy Scout leader is living with a woman he is not married to, is he fired? In order to be consistent, shouldn't he be? Or am I missing something?
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  #15  
Old Jul 10, '13, 8:26 am
SamH SamH is offline
 
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Default Re: Faith-based group starting alternative to Boy Scouts — will allow gay youth, adults

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Originally Posted by Prodigal_Son View Post
This brings up an interesting point. In the Boy Scouts, if a Boy Scout leader is living with a woman he is not married to, is he fired? In order to be consistent, shouldn't he be? Or am I missing something?
Boy Scout leaders get paid?
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