A rant...


#1

Okaaaaay… So about a month ago I attended a parish around the corner from my new house and boy was it a dousie (how do you spell dousie?). Now, I went to this church a few times several years ago and it was a bit uh, unorthodox. People leaving pews for the sign of peace and the “Saving Cup” in the Eucharistic prayer being plauralized to Saving Cups, that kind of thing. Since it had been several years I thought things may have gotten better. Boy oh boy was I wrong. So, I get there and sit in my up and people just will not shut up. Lots of talking. Loudly. The tabernacle is gold inside but has a wooden exterior. No red candle anywhere that I saw. Anyway, mass is about to begin and the head of the music ministry introduces herself and her band to the congregation. She continues, “We wecome you all.” Fine. “Would any of our visitors please stand to be recognized?” Clapping and roaming around to shake hands from the congregation. I don’t stand. I sigh. Ok I am here. Maybe that’s the worst of it. But noooooo. The mass begins and the Altar Servers enter carrying a cross with no Corpus. The priest begins, lin the Name of the Father, the Creator, and of the Son, the Redeemer, and of the Holy Spirit, the Sanctifier. Amen" o_O;;
The first two reading go by without incident. Then the Gospel came. *Long sigh" the piano is played during the reading while the Deacon reads dramtically. The music rises in volume every few lines before a dramatic pause by the Decon and the congregation sings a refrain. By this point I am nearly banging my head on the pew in front of me. The holmily was fine and very well done. The Eucharistic prayer fine. The prater of the faithful ad a spanish response to music even though it was an english mass. When mass ended I do not recall genuflecting towards the Tabernacle by almost anyone. Most left speedily and while talking. There may be more but I cannot remember and now my head hurts from thinking about it.


#2

[quote="Layp3rs0n, post:1, topic:281154"]
It is a good thing we have Apostolic Tradition backing up the fourth Marian dogma...otherwise it would only be a matter of Assumption.

[/quote]

Sorry, not to make light of your rant.....
but I LOVE this.:thumbsup:

Anyway, been through a similar experience with a former priest. (Yes in both senses of the word. No longer at our parish and no longer a priest -- well, I think he is Episcopalian these days.) Anyway, I can remember sitting in mass with the organ playing through the Gospel and thinking "You know, the Holy Spirit really doesn't need help making the Gospel more relevant. He is quite capable of handling that on His own." We stayed with the parish although I know people that left to find something more orthodox. We probably should have.

We have a new priest now -- who is an outstanding speaker, very orthodox and never tries to ad lib, improvise or otherwise improve upon the Gospel or any other part of mass. Maybe you got our old priest? no, probably not, like I said, I think he's Episcopalian these days.

Anyway, we often pray for our current priest and the old priest as well. I suggest that is the best thing you can do for your priest. If he is that far over the top, you could contact your bishop and politely explain your concerns, giving specific examples. I think the specific examples are really the most helpful for the bishop and his staff as they probably don't know what is going on.


#3

I feel for you, but I feel deeper sympathy for the folk at at parish. At least you knew things were amis, they thought that they were really withit and cool.

That whole turning the sacred liturgy into 'religous' entertainment really grates on me as well. I normally feel closer to a peptic ulcer than God if im unfortunate enough to endure a Mass like that.


#4

[quote="Layp3rs0n, post:1, topic:281154"]
Okaaaaay... So about a month ago I attended a parish around the corner from my new house and boy was it a dousie (how do you spell dousie?). Now, I went to this church a few times several years ago and it was a bit uh, unorthodox. People leaving pews for the sign of peace and the "Saving Cup" in the Eucharistic prayer being plauralized to Saving Cups, that kind of thing. Since it had been several years I thought things may have gotten better. Boy oh boy was I wrong. So, I get there and sit in my up and people just will not shut up. Lots of talking. Loudly. The tabernacle is gold inside but has a wooden exterior. No red candle anywhere that I saw. Anyway, mass is about to begin and the head of the music ministry introduces herself and her band to the congregation. She continues, "We wecome you all." Fine. "Would any of our visitors please stand to be recognized?" Clapping and roaming around to shake hands from the congregation. I don't stand. I sigh. Ok I am here. Maybe that's the worst of it. But noooooo. The mass begins and the Altar Servers enter carrying a cross with no Corpus. The priest begins, lin the Name of the Father, the Creator, and of the Son, the Redeemer, and of the Holy Spirit, the Sanctifier. Amen" o_O;;
The first two reading go by without incident. Then the Gospel came. *Long sigh" the piano is played during the reading while the Deacon reads dramtically. The music rises in volume every few lines before a dramatic pause by the Decon and the congregation sings a refrain. By this point I am nearly banging my head on the pew in front of me. The holmily was fine and very well done. The Eucharistic prayer fine. The prater of the faithful ad a spanish response to music even though it was an english mass. When mass ended I do not recall genuflecting towards the Tabernacle by almost anyone. Most left speedily and while talking. There may be more but I cannot remember and now my head hurts from thinking about it.

[/quote]

Two points:
1) don't go back there
2) dousie is spelled doozy dictionary.reference.com/browse/doozy?s=t


#5

"Duesy" short for "Duesenberg" one one of the finest and most outlandish car makers of all time.


#6

There must always be a sanctuary lamp, and kept lit.
I would have a word with this priest who obviously needs to go back to the seminary, or face being sacked.
And people should genuflect before the Tabernacle.

I would never set foot inside such an heretical church !

I'm not SSPX, but Hopefully when the SSPX are reconciled with Rome, this kind charade will be stamped out! We will learn a lot about how reverent Mass is supposed to be conducted.


#7

[quote="Layp3rs0n, post:1, topic:281154"]
Okaaaaay... So about a month ago I attended a parish around the corner from my new house and boy was it a dousie (how do you spell dousie?). Now, I went to this church a few times several years ago and it was a bit uh, unorthodox. People leaving pews for the sign of peace and the "Saving Cup" in the Eucharistic prayer being plauralized to Saving Cups, that kind of thing. Since it had been several years I thought things may have gotten better. Boy oh boy was I wrong. So, I get there and sit in my up and people just will not shut up. Lots of talking. Loudly. The tabernacle is gold inside but has a wooden exterior. No red candle anywhere that I saw. Anyway, mass is about to begin and the head of the music ministry introduces herself and her band to the congregation. She continues, "We wecome you all." Fine. "Would any of our visitors please stand to be recognized?" Clapping and roaming around to shake hands from the congregation. I don't stand. I sigh. Ok I am here. Maybe that's the worst of it. But noooooo. The mass begins and the Altar Servers enter carrying a cross with no Corpus. The priest begins, lin the Name of the Father, the Creator, and of the Son, the Redeemer, and of the Holy Spirit, the Sanctifier. Amen" o_O;;
The first two reading go by without incident. Then the Gospel came. *Long sigh" the piano is played during the reading while the Deacon reads dramtically. The music rises in volume every few lines before a dramatic pause by the Decon and the congregation sings a refrain. By this point I am nearly banging my head on the pew in front of me. The holmily was fine and very well done. The Eucharistic prayer fine. The prater of the faithful ad a spanish response to music even though it was an english mass. When mass ended I do not recall genuflecting towards the Tabernacle by almost anyone. Most left speedily and while talking. There may be more but I cannot remember and now my head hurts from thinking about it.

[/quote]

Make an appointment to speak with the Priest about your concerns. He deserves the opportunity to either explain or/and fix the situation. If that does not work...

"Dear Most Reverend Bishop ___________ ..."


#8

I would think the Bishop should hear of this, anyway. I don't think one lay person would get a Priest to stop this, and I also think that if one priest is doing this, it may be possible others are doing this and it may not even be on the Bishop's radar.

Sadly, I think that oversight from many Bishops are very lacking. The last time I ever saw a Bishop in person was at my Confirmation in 1992. If they visited some parishes once in a while, there may not be such a disconnect, and maybe these things wouldn't happen so often?


#9

[quote="Mostyn, post:6, topic:281154"]
There must always be a sanctuary lamp, and kept lit.
]Yes a sanctuary light is obligatory. I wonder if it was a suspended light that was not obvious to the OP.

[/quote]

I would have a word with this priest who obviously needs to go back to the seminary, or face being sacked.
Sacked for what? His liturgical practices may be not what you or I would prefer but he did nothing serious.

And people should genuflect before the Tabernacle.

...or bow but one should not be overly pious either.

I would never set foot inside such an heretical church !
I]What heresies are you talking about? I don't think you mean to use the word "heretical".

I'm not SSPX, but Hopefully when the SSPX are reconciled with Rome, this kind charade will be stamped out! We will learn a lot about how reverent Mass is supposed to be conducted
*Now is the time you can use the word "heretical" !
*Anyway in reference to the SSPX....Why would you ever think that this minority group would have that big an influence on our liturgy. They are a more of a minority group than those who celebrate the OP described. Don't get your hopes up! SSPX members have long rejected certain Vatican II teachings. We don't know yet what is in the preamble that needs to be accepted by the Society but it is doubtful that they all members will come around on this. The rumor is that it will cause a split within the group... more division.
*
*

d.


#10

Here's what can really be done:

1) discus your concerns with the priest in question or whomever the parish pastor is
1b) if that doesn't resolve the situation, then inform the Bishop
1c) if the Bishop does not resolve the matter to your liking, contact Rome and wait.

2) unless you have no other choice to attend mass in that parish, then don't.

3) if you must attend mass at that parish and have done everything that you can, the only other option is to ignore it and not allow it to be a spiritual block.


#11

[quote="Layp3rs0n, post:1, topic:281154"]
The holmily was fine and very well done.

The Eucharistic prayer fine.

[/quote]

Well, on a positive note, those two important things were done correctly...


#12

[quote="Layp3rs0n, post:1, topic:281154"]
Okaaaaay... So about a month ago I attended a parish around the corner from my new house and boy was it a dousie (how do you spell dousie?). Now, I went to this church a few times several years ago and it was a bit uh, unorthodox. People leaving pews for the sign of peace and the "Saving Cup" in the Eucharistic prayer being plauralized to Saving Cups, that kind of thing. Since it had been several years I thought things may have gotten better. Boy oh boy was I wrong. So, I get there and sit in my up and people just will not shut up. Lots of talking. Loudly. The tabernacle is gold inside but has a wooden exterior. No red candle anywhere that I saw. Anyway, mass is about to begin and the head of the music ministry introduces herself and her band to the congregation. She continues, "We wecome you all." Fine. "Would any of our visitors please stand to be recognized?" Clapping and roaming around to shake hands from the congregation. I don't stand. I sigh. Ok I am here. Maybe that's the worst of it. But noooooo. The mass begins and the Altar Servers enter carrying a cross with no Corpus. The priest begins, lin the Name of the Father, the Creator, and of the Son, the Redeemer, and of the Holy Spirit, the Sanctifier. Amen" o_O;;
The first two reading go by without incident. Then the Gospel came. *Long sigh" the piano is played during the reading while the Deacon reads dramtically. The music rises in volume every few lines before a dramatic pause by the Decon and the congregation sings a refrain. By this point I am nearly banging my head on the pew in front of me. The holmily was fine and very well done. The Eucharistic prayer fine. The prater of the faithful ad a spanish response to music even though it was an english mass. When mass ended I do not recall genuflecting towards the Tabernacle by almost anyone. Most left speedily and while talking. There may be more but I cannot remember and now my head hurts from thinking about it.

[/quote]

I was virtually scribbling all over this post with a red pen. Oh my.

Don't go there again, and complain if you feel you need to.


#13

[quote="NewEnglandPriest, post:11, topic:281154"]
Well, on a positive note, those two important things were done correctly...

[/quote]

Yep, it sounds like the priest was doing his job.

Music during the Gospel reading is under his control, but it isn't the most serious "abuse" I've ever heard.

Music you don't like and people talking before Mass are things we all need to become more patient about. Many Saints have written about behavor like that throughout the ages. We influence by our example and pray, pray, pray for the people in question.

OP, since this in not your home parish, you probably won't have too much sway with the priest, but speak to him anyway. Be humble and charitable, not demanding. As you said yourself, the majority of the Mass was fine.


#14

I actually suggest you go back there on a regular basis and demonstrate how one should behave during Mass. They may not know how to or just need a gentle reminder. When I was an XO, I came across a work detail that wasn't doing their assigned task. Instead of chewing them out [more correctly chewing the NCO in charge out], I just walked up, ignored them and started doing what they were supposed to be doing. Within 5-10 minutes, they were all doing what they were supposed to be doing and the NCO in charge of the group told me "Sir, we got this." I say return, sit at the very front and show them how one should act.


#15

Armyvet...it is not appropriate to try and change the way people pray when you're not a member of that community. It's not up to non members to change things.


#16

[quote="Anna_Claire, post:9, topic:281154"]

[/quote]

[quote="Theophorus, post:3, topic:281154"]
I feel for you, but I feel deeper sympathy for the folk at at parish. At least you knew things were amis, they thought that they were really withit and cool. .

[/quote]

Amen

[quote="Armyvet007, post:14, topic:281154"]
I actually suggest you go back there on a regular basis and demonstrate how one should behave during Mass. They may not know how to or just need a gentle reminder. When I was an XO, I came across a work detail that wasn't doing their assigned task. Instead of chewing them out [more correctly chewing the NCO in charge out], I just walked up, ignored them and started doing what they were supposed to be doing. Within 5-10 minutes, they were all doing what they were supposed to be doing and the NCO in charge of the group told me "Sir, we got this." I say return, sit at the very front and show them how one should act.

[/quote]

[quote="Anna_Claire, post:15, topic:281154"]
Armyvet...it is not appropriate to try and change the way people pray when you're not a member of that community. It's not up to non members to change things.

[/quote]

Army vet is talking about leading by example which is totally appropriate for ALL members of the OHC Church, it is what St Francis apparently preached it is what Blessed Mother Teresa did. We don always need to go complaining to the Bishop especially since I believe there were actually no real abuses- things the OP did not like yes but abuses? At first when reading the "rant" I thought well sounds like a very welcoming church but then I read about the music during the Gospel and I thought :mad: but then one has to consider that music is a valid part of the whole mass, I have heard the gospel chanted recently at our Church and frankly that made it extremely difficult to focus and meditate on the word but it was very orthodox you would say right?

As for the little SSPX not being able to make a change, have you read the Gospels err Jesus chose 12 men not some massive corporation to institute the necessary changes in people's understanding of God???? Have you heard about Teresa of Avila ? and various other saints who practically single handedly caused the reform of abuses.


#17

[quote="Anna_Claire, post:15, topic:281154"]
Armyvet...it is not appropriate to try and change the way people pray when you're not a member of that community. It's not up to non members to change things.

[/quote]

There is nothing wrong with encouraging someone to set a good example for people to follow.


#18

I would love to attend a Church like that, sounds very interesting!


#19

[quote="Mostyn, post:6, topic:281154"]
I would never set foot inside such an heretical church !

[/quote]

I must have missed the heresy part.

The only thing I have a serious issue with is change the words of the Holy Trinity. This is illicit, but not heretical.


#20

[quote="Anna_Claire, post:15, topic:281154"]
Armyvet...it is not appropriate to try and change the way people pray when you're not a member of that community. It's not up to non members to change things.

[/quote]

How exactly is a Catholic not a member of "that community"?


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