Right but the situation is more nuanced than that. When McDonald’s was serving extremely hot coffee, many got burned. McDonald’s kept settling without lowering the temp. When the big case happened they were punished more severely by the courts because they knew of the dangers of keeping hot coffee that hot and still did it. I think the church should know the dangers of not being transparent by now. That’s all. If I were the prosecutor in the case against the church I’d argue that the church was negligent
Great, maybe you can pursue that career path.
I think the Church is being punished mighty severely right now in the “court of public opinion”. Sometimes the ol’ “public check” and reputational damage, loss of goodwill etc hit harder than money damages.
I agree with you 100%
Tisk tisk… You’re making too much sense.
I love your posts
Update: Went to confession. Told the priest everything I was feeling. He apologized to me on behalf of the church, told me he’s glad I’m a part of the church and came to him instead of just leaving, and even told me that he was going to do my penance for me and pray for me.
I can’t leave this church. But I am upset at what happened
Every single one of us is affected, or has been affected in some way.
I was just thinking about this the other day, when the dear people of Pennsylvania were affected by all of this latest news.
Over the years, I had found out that priests that I were acquainted with were pedophiles, too.
I still focus on Our Lord and His presence in the Eucharist and on our Catholic faith, and in the good that is still there.
I think we have every right to be upset, disgusted, even angry or outraged. I know I am. But even with all that, this is the one true church that was founded by Jesus. The conflict between this and the bad things done by it’s people (clergy and lay) add to these conflicting feelings, but where else am I to go.
I have conflicted feelings, too.
I am terribly sorry for those who have been personally affected and victimized and traumatized. My heart breaks for them.
I am terribly saddened by all of this.
We have the fullness of Jesus in the Eucharist, in the Church.
May God heal all of us.
That was a good thing for you do, and a good, kind response by your priest.
I get the feeling your priest may have heard the same thing from multiple people today.
I will personally pray for him.
Oh wow. That is great. I am so glad to hear that.
I believe we can all find healing in the Church.
No, I DO expect the Church leaders to immediately inform the authorities when they receive a report. The Church is in NO position to determine whether a person is guilty of criminal acts, and can be legally liable if it doesn’t promptly report allegations. It is NOT within the purview of the Church to do its own investigations and then decide whether to contact law enforcement.
An accused priest is not a “client” of the Church, any more than a bank teller who embezzles from the bank is a “client” of the bank. Would the bank not call the police? The bank would not say, “Joe embezzled money from customer accounts. Let’s not tell the police because Joe is our client. Let’s move him to another branch and hope the embezzlement stops.”
The idea that a person/institution “incriminates” itself if it reports a crime committed by someone else is exactly why Catholic Church leaders have lost all credibility and trust.
SHB: you say you looked up to priests as bastions of hope. My suggestion now is to "look up to A PRIEST as a bastion of hope.
There are many, many more solid and faithful priests that are holy, dedicated, and hard working for you and all Catholics. Unfortunately, we now know of many who trampled on your trust and mine. My avenue now is to take every priest, one at a time. The enemy of the church loves us to group them all into one category. Just listen to the bad jokes about “Catholic priests” as if all are in the same boat.
The church is here to stay, Christ and the Holy Spirit will see to that. Meanwhile we have to take to heart Christ’s word’s, (this is funny, I can’t remember it - senior moment - somebody help me!!) It is something like, “be a clever as a fox and as harmless as doves.” Pardon me if I feel a little stupid here…
Try to stay focused Jesus who is still present in the Eucharist and His church is still holy, don’t let the sins of those that where supposed to be apostles of Christ turn you away from His church.
Um…based on your post, I don’t think you were really following the legal discussion I was having with the other lawyer, so best to just let this one go. You have quite a few things wrong, both in your expectations and in just your basic interpretation of what was being discussed, but since like I said it was a lawyer discussion, it’s not the type of thing non-lawyers can always understand or follow, sorry.
Pardon me for infringing on the sacred space held by lawyers. Certainly no layperson is worthy of discussing legal matters with lawyers, and I should’ve known better. But before I scuttle back to where I belong, let me add that in my professional life I have several attorneys serving on my staff and we discus statutory interpretation on a regular basis. So… try me. What’d I get wrong?
Just to hit the highlights:
The discussion was not about what the Church should do when it has suspicions about its employee (priest). We agreed the Church mishandled the situations, although in the era before mandated reporting and when society in general did not take child sex abuse allegations as seriously as we do today, an argument can be made that the Church didn’t fully realize the gravity of the situation - however, that is not the issue that we were discussing.
The discussion was about whether, once an accusation had been made and some type of legal action was presumably about to happen, or already happening, the Church should have been “absolutely transparent” about all of its memos, knowledge up to that point, etc. or just expect either the prosecutor or the P in civil suit to go after the records. The normal action would be for an entity (Church, corporation etc. ) to make the other side go after the records in some way.
Also, I don’t know where you’re getting the whole “priest is not a client of the Church” business. That doesn’t make sense and no one said he was. The discussion concerned the Church being a client of a lawyer.
That’s the general gist of it - we’re basically discussing apples and you’re talking about oranges.
I’m going to mute this thread now since my main point in posting was to try to prevent someone from leaving the faith, not to start a protracted legal discussion with everybody. Adios.
The Church is Holy, the problem is that there were, are and always will be scoundrels and traitors in both the clergy and the laity. The current crisis however is not a pedophile crisis, but rather a homosexual crisis as the vast majority of abuse cases involves teenage boys, young men and even seminarians being targeted by wolves that have made their way into positions of authority; The homosexual ring hiding inside the clergy needs to be exposed and ousted, these are the ones usually speaking about tolerance and celebrating rainbow masses and changing Church teaching on homosexuality…
we cannot lose good musicians. Sing to God, play to the worship of God