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Old Nov 1, '05, 2:16 pm
javelin javelin is offline
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Default Re: A "Very" Catholic Court?

Originally Posted by utica
First, though, you need to overturn Roe. As long as Roe stands it has to be used as the Constitutional standard for when life begins.

Right now, Congress can't pass a law that says that personhood begins at conception because Roe states that this is not necessarily the case.
I'm not sure about this. I think Congress could pass a law stating that life begins at conception. Actually, I think that law (or some other such legislation challenging Roe) would need to happen first. That would provide the SC the opportunity to rule on the constitutionality of the new law in light of the Roe decision's precedent. The new ruling could contain language that essentially overturns Roe. I don't think the SC can overturn a previous decision without a case before it that challenges the precedent.

Originally Posted by utica
What I'm not sure of is where States rights would come into play. For example, could Congress pass a law stating that capital punishment is crule and unusual? I doubt that this would be constitutional.
Yeah, I don't know how all this works, either. If people are going from state to state to procure abortions, the federal government could potentially step in using their power to regulate interstate commerce. The feds could also take jurisdiction if the SC decision overturning Roe appealed to rights ensured by the U.S. Constitution. If the SC simply throws Roe out the window without establishing Constitutional precedent to replace it, it would indeed go back to the states.

If that happens, I think Congress would act to establish a national policy, hoping that the SC would uphold it. We seriously do not need the mayhem that would be created if it were left completely up to the states.

I think in some ways we forget that a lot of this is happening already. In states that restrict abortions or have notification laws still standing, people can (and do) go to other states to have abortions and avoid the laws of their home state.

That's just my opinion, and I am no legal expert.

Old Nov 1, '05, 2:45 pm
Brain Brain is offline
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Default Re: A "Very" Catholic Court?

in considering this catholic majority thing. I now belive that any effort to oppose Alito is directly or indirectly caused by oppositions to catholics. It would be intolerant and discriminatory to not give him a fair shake just because of his religion, right?
come on guys lets play the descrmination card!
Two men please God--who serves Him with all his heart because he knows Him; who seeks Him with all his heart because he knows Him not.
--Nikita Ivanovich Panin
Old Nov 1, '05, 3:38 pm
miguel miguel is offline
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Default Re: A "Very" Catholic Court?

Originally Posted by utica
Miguel, I don't think the Constitution actually states when personhood begins or when it ends.
It does give a clue about intent:
Originally Posted by Amendment XIV
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Person was used to draw a distinction between the status of citizens and non-citizens, generously extending equal protection even to non-citizens. Blackmun used the word in reverse, to deny equal protection to a specific group. It's important to note that this Amendment came on the heels of the civil war. It clarified the legal status of the newly freed slaves...kind of ironic how they twisted it 100 years later to narrow its scope.
Originally Posted by utica
In writing for the court, Justice Blackmun actually goes to great lengths to look at the historical consideration of when personhood begins.
He ignored the laws on the books protecting the unborn. Apparently the historical reasoning behind those laws didn't matter. The great lengths he went to was a pretense to ignore the only fact that matters, life begins at conception. This was well known in 1973.
Originally Posted by utica
Although, I guess another way to come at it is the way the Magisterium does. Since there is no empircal evidence for when personhood begins, we must assume that it may begin at conception. ( At least I think that's what the Magesterium teaches)
Combine church teaching with the biological facts, you can't go wrong.

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