1000 year reign and the catholic church


#1

Has the catholic church denied the fact that there will be no 1000 year reign of Jesus on earth or just that it cannot be safely taught?

Thanks.


#2

The Catholic Church interprets the thousand year reign of Christ as symbolic language for a long/indefinite period of time occuring right now.
The Church on earth, governed by the Vicar of Christ, the keeper of the keys of “the kindom”(Mt16:18-19) is the tousand year reign of Christ on earth-It’s the Catholic Church. (Not literal 1000 years-since it’s already been over 2000).


#3

I stated this in another thread

As far as the millenium, whether or not there will be a actual millenium where Jesus rules and reigns from Davids throne in Jerusalem, depends on the belief that God will or will not restore the nation of Israel.

Correct me if Im wrong, but catholic teaching says that the church is the fulfillment of Israel. But then what to do about prophecies like Zecariah 14, Joel 3, etc.?

If you look at the OT prophecies of the restoration of Israel, both the land and the people, even in their disbelief; they all match up perfectly to the prophecy of end times Jesus tells John to write down in Revelations.

Zech.14 talks abouts when the Lord will come and reign, in Jerusalem! In Revelation5:5, Jesus is called “…the Lion from the tribe of Judah, the Root of David,…” Verse 6 goes on by John seeing “a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain,…” Reading from Zechariah, he will definately come back to Jerusalem as a Lion, and all those will see him who they have pierced when he came as the Lamb the first time.(Zech12:11)

Moving on in Zech14, the prophecy says the survivors from all nations that have attacked Jerusalem will go up YEAR after YEAR to worship the King, the Lord Almighty, and to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles.

Joel 3 talks about the nations judged when he comes back. The prophecy in verse 2 states that God will enter judgement against those nations concerning “…my inheritence, my people Israel, for they scattered my people among the nations and divided up my land.” Now I know the church are Gods people, but Jesus sent his disciples out to be his witness in Jerusalem and to all the ends of the earth.(Acts1:8) Persecution of his church is the perfect exercise for it, for we see all throughout the book of Acts that when persecution came, the church moved on to proclaim the gospel. But we can see all throughtout history and from scripture how the Israelites were scattered. Looking at the prophecy of God in Joel , we see John wrote down in Revelations20:4 that he saw thrones and those that sat on them that had been given authority to judge at the start of the millenium.

Anyways, if one doesnt believe the nation of Israel will be fully restored, then prophecy written in scripture becomes very confusing, especially when the word “church” replaces “Israel”. The nations never “scattered” the church from its “land.”

Looking at the 1000 years in Revelations and comparing it to Gods other prophecies written down, there is good evidence from scripture this will be a real reign of the King of Israel on earth for 1000 years, and the entire world will receive a sabbath’s rest.


#4

This is not at all convincing or persuasive. Apocalyptic writing is very difficult to understand and interpret. For the sake of understanding the book of Revelation and other end times prophecies it is worth studying the rest of the NT. Jesus propehsied to the apostles about the destruction of Jerusalem and the end times in Matthew 24. This set of passages has sometimes been referred to as the “little apocalypse.” Jesus does not give the impression that he will be returning for a literal 1000 year reign on earth.

1 Thessalonians 4 also speaks of Jesus return but there is no indication that Jesus is returning for 1000 year reign on earth. Instead, Jesus returns for the final judgment. In this narrative it is made clear that the “dead will rise first”[see verse 15]. We know from John 6:39 that Jesus will raise up the just “on the last day.” Likewise, in John 11:24 Martha acknowledges that Lazarus will be raised up on the “last day.”

It is clear from these passages that Jesus will be returning on the last day which is the day of judgment. Jesus will not be returning for a physical 1000 year reign on earth.


#5

Decree of the Holy Office dated July 21, 1944:

"In recent times on several occasions, this Supreme Sacred Congregation of the Holy Office has been asked what must be thought of the system of mitigated Millenarianism, which teaches, for example, that Christ the Lord before the final judgment, whether or not preceded by the resurrection of the many just, will come visibly to rule over this world.

“The answer is: The system of mitigated Millenarianism cannot be taught safely.”

Why would they say it could not be safely taught if it wasn’t an erroneous theory? How much clearer can they be?


#6

So will “the last day”, or “the day of the Lord” be a 24 hour period? Well, from reading all of Gods prophecy concerning his coming back, it would appear that the answer is no. But if one says the church is Israel, then they can state that Gods prophecy written in scripture is “too difficult” to discern or many layers of understanding that mystics can only expound on. So then that train of thought will lead to the day of the Lord and all that will happen in it will occur within 24 hrs or less.

We look back on the messianic prophecies and ask ourselfs “How did some of the Israelites miss this?” So looking back on the messianic prophecies concerning Jesus, how easy to understand it was in those prophecies, they all happened exactly like it was foretold.

Why not his prophecies, especially those of his coming, the restoration of Israel, and the judgement of this evil world. Now i know there are metaphors and allegorical descriptions in the book of Revelations, but come on, a 1000 year reign, wheter or not you want to believe in that long of a reign, there is no denying by looking at Gods other prophecies, he will rule and reign in Jerusalem on king Davids throne.


#7

You have convinced yourself, but I remain unpersuaded.


#8

Go read Acts 1-3, show me where the church has replaced Israel. The disciples asked Jesus if he at that time was going to restore the kingdom of Israel. Jesus never rebuked them for thinking such a thought. He never corrected them by saying something like the church is now Israel. Jesus even backs up the disciples understanding about the restoration of Israel by stating it is not for them to know the times of dates the Father has set by his own authority.

Peter addresses the crowds with scriptures of prophecy, concerning Jesus, why he suffered and his coming back. Peter addresses the crowds as “men of israel” and calls God the “God of Abraham, Issac, and Jacob.” Peter tells the crowds that David was a prophet and that David knew God made an oath to him to put one of his decendants on his throne.

I love this verse in Acts3:21. Peter told those Israelites “He must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.”

WOW! A restoration! This is 2000 years ago and Peter refers to these prophecies as spoken of a long time ago.

So tell me how prophecies like Zech14 or Joel 3 are fulfilled or at least what is contained in those prophecies can all happen within a 24 hour interpretation of the day of the Lord?


#9

Well, if Peter was the first pope, the vicar of messiah, he spoke of a restoration(Acts3:21) yet to happen that was foretold in the prophets.

And we can see in Acts2:41 that God showed a glimpse of his restoration of Israel. Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about 3000 were added to their number that day. Compare this to the 3000 that were lost in Exodus32:28, and it is easy to see that God is most merciful and accepting to those who repent of their ways and are baptised in Jesus name.(Acts2:38)


#10

Who says the Church has “replaced” Israel? Those are your words which no one here, and especially not the Church, has said.

You yourself stated it correctly the first time: the Church is the **fulfillment **of Israel: it’s completion and it’s fullness.


#11

The Church has NOT replaced Israel, Mr. Van Impe.

The Church is the culmination of Israel, what Israel set out to be.

Those who chose to follow the Messiah (Catholics) are Israel. Those who didn’t become that Great Harlot. Read the book of revelaton not according to heretics, but according to Catholics.

Ken


#12

The fall of Adam and Eve wreaked havoc on man through the inheritance of original sin. Likewise, it had a negative impact on the whole of nature and the earth. Death came into the world.

In 2 Peter 3:11 it says that “we ought to be leading lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set ablaze and dissolved, and the elements will melt with fire…in accordance with his promise, we wait for new heavens and a new earth, where rightousness is at home.” Peter is speaking of the last day when the final trumpet sounds. This is when the restoration takes place by giving us a new heaven and a new earth.

This is reiterated in a similar fashion in Rev 21:1-4 which says:

“Then I saw a new heaven and new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, 'See, the home of God is among mortals. He will dwell with them; they will be his peoples, and God himself will be with them; he will wipe every tear from their eyes. Death will be no more.”

This is the restoration where all of the damage including death entering the world will be undone and God will make his dwelling with men in the **new Jerusalem **for all eternity. And did you catch the OT phrase "they will be his people?" The restoration does not need to be construed as a literal one thousand year reign of Christ on earth. Looking at scripture as if it does mean that causes all kinds of problems with the verses that show Jesus returning only once at the end of time. Apocalyptic writing is filled with imagery. When imagery is used we must be very careful and circumspect in attempting to determine its meaning. The Church is cautious on this one and rightly so.


#13

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