About presumption


#1

Yesterday I've found out that sinning with the plan to confess it later was presumption and a mortal sin. I remember I did that a few months ago when I had to go to confession anyway so I decided to sin. I didn't know it was a mortal sin, I didn't know many things a few months ago, I'm learning them now. The sin I presumed was already confessed with repentance and firm purpose, but I never confessed the presumption because I never thought it was mortal and forgot about it. I'm planning to confess it but since I did a few other confessions since then I don't know, please someone make it clear for me: do I have to confess only the presumption? or I need to confess again each confession since the presumption?
Thanks and sorry for my English.


#2

For something to be a mortal sin, you need to know of its severity and choose to do it anyway. In your case, you did not know that presumption was sinful. The confession you made previously should not be nullified by the omission. Personally, however, I would bring the sin of presumption to confession with you the next time you go. When in doubt, confess.


#3

So let me see if I understand right -- the above happened -- then you went to confession -- and then later you went to other confessions without that question coming up --- and now after those confessions --- you realized what was the case and are asking what to do now in your next confession?

Sounds like you did not say have a clue that such was mortal at the time and needed to be confessed....so it seems you made a formally integral confession (all the mortal sins you were conscious of from your examine). You would then not need to "repeat" the former confessions.

Remember too that mortal sin is when there is grave matter, full knowledge and deliberate consent. So if such was not present then it was not a mortal sin and thus would not "need" to be confessed.

So it seems if you bring it to confession one could simply go and say: I did not realize such and such in my past confessions ---so I accuse myself of it as it is before God. You could add --Father I made some confessions since then --but in this case I do not need to repeat them right? He can guide you.


#4

I agree!


#5

Most people have a mistaken idea of presumption. This misunderstanding can cause havoc in their confessional experiences. What you are describing is not presumption. Read more below:

Presumption


#6

[quote="Windmill, post:5, topic:315810"]
Most people have a mistaken idea of presumption. This misunderstanding can cause havoc in their confessional experiences. What you are describing is not presumption.

[/quote]

Right.

He is taking it in the more colloquial way it sometimes gets used.

For what he did he could say "I committed the mortal sin(s) with the plan to confess it later etc"

(I do not though recommend that particular examine)


#7

“Presumption is here considered as a vice opposed to the theological virtue of hope. It may also be regarded as a product of pride. It may be defined as the condition of a soul which, because of a badly regulated reliance on God’s mercy and power, hopes for salvation without doing anything to deserve it, or for pardon of his sins without repenting of them.”

See more: newadvent.org/cathen/12403a.htm


#8

As to what "presumption" is:

Catechism:

2092 There are two kinds of presumption. Either man presumes upon his own capacities, (hoping to be able to save himself without help from on high), or he presumes upon God's almighty power or his mercy (hoping to obtain his forgiveness without conversion and glory without merit).

scborromeo.org/ccc/para/2092.htm


#9

Dear friend, this is a great grace you received, for I am convinced that many sin because implicitly they plan to confess later. I was one for a very long time, until one day it struck me.

Others have given great advice, especially the fact that you ignored it was a sin, which should in theory not make it mortal (you cannot sin mortally without knowing that you are doing so!). But Confession is that beautiful instant in which God's will is truly done on earth as it is in heaven, thus do not be afraid in your next confession to mention this as well as any other venial sin - it's not mandatory, but indeed recommended :)

And you do not need to confess any previously confessed sin, mortal or venial. My dad once told me about an old movie in which a Greek hero tosses a discus during a game, and the toss is so mighty that the discus flies away into the sky and everyone is terrified at the sight. Well, now imagine the discus is the sins you confessed, and the hero is Christ! :thumbsup:


#10

gfvj, God bless you on your journey as you are learning more about God and the teachings of His Church.


#11

[quote="gfvh, post:1, topic:315810"]
Yesterday I've found out that sinning with the plan to confess it later was presumption and a mortal sin. I remember I did that a few months ago when I had to go to confession anyway so I decided to sin. I didn't know it was a mortal sin, I didn't know many things a few months ago, I'm learning them now. The sin I presumed was already confessed with repentance and firm purpose, but I never confessed the presumption because I never thought it was mortal and forgot about it. I'm planning to confess it but since I did a few other confessions since then I don't know, please someone make it clear for me: do I have to confess only the presumption? or I need to confess again each confession since the presumption?
Thanks and sorry for my English.

[/quote]

Hi gfvh,

To be guilty of a mortal sin, you have to have full knowledge of it. You know now, but didn't then, so it's probably not mortal. That said, I would still confess it anyway, since it's objectively grave matter.


#12

[quote="sw85, post:11, topic:315810"]
I would still confess it anyway, since it's objectively grave matter.

[/quote]

Noting that one did not know it was mortal....etc


#13

[quote="gfvh, post:1, topic:315810"]
Yesterday I've found out that sinning with the plan to confess it later was presumption and a mortal sin. .

[/quote]

How did you find this out ? What is the source of this opinion ?


#14

I've found it out in the document posted by Windmill. There's another detail. I knew Jesus or St Augustine said that doing what I did was like joking on him, nevertheless I didn't know it was mortal, and I didn't know He would get so much offended by this, or at least I didn't thought it that way.


#15

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