A "Q?" 4 "P's"

Protestants ,

How would you describe your churches relationship with the Catholic church?

scary,

Thanks to my granddaughter I got it - it’s text speak :smiley:

=LondonIrish;5724355]Thanks to my granddaughter I got it - it’s text speak :smiley:

Yea, me too. well at least I used to be.

Love and prayers,

I can’t answer from the point of view of a protestant, but I can tell you my catholic church has a very warm and fruitful relationship with all the other churches in our area. I’ve been very involved in several church initiatives over the years that fostered better understanding and relations between my brothers and sisters of all other faiths, and we have done some wonderful community work together with a local mosque, and have run several children and teenager groups with independent churches, church of england groups, and so forth. So I suppose if they were to answer, they would say they have a good relationship with my catholic church. Sadly, I know that is not true everywhere.

United Methodists share a common heritage with Christians of every age and nation. This heritage is grounded in the apostolic witness to Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord, which is the source and measure of all valid teaching.

We understand ourselves to be part of Christ’s universal church. We affirm the general ministry of all baptized persons who share responsibility for the building up of the church and the reaching out in mission and service to the world. With other Christians, we declare the essential oneness of the church in Christ Jesus. This rich heritage of shared Christian belief finds expression in our hymnody and liturgies. Our unity is affirmed by the historic creeds as we confess one holy, catholic [not meaning any demonination, but meaning universal], and apostolic church. It is also experienced in joint ventures of ministry and in various forms of ecumenical cooperation.

Nourished by common roots of this shared Christian heritage, the branches of Christ’s church have developed diverse traditions that elarge our store of shared understandings. Our avowed ecumenical commitment as United Methodists is to gather our own doctrinal emphases into the larger Christian unity, there to be made more meaningful in a richer whole.

The Catholic Church’s relationship with the Catholic Church is the same as chocolate’s relationship with my taste buds. That is to say, yummy.

I think it is as diverse as Catholics’ view of Lutheranism. There are many like me who have a great respect for the Catholic Church, and pray for reconciliation, and believe that that is the only true and successful conclusion to the Reformation. There are others who probably couldn’t care less about ecumenism - it doesn’t effect them. And there are some who see our differences as irreconcilable as some Catholics believe them to be.

Our Church - the LCMS - sees the Catholic Church as a Christian Church that mixes truth with error.
Jon

From the ELCA point of view, there is quite a range of opinions about Catholicism as well. Like Jon, I believe it is our destiny as followers of Christ to be reconciled. I also have a great respect for the Catholic Church and pray for the day when we will be one. There are, sadly, ELCA Lutherans who would probably like to drum me out of the ministry for my views.:shrug: Fortunately, they aren’t in a position to do so.

There are areas where ELCA synods and Catholic dioceses have entered into covenant relationships in which they pledge themselves to continued theological conversation, to pray for one another, and to pray with one another.

I thought I would provide the text of the covenant between the Northwestern Ohio Synod of th ELCA and the Catholic Diocese of Toledo. The covenant exceeds the maximum length for a post, so I have divided it.

A COVENANT BETWEEN
THE EVANGELICAL LUTHERAN CHURCH IN AMERICA,
NORTHWESTERN OHIO SYNOD
AND
THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH, DIOCESE OF TOLEDO

The God of the Scriptures made covenants with his people from the earliest times.  These covenants show that god is faithful, that he is willing to bind himself in an intimate relationship with his creatures.

While remaining committed to our respective traditions and communions, we humble acknowledge that both Catholics and Lutherans have contributed to the divisions which exist between our two traditions.  Both faith communities recognize our need for that healing love of which our Lord by whose name we are know, the Lord who has called us to be one) John 17:21).

On the night in which he was betrayed, the Lord Jesus prayed to the Father for the unity of the church, a unit like that of the Father with the son.  This is the time when Jesus used the Passover elements of bread and wine to feed his disciples with his body and blood.  This sacrificial meal has been celebrated by Christians ever since as a sign of their communion with god and each other.

This meal of unity, which is ideally a sign of unity, unfortunately highlights our disunity.  In some cases, the gathered community excludes from the Lord’s table Christians with whom there is not agreement on various points of faith.  While not minimizing those differences, we long for and will pray and work for the day when we can welcome each other at the common table of the Lord.

Our Common Confession

We share the faith confessed in the catholic creeds of the Church:
  1. That God is one, revealed to us as Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
  2. That in his death and resurrection, our Lord Jesus Christ has triumphed over sin and death, that death no longer has dominion of him (Romans 6:9), and that he is the living center of our faith and the savior of the world.
  3. That the Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification signed by our respective church bodies confesses our common faith that “by grace alone, in faith in Christ’s saving work and not because of any merit on our part, we are accepted by God and Christ’s saving work and receive the Holy Spirit, who renews our hearts while equipping and calling us to good works” (JDDJ, Paragraph 15).
  4. That Jesus called the Church into being and gave it the commission to “go and make disciples of all nations…teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you” (Matthew 28:19-20). This call to common mission flows from our unity in Christ.
  5. That the Church is “one, holy, catholic and apostolic” (Nicene Creed).
  6. That the Holy Scriptures are authoritative for our common faith and life in this world.
  7. That in the Sacraments of the Church, god reveals himself for our justification and sanctification.
  8. That we share a common Baptism, which incorporates us into the Church and calls us to participate in the Church’s mission.
  9. That it is one of the mysteries of our faith that, in Holy Communion, we receive the true body and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ.
  10. That the Church and its ministry of reconciliation is a sign of the presence of the Reign of God, and that this covenant itself is a sign of that Reign and the unity we already share.

The Covenant We Enter

With confidence in the power of the Holy Spirit and the coming of the Reign of God, we dedicate ourselves to prayer, study and action.

I. United in prayer we will:
• Pray for each other as we celebrate the Eucharist in our respective communions and, in anticipation of the time when we might celebrate the Eucharist together, as God to hasten our complete reconciliation;
• Develop opportunities for joint groups of Lutheran Christians and Catholic Christians to share in prayer and reflection on the Holy Scriptures;
• Continue to encourage joint observances such as Thanksgiving, the Week of Prayer for Christian Unity, the Word Day of Prayer, Lenten devotions, Martin Luther King Jr. celebrations and other activities;
• Encourage Lutheran and Catholic clergy to engage in joint homily reflection and preparation in the context of prayer;
• Encourage, assist and enable parishes to adopt local covenants.

Covenant (part 2)

II. United in study we will:
• At least on a periodic basis, invite diocesan/synodical official observers to diocesan or synodical councils and assemblies (e.g., Priests’ Council, Diocesan Pastoral Advisory Council, Synod Assembly, bishops’ staff meetings);
• Maintain a direct communication with each other through official representation on our respective ecumenical commissions;
• Continue to work with each other (and other judicatory leaders) on the leadership level through the Northwest Ohio Leaders Group sponsored by the Ohio Council of Churches;
• Encourage the present active local Lutheran/Catholic study groups (e.g., in the Oak Harbor/Port Clinton area and the Tiffin/Findlay area) and help to establish other area groups in Northwest Ohio to study the Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification and issues of ecumenical dialogue;
• Collaborate actively, where appropriate, at the diocesan/synodical level in planning and conducting training programs, including courses on ecumenism, for more effective ministry.

III. United in action we will:
• Continue and expand close working relationships and exchange of information between the bishops and their staffs;
• Expand cooperation in social service, advocacy, community development, community organizing and social justice programs for bringing Christian principles to bear on public issues in order to strengthen families, build neighborhoods, fight poverty, eliminate oppression and respect life (to be facilitated by a closer cooperation between Catholic social-service agencies and Lutheran social-service agencies);
• Establish a working relationship between those responsible for coordination our respective African missions (in Tanzania and Zimbabwe) in order to educate our people on the importance of mission outreach to the Third World;
• Encourage joint Lutheran/Catholic initiatives on a parish level which involve outreach to the poor and those in need;
• Establish a Covenant Commission (clergy and laity) which will facilitate the implementation of this Covenant;
• Develop information to share the Covenant and its process for implementation with ecumenical and interfaith bodies, the religious and secular press and other judicatories.

To further the implementation and actualization of the Covenant, we hereby agree to strive toward the removal of impediments to the cause of unity, and to place no impediments in the way of reunion.

All praise and thanks to you, Lord God,
the source and center of our unity.
May the prayer of the Lord Jesus be fulfilled,
that we might be one, as you are one.

[signed]

James R. Hoffman, Bishop of Toledo
Marcus C. Lohrmann, Bishop, Northwestern Ohio Synod

On this date of 16 September 2001

Covenant reaffirmed and renewed to the Glory of God at Saint Michael the Archangel Church, Findlay, Ohio, on October 22, 2006

[signed]

Leonard P. Blair, Bishop of Toledo
Marcus C. Lohrmann, Bishop, Northwestern Ohio Synod

=gcnuss;5725524]From the ELCA point of view, there is quite a range of opinions about Catholicism as well. Like Jon, I believe it is our destiny as followers of Christ to be reconciled. I also have a great respect for the Catholic Church and pray for the day when we will be one. There are, sadly, ELCA Lutherans who would probably like to drum me out of the ministry for my views.:shrug: Fortunately, they aren’t in a position to do so.

There are areas where ELCA synods and Catholic dioceses have entered into covenant relationships in which they pledge themselves to continued theological conversation, to pray for one another, and to pray with one another.

Thank you Pastor,

Lets pray that God’s will, is soon accomplished.

Love and prayers,

In the area of dialogue with our Catholic siblings in Christ, your synod has done much more of God’s work in this area than the LCMS. It is a point of pride and admiration I have for the ELCA as a fellow Lutheran. And as an LCMS, a point of embarrassment that we are less willing to act on Christ’s call to unity, even to the point of not signing the JDDJ.

Jon

There were Friends observers/visitors at Vatican II. Friends have a “sacramental” understanding of life and it’s moments and believe each of these momonets is a chance to experience grace and Presence.

While we express the concept of holiness and living in communion with Christ differently and view sacraments differently…Friends have appreciated the mysticism that Catholicism has at time portrayed. It is this mystical understanding of the immanence and transcendance of God that we share.

=Publisher;5725653]There were Friends observers/visitors at Vatican II. Friends have a “sacramental” understanding of life and it’s moments and believe each of these momonets is a chance to experience grace and Presence.

While we express the concept of holiness and living in communion with Christ differently and view sacraments differently…Friends have appreciated the mysticism that Catholicism has at time portrayed. It is this mystical understanding of the immanence and transcendance of God that we share.

Thank you so much for sharing.

God bless you!

You might be surprised to hear this, but

My church (Assembly of God) like me personally, is an ecumenical evangelical church. What that means on a practical level is that we cooperate in community interfaith activities and don’t waste bandwidth in tearing other churches in the community down.

To the extent that my pastor mentions Catholics, the reference is positive. Once my pastor based a whole message with St. Patrick as an illustration.

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