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  #1  
Old Feb 24, '14, 7:50 am
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Casilda Casilda is offline
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Default Archdiocese vs Diocese?

Is the difference that the former is headed by an archbishop? Would that also mean that it has more parishes within it? Better organized?

I learned that the diocese adjacent to mine is indeed an archdiocese. We visited the cathedral there, even though it is an hour and a half away.
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  #2  
Old Feb 24, '14, 8:42 am
xzereus xzereus is offline
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

An Archdiocese is a (1) large diocese or (2) diocese with some historic importance. It is not an Archdiocese because it is headed by an Archbishop. Rather, the bishop is an Archbishop because he is in charge of an Archdiocese.
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Old Feb 24, '14, 9:12 am
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

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Originally Posted by xzereus View Post
An Archdiocese is a (1) large diocese or (2) diocese with some historic importance. It is not an Archdiocese because it is headed by an Archbishop. Rather, the bishop is an Archbishop because he is in charge of an Archdiocese.
This. Also a diocese is suffragen to a metropolitan (archdiocese). In our Archdiocese of Galveston-Houston, there are 7 surrfagen dioceses. (Austin, Beaumont, Brownsville, Corpus Christi, Tyler, and Victoria). It's not like a corporate reporting relationship but the metropolitan has some coordinating responsibilities.
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  #4  
Old Feb 24, '14, 10:12 am
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

In addition to what has been said, it is not always the case that bigger dioceses are all archdioceses. For example, the Archdiocese of Washington D.C. is an archdiocese and has about 500,000 Catholics. The Diocese of Pittsburgh is "just" a regular diocese, but has about 800,000 Catholics.

If you look at the handy dandy chart on Wikipedia, they color code the 32 provinces in the United States. Each province has one metropolitan archdiocese and several suffragan dioceses. You'll notice that many of the divisions pretty much follow state lines.

Here is the section from Canon Law that speaks of "metropolitans" (AKA "archbishops"):

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P1J.HTM
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  #5  
Old Feb 24, '14, 11:13 am
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UpUpAndAway UpUpAndAway is offline
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

While all metropolitans are archbishops, not all archbishops are metropolitans. The two terms are not synonymous. For example, the archdiocese I live in, Lille, has a suffragan archdiocese, Cambrai—until 2008 this relationship worked the other way around. The archbishop of Lille is the provincial metropolitan while the archbishop of Cambrai, well, isn't.
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Old Feb 24, '14, 11:21 am
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

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Originally Posted by UpUpAndAway View Post
While all metropolitans are archbishops, not all archbishops are metropolitans. The two terms are not synonymous. For example, the archdiocese I live in, Lille, has a suffragan archdiocese, Cambrai—until 2008 this relationship worked the other way around. The archbishop of Lille is the provincial metropolitan while the archbishop of Cambrai, well, isn't.
Good point. It's not an exact correlation. There are exceptions. I should have qualified that.
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The more I follow the online discussions ... the more I follow the debates and disagreements in the Church about administrative unity, or the concerns expressed about the moral or personal or administrative or leadership failings of the bishops or the clergy, the more I become convinced that whatever might be the truth of these concerns, ALL of this is simply a distraction. No, it’s more than that. It’s a justification, an excuse, for not helping each other and those outside the Church fall in love with Jesus Christ. How easy it is to talk about everything, but about Jesus hardly at all.

- Fr. Gregory Jensen
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  #7  
Old Feb 24, '14, 1:24 pm
Aramis Aramis is offline
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Casilda View Post
Is the difference that the former is headed by an archbishop? Would that also mean that it has more parishes within it? Better organized?

I learned that the diocese adjacent to mine is indeed an archdiocese. We visited the cathedral there, even though it is an hour and a half away.
Fundamentally, yes, the difference is that the Archbishop is the bishop of the Archdiocese.

Most Archdioceses are also the seat of an ecclesiastical province - a group of 2 or more dioceses (including the archdiocese). The Archbishop has some oversight responsibility for the other dioceses (called suffragan dioceses). Note that the Archdiocese itself doesn't oversee the other dioceses, but it's archbishop does.
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  #8  
Old Feb 24, '14, 1:29 pm
Aramis Aramis is offline
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UpUpAndAway View Post
While all metropolitans are archbishops, not all archbishops are metropolitans. The two terms are not synonymous. For example, the archdiocese I live in, Lille, has a suffragan archdiocese, Cambrai—until 2008 this relationship worked the other way around. The archbishop of Lille is the provincial metropolitan while the archbishop of Cambrai, well, isn't.
Actually, no, not all metropolitans are - the Metropolitan office can be given to a bishop in the Byzantine rite without being an Archbishop. The metropolitan would still "rule" an archeparchy.

Remember - there are 22+ autonomous churches united under the pope - not all run with the same structure as Rome (tho' the Romans constitute about 98% of the Catholic faithful at present).
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  #9  
Old Feb 25, '14, 3:28 am
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aramis View Post
Actually, no, not all metropolitans are - the Metropolitan office can be given to a bishop in the Byzantine rite without being an Archbishop. The metropolitan would still "rule" an archeparchy.

Remember - there are 22+ autonomous churches united under the pope - not all run with the same structure as Rome (tho' the Romans constitute about 98% of the Catholic faithful at present).
My turn to say "good point" I know very little about Eastern Catholicism so tend not to address it in my responses, though I never lay that disclaimer out like I've seen others do. My bad.

But thanks for calling my attention to this. I was unaware this is possible in the Eastern Churches. I'll go to bed less ignorant tonight

Do any such arrangements—metropolitan bishop responsible for an archeparchy—currently exist?
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  #10  
Old Feb 25, '14, 8:18 am
Aramis Aramis is offline
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

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Originally Posted by UpUpAndAway View Post
My turn to say "good point" I know very little about Eastern Catholicism so tend not to address it in my responses, though I never lay that disclaimer out like I've seen others do. My bad.

But thanks for calling my attention to this. I was unaware this is possible in the Eastern Churches. I'll go to bed less ignorant tonight

Do any such arrangements—metropolitan bishop responsible for an archeparchy—currently exist?
To my knowledge, not in communion with Rome at present. In the Greek tradition, however, Metropolitan is the title for any bishop of an ancient see, whether or not he is also the head of a synod, and the Greek Greek Catholics (no, that's not a redundancy) may have the same.

The Eastern Churches may also replace the term bishop with eparch, diocese with eparchy, archbishop with archeparch, and archdiocese with archeparchy. The terms are true synonyms.

Also note: Most of the Byzantines don't refer to the Metropolitan Archbishops by Archbishop, but by Metropolitan. So the Ruthenian Metropolitan Archeparch William Skurla is referred to as "Our Most Reverend Metropolitan William" in the liturgical commemorations.
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  #11  
Old Feb 27, '14, 7:13 pm
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

I would also add that some archbishops have no see of their own, other than a titular see. They serve in administrative functions of the Holy See, or are papal nuncios to some countries. I think all archbishops receive the pallium, which I believe is a symbol of their special teaching responsibility, even if they never are ordinary of a diocese. They continue to be archbishops even if they retire or their archdiocese no longer exists. It is a lifetime designation. It is not specific to a specific job assignment or local church. That is a significant difference between Catholic and most Protestant leadership.
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  #12  
Old Feb 28, '14, 12:47 am
Aramis Aramis is offline
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Default Re: Archdiocese vs Diocese?

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I would also add that some archbishops have no see of their own, other than a titular see. They serve in administrative functions of the Holy See, or are papal nuncios to some countries. I think all archbishops receive the pallium, which I believe is a symbol of their special teaching responsibility, even if they never are ordinary of a diocese. They continue to be archbishops even if they retire or their archdiocese no longer exists. It is a lifetime designation. It is not specific to a specific job assignment or local church. That is a significant difference between Catholic and most Protestant leadership.
The Pallium is the sign of Metropolitan Authority within the Roman Church. It is historically occasionally given to non-metropolitan bishops, but that's not current practice. Further, except at the mass it is given at, it may only be worn in one's own province (if a metropolitan archbishop) or see (if a bishop). Or so note both the old Catholic Encyclopedia and also Inside the Vatican.

There is no direct equivalent in the eastern churches, but it's worth noting that the Omophorion of the Byzantines and the Syrian Batrashil are both related to the same prototypical garment, and similar in meaning. In fact, if one looks at the Pallium of HH Benedict, it was nearly identical in form to a Classic Byzantine Great Omophorion. But all byzantine bishops wear the Omophorion, and IIUC, all syrian bishops the Batrashil.
Note that there are 3 forms for the omophorion - The classical one - called the "Great Omophorion" - very much like a long stole, worn like HH Benedict wore the Pallium, but usually a bit wider; The Short Omophorion, worn around the neck, much like a roman priest's stole, but over the vestments; and the "Y-shaped" ones, which are a stylized variation upon the Great Omophorion, and worn in the same circumstances.
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