a challenge to muslims who visit here


#1

the new testament contains many beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings and stories. sometimes, they bring tears to my eyes just hearing them. if i need to give examples, i can do so, but everybody who's read the scriptures knows what i'm talking about.

where are the beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings in the koran? let's see some of them. then, let's compare them with the new testament passages and ask ourselves these questions:

  1. which passages are more beautiful, inspirational and profound?
  2. which teachings--Jesus' or Mohammed's--are more likely the teachings of God?
  3. after comparing the teachings of Jesus with the teachings of Mohammed, which of them would you rather follow?

my contention is simple:

give a person full access to both muslim and Christian scriptures, churches, and spiritual leaders, and the vast majority of people would choose Christianity. sadly, most Muslims never get to do that comparison or make that choice.


#2

That has not been my experience. I actually know a lot of Muslim converts from Christianity, but no Christians who converted from Islam.

And why would you assume that Muslims have never been exposed to the NT?


#3

[quote="BlueEyedLady, post:2, topic:309747"]
That has not been my experience. I actually know a lot of Muslim converts from Christianity, but no Christians who converted from Islam.

And why would you assume that Muslims have never been exposed to the NT?

[/quote]

you are deadly wrong ! I know many muslims who left Islam to christianity.

However , in places where saying in a tweet " I will not shake the prophet hand" will take yo jail. how can one profess publicly in denouncing islam ! plus where is the islamic country that give christians the freedom to spread their faith like muslims do in the west ?

if by leaving christianity to islam you mean the west .. than I supposed leaving christianity to paganism is even higher ! my point is Christians in the west leave their faith to any religion . the sense of being christians is lost ...Read " Bad religion"


#4

[quote="captainmike, post:1, topic:309747"]

give a person full access to both muslim and Christian scriptures, churches, and spiritual leaders, and the vast majority of people would choose Christianity. sadly, most Muslims never get to do that comparison or make that choice.

[/quote]

If the choice between Christianity and Islam was so obvious, would there be any merit for faith?


#5

the penalty for leaving islam for Christianity is death. that's why very few muslims convert to Christianity. it's also why there are so many muslims in the world. they aren't muslim by choice. they are muslim at gunpoint.


#6

[quote="captainmike, post:1, topic:309747"]
the new testament contains many beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings and stories. sometimes, they bring tears to my eyes just hearing them. if i need to give examples, i can do so, but everybody who's read the scriptures knows what i'm talking about.

where are the beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings in the koran? let's see some of them. then, let's compare them with the new testament passages and ask ourselves these questions:

  1. which passages are more beautiful, inspirational and profound?
  2. which teachings--Jesus' or Mohammed's--are more likely the teachings of God?
  3. after comparing the teachings of Jesus with the teachings of Mohammed, which of them would you rather follow?

my contention is simple:

give a person full access to both muslim and Christian scriptures, churches, and spiritual leaders, and the vast majority of people would choose Christianity. sadly, most Muslims never get to do that comparison or make that choice.

[/quote]

There is a death sentence to leave Islam. since your question is directed to Muslims, i don't think you will find many on CAF but like Arabic Catholic, there are a few brave converts from Islam to Christ. I am not sure what you know about Islam but, that faith doesn't encourage inter-religious dialog and friendships with other. While many Muslims in the west are much more westernized in having non-Muslim friends and being or at least seemingly open to others and dialog, that is not what the Koran teaches.


#7

[quote="captainmike, post:5, topic:309747"]
the penalty for leaving islam for Christianity is death. that's why very few muslims convert to Christianity. it's also why there are so many muslims in the world. they aren't muslim by choice. they are muslim at gunpoint.

[/quote]

Sometimes I wish there were a 'thumbs up' option here at CAF...obviously I know where there is not, but sometimes I wish there were! ;)
Anyhow, this would get a 'thumbs up' from me...:p


#8

[quote="captainmike, post:1, topic:309747"]
the new testament contains many beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings and stories. sometimes, they bring tears to my eyes just hearing them. if i need to give examples, i can do so, but everybody who's read the scriptures knows what i'm talking about.

where are the beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings in the koran? let's see some of them. then, let's compare them with the new testament passages and ask ourselves these questions:

  1. which passages are more beautiful, inspirational and profound?
  2. which teachings--Jesus' or Mohammed's--are more likely the teachings of God?
  3. after comparing the teachings of Jesus with the teachings of Mohammed, which of them would you rather follow?

my contention is simple:

give a person full access to both muslim and Christian scriptures, churches, and spiritual leaders, and the vast majority of people would choose Christianity. sadly, most Muslims never get to do that comparison or make that choice.

[/quote]

Unfortunately, such a comparison would do nothing without the work of the Holy Spirit. You can't "convince" someone to Christianity. Someone will always find something subjective or shallow to cling onto. Muslims will try to find passages in the Quran they find "more beautiful, inspirational and profound." Muslims will claim that Mohammad's teachings sound more likely to be from God. Muslims will claim they'd rather follow Mohammad. Try talking to Muslims and witnessing to them from the scriptures, and you'll discover what willful ignorance looks like.

Keep in mind I'm not saying all that to be mean, but that's unfortunately the sad truth. Without the regeneration of the heart, your best and grandest "comparison" would mean absolutely nothing. "Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error" (1 Jo 4:6). Think of the Jews, who have Moses and the prophets read at their synagogues, but as the apostle Paul wrote: "Yes, to this day whenever Moses is read a veil lies over their hearts. But when one turns to the Lord, the veil is removed" (2 Co 3:15-16).

The best thing to do is: 1) witness to your Muslim friends and acquaintances; 2) pray for them.

[quote="BlueEyedLady, post:2, topic:309747"]
I actually know a lot of Muslim converts from Christianity, but no Christians who converted from Islam.

[/quote]

I won't speak for your own personal experience, but a good friend of mine is a Turkish gentleman who was a former Muslim and now belongs to the Eastern Orthodox Church. I know of other gentlemen (not counting Ergun Caner for obvious reasons) who were former Muslims and now converts to Christianity.


#9

[quote="Byzantine_Wolf, post:8, topic:309747"]
Unfortunately, such a comparison would do nothing without the work of the Holy Spirit. You can't "convince" someone to Christianity. .

[/quote]

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

[quote="captainmike, post:1, topic:309747"]
where are the beautiful, inspirational, and profound teachings in the koran? let's see some of them.

[/quote]

I would be interested in hearing some of these, minus the comparison and choosing. Not so much as a challenge to Muslims, but as an opportunity for them to share what they think is beautiful in their faith. Not as an opportunity to convert us or convert them, atleast not in this thread. More of an opportunity to further understand your ways of thinking. Simply, what passage is most inspiring and beautiful to you?


#10

Hi captainmike,

with all due respect I think this challenge is unattainable because it provides no measurable metrics. The criteria you set out are subjective. Your idea of beauty could be different from someone else's and vice versa. So how do you measure what's "more beautiful"?


#11

To the OP:

It seems you have your mind made up. Is there any chance that any Muslim will be able to prove your contention false to you?

If not, what is the point of your post?


#12

[quote="RickDecker, post:11, topic:309747"]
To the OP:

It seems you have your mind made up. Is there any chance that any Muslim will be able to prove your contention false to you?

If not, what is the point of your post?

[/quote]

Yes, I agree. The OP is assuming something in a vacuum: "give a person full access to both muslim and Christian scriptures, churches, and spiritual leaders, and the vast majority of people would choose Christianity."

There are other things that could impact a persons' decision to choose a religion (cultural, social, economic, personal, etc.).

This will cloud a persons idea of what is most inspirational, beautiful, etc. about a specific teaching (whether from the Bible or koran). So I don't think you will have a good debate, just two groups supporting their own teachings over the other.

God Bless!


#13

[quote="BlueEyedLady, post:2, topic:309747"]
That has not been my experience. I actually know a lot of Muslim converts from Christianity, but no Christians who converted from Islam.

And why would you assume that Muslims have never been exposed to the NT?

[/quote]

If you did know a Christian convert from Muslim, it would probably be in the past tense.

There was the girl in the news from Ohio who had to flee her family and moved to Florida to avoid what she assumed was certain death. I don't know where she is now.


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