After American Visit, Uganda Weighs Death for Gays

nytimes.com/2010/01/04/world/africa/04uganda.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

A visit by three evangelical Christian men to Uganda breaths life into a proposed bill that would make homosexual behavior punishable by death. Multiple donor countries including the U.S are demanding the legislation be dropped on the grounds that it violates human rights, but Ugandas Minister of Ethics and Integrity simply stated, "Homosexuals can forget about human rights."

I just had an idea. Lisa Miller and her daughter Isabella should seek refuge in Uganda.

onenewsnow.com/Legal/Default.aspx?id=832190

One piece of info that’s missing from the story above, is that the 7-year old Isabella became suicidal and refused to go visit her “other mother”, after she forced the child to take naked baths together with her.

As well as 5-year old boys raped by their homosexual adoptive “dads” in the USA should be moved to Uganda.

wnd.com/index.php?pageId=102740

One of the last safe spots on Earth.

AFTER we the USA will stop this onslaught of homosexual predators and activist judges on our children, and outlaw abortion, then maybe we can start criticizing Uganda’s human rights record.

Lisa Miller should be tossed into prison.

According to the mentally unstable Mrs. Miller.

I wonder how you would feel if Uganda decided to impose the death penalty against all Catholic priests for the actions of the few.

Is the title of this minister and the utterances he makes supposed to be an example of black comedy at it’s finest?

I wonder how you would feel if Uganda decided to impose the death penalty against all Catholic priests for the actions of the few.

Thank you.

[quote="Joseph_L_Varga, post:2, topic:181844"]
I just had an idea. Lisa Miller and her daughter Isabella should seek refuge in Uganda.

onenewsnow.com/Legal/Default.aspx?id=832190

One piece of info that's missing from the story above, is that the 7-year old Isabella became suicidal and refused to go visit her "other mother", after she forced the child to take naked baths together with her.

As well as 5-year old boys raped by their homosexual adoptive "dads" in the USA should be moved to Uganda.

wnd.com/index.php?pageId=102740

One of the last safe spots on Earth.

AFTER we the USA will stop this onslaught of homosexual predators and activist judges on our children, and outlaw abortion, then maybe we can start criticizing Uganda's human rights record.

[/quote]

Not all posters here are American by any means. Even if they were, the fact of one wrong would not allow us to countenance another. The Ugandan minister in question is quite simply talking nonsense that no Christian could countenance.

Just as a point I did some quick research on Uganda, 42 percent of Ugandans are Catholic and it's the biggest Christian denomination in the country. I do not believe the Church would countenance laws such as this bill.

I stand by what I said. We - the USA and most countries of Europe - have legalized the murder of unborn innocent babies. We are the pot, calling the kettle black. Our fake outrage is pathetic, our imagined moral high ground is ridiculous.

Also, where’s our outrage at the gay lobby poisoning the souls of our children, filling our public schools with gay propaganda? Teaching homosexual stuff to elementary school kids, and now even to 5-y.o. preschoolers? Taking 7-y.o. kids, during school time, to field trips to attend lesbian commitment ceremonies? That’s what happening in our public schools, here in the oh-so-superior USA! My heritage, my commitments place me with one foot in the USA, and one foot in the EU, and I really really detest and am outraged by this moral decay both in the USA and in the EU.

Why do we want to export all of our perversions to Africa? What the hell are Hillary Clinton and her “enlightened” European counterparts doing in Africa, pushing for every single abomination under the sun? Distribute condoms, legalize abortion, gay marriage, you name it!

If the Muslims and the Arab world hate us, at least I want them to hate us for the right reasons! Let them hate us for standing for God, for a Christian morality, and for freedom, not because we are rotten and abominable, and want to push our abominations down their throats!

My outrage is not fake and nor do I imagine in Ireland where I come from that we have the high moral ground on everything. That still doesn't make this proposed bill right or just. Fortunately I've been reading up on it and the parts about making homosexuality a capital crime have been removed. The poster who asked would we be outraged if the bill proposed to kill Catholic clergy was blunt but perceptive. All lives are valuable to God and the killing of homosexuals merely for been homosexual would be evil and wrong and just as evil and wrong as abortion.

I also don't understand why are the U.S. and other donor countries trying to impose their morality on the Ugandan parents who believe that those touching their children (including Catholic priests) or trying to indoctrinate their children with perversion deserve capital punishment.

Hey, haven't we heard the broken record about "I'm personally opposed to abortion, but I don't want to impose my morality on others"? ;)

(Oh, if the problem is that we are "donor countries", here's the simple solution: get the hell out of there. Stop messing with them. They don't want us anyway exporting our perversions to them. And I don't want either my country taxing me and then distributing condoms and brochures about "alternative lifestyles", and sponsoring abortions, using MY TAX $ in foreign countries. Besides, I'm already sponsoring everything from the fight against the spread of HIV/AIDS and malaria vaccines to food programs for poor people in various countries including in Africa, using my private donations through private charitable organizations. That way, I really make sure that I support WHAT I WANT TO SUPPORT, not what some perverted bureaucrat in Washington DC wants to support with my hard earned money.)

I also don't understand why are the U.S. and other donor countries trying to impose their morality on the Ugandan parents who believe that those touching their children (including Catholic priests) or trying to indoctrinate their children with perversion deserve capital punishment.

And what, if I may be so bold as to ask, of the homosexuals who* don't* molest children? Do they deserve capital punishment?

I don’t have a problem with those homosexuals who understand the principle, “live and let live”.

If you are homosexual, or a straight person concerned about the rights of homosexual people - leave my children alone. Don’t prey on them, and don’t try to indoctrinate them with your perversions. No little booklets about how Stevie has two daddies, and Mary has two mommies. No coloring books for my children, showing how the penguin chick has two daddies. If you are a teacher - leave my children alone with that trash. Teach them the 3 R’s - and that’s it. No sex education, no condoms, no gay sensitivity training. No field trips to lesbian commitment ceremonies, for my children. No assignments that require them to watch Brokeback mountain.

If you are a decent homosexual person, and don’t start hitting on me, I have no problem working with you as a colleague. Again, just don’t expect me to attend your “gay wedding”, or watch the photos you snapped on your last vacation with your partner.

But this is just my American and European experience. I have never been to Uganda, or to any other African country. I don’t support financially or morally anyone who wants to harrass peaceful homosexual people - whether in the USA, Europe, or in Africa. But I am really worried that politicians who represent the Culture of Death, are using my tax dime to distribute condoms, push the gay agenda, and pay for abortions in Africa.

[quote="Joseph_L_Varga, post:12, topic:181844"]
I don't have a problem with those homosexuals who understand the principle, "live and let live".

If you are homosexual, or a straight person concerned about the rights of homosexual people - leave my children alone. Don't prey on them, and don't try to indoctrinate them with your perversions. No little booklets about how Stevie has two daddies, and Mary has two mommies. No coloring books for my children, showing how the penguin chick has two daddies. If you are a teacher - leave my children alone with that trash. Teach them the 3 R's - and that's it. No sex education, no condoms, no gay sensitivity training. No field trips to lesbian commitment ceremonies, for my children. No assignments that require them to watch Brokeback mountain.

If you are a decent homosexual person, and don't start hitting on me, I have no problem working with you as a colleague. Again, just don't expect me to attend your "gay wedding", or watch the photos you snapped on your last vacation with your partner.

But this is just my American and European experience. I have never been to Uganda, or to any other African country. I don't support financially or morally anyone who wants to harrass peaceful homosexual people - whether in the USA, Europe, or in Africa. But I am really worried that politicians who represent the Culture of Death, are using my tax dime to distribute condoms, push the gay agenda, and pay for abortions in Africa.

[/quote]

You reminded me of a gay literature professor I had just last year. When he brought up the fact lots of straight men are worried about gay men hitting on them, he shook his head and said "Ew...no. Not with those clothes."

Honestly, people like you, who seem to think all gay people are child molestors who deserve to be executed by hanging, are the reason "gay sensitivity training," or whatever you want to call it, was even introduced in the first place.

REMINDER

Please discuss the issues and not each other. If members will not stop insulting each other, they will find their accounts suspended.

[quote="Joseph_L_Varga, post:10, topic:181844"]

Hey, haven't we heard the broken record about "I'm personally opposed to abortion, but I don't want to impose my morality on others"? ;)

[/quote]

And don't we all know that this is vile nonsense? So why are you proposing it as a model here?

(Oh, if the problem is that we are "donor countries", here's the simple solution: get the hell out of there. Stop messing with them. They don't want us anyway exporting our perversions to them. And I don't want either my country taxing me and then distributing condoms and brochures about "alternative lifestyles", and sponsoring abortions, using MY TAX $ in foreign countries.

Yes, but the problem according to some liberal journalists is that we are "messing with them." Jeff Sharlet claims that conservative American politicians visit Africa on what appear to be state visits, and then push their religious views, which appear to the Africans to be backed by American power. Now he may be wrong--he may be distorting the facts--but surely this bears looking into.

Edwin

If you look at this insightful comment in the link, you will see that the Ugandan policy is typical for the continent. Just because a couple of Americans went over there and had a conference, doesn't mean that it was Super Whitey that convinced Ugandans to do this. I'm sure Ugandans are perfectly capable of thinking for themselves and don't need to be led around by the nose.

I do not agree with this policy because I am against executions of any kind, in addition to strong libertarian leanings. However, I can certainly say that I find it pure hypocrisy for a "progressive" newspaper like the New York Times to lecture anyone on morality.

I found this quote quite interesting:

Mr. Kaoma was at the conference and said that the three Americans “underestimated the homophobia in Uganda” and “what it means to Africans when you speak about a certain group trying to destroy their children and their families.” “When you speak like that,” he said, “Africans will fight to the death.”

The fact is, we Westerners are cowards. When people threaten to destroy our children and families, we don't "fight to the death". We graciously step out of the way and ask how we can be of help. Or we bury our heads in the sand and hope that they go away on their own. Sickening.

I do not agree with this policy because I am against executions of any kind, in addition to strong libertarian leanings. However, I can certainly say that I find it pure hypocrisy for a "progressive" newspaper like the New York Times to lecture anyone on morality.

Okay, so you say you are opposed to execution. Fair enough.

Would you be supportive of life in prison for homosexual behavior as some Ugandan politicians proposed instead? I ask this with all sincerity since you said you just don't support the death penalty.

I am a libertarian, so obviously not. Vices are not crimes.

My point is that I find the Ugandan reaction to a threat on those they love completely natural and rational. That they are derided as barbaric for this reaction shows how far we have sunk in our own society where true and actual criminal pedophiles can form organizations like NAMBLA where they discuss how to prey on children.

The fact that Ugandans look at our society and recoil in horror and fear speaks volumes. We were once a beacon of light and hope to the world and now they think we’re a bunch of deranged perverts.

My point is that I find the Ugandan reaction to a threat on those they love completely natural and rational.

But what evidence is there that homosexuals are an inherent threat? They're not proposing executing just gay people who have committed crimes against others, but all gay people, for the sole reason that they are gay. How is that in any way shape or form justifiable?

That isn't justifiable, of course. But they are looking at our culture and wondering what went so terribly wrong. Homosexual-rights is just the tip of the iceberg. There is so much more behind it, including simple moral relativism.

I'm saying their reaction to the perceived threat is rational, not that the threat is real.

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