All will be saved


#41

Continuation
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THE FOLLOWING EARLY FATHERS OF THE CHURCH ARE SAID TO HAVE TAUGHT THAT ALL WILL FINALLY BE SAVED
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Pantaenus; Clement of Alexandria; Origen; Athanasius; Didymus the Blind; Macarius of Egypt; Gregory Thaumaturgus; Ambrose; Ephraim; John Chrysostum; Gregory of Nyssa; Gregory of Nazianzus; Jerome of Bethlehem; Evagrius Ponticus; Titus of Bastra; Asterius of Amasea; Cyril; Methodius of Tyre; Pamphilius Eusibius; Hillary of Poitiers; Victorinus; Macrina the Younger; Dionysius the Areopagite; John Cassian; Maximus the Confessor; Proclus of Constantinople; Peter Chrysologus; Diodorus of Tarsus; Stephen bar Sudaili.
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The doctrine of universal salvation has become very popular in the modern Roman Catholic Church and more and more Priests teaching Universal Salvation.
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I believe Pope Francis also agree with universal salvation because he is the one who replaced Cardinal Gerhard Müller who was the prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith until 02/07/2017, with Archbishop Luis F. Ladaria, Jesuit theologian who is openly teaching Universal Salvation since many years.

In my opinion:
If Pope Francis would not believe Universal Salvation, he would not replace Cardinal Gerhard Müller with Archbishop Luis F. Ladaria, Jesuit theologian who is openly teaching Universal Salvation since many years.
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#42

Continuation

There is also a very good book on Universal Salvation:
Jesus Christ Salvation of All by Luis F. Ladaria SJ (Author)

EDITORIAL REVIEWS
"Luis F. Ladaria SJ presents a powerful statement openly advocating the doctrine of universal salvation.
His advocacy of universal salvation is openly and undeniably proclaimed." – David Sielaff, Associates for Scriptural Knowledge, ASK " David Sielaff, Associates for Scriptural Knowledge, ASK"
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ABOUT THE AUTHOR
Archbishop Luis F. Ladaria, a Jesuit theologian who is the Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, has been a professor of theology at the Pontifical Gregorian University of Rome since 1984.

He was also a professor at the Comillas University in Madrid, and from 1992 to 1997 he was a member of the International Theological Commission.

Since 2004 he has been the general secretary of that commission. His works have greatly contributed to contemporary theological debates.

Archbishop Ladaria has been secretary, the second in command, of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith since 2008 until 02/07/2017 and from this date on Pope Francis appointed Ladaria SJ. to the position of the Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.
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Jesus Christ Salvation of All by Luis F. Ladaria SJ.
Quote: Jesus includes everyone and excludes no one, and all of us have received his fullness (cfr. John 1:16).

The universality of salvation and unity of Christ’s mediation mutually affirm each other [p. 144].

Yet by dying, he gave us life, that is the life of his resurrection.
Even those who do not know him are called to this divine vocation, that is, to the perfect son-ship in and through Christ.

Christians and non-Christians reach this goal by virtue of the gift of the Spirit that associates us with the unique paschal ministry of Christ even if it is through diverse paths known only to God [p. 148-149]. End quote.
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#43

Continuation

WITHOUT GOING INTO THE FINE DETAILS

The whole creation (Eph.1:10; Col.1:20) will be restored by recreation including all Nations/every member of the entire human race and they will have eternal life in the recreated New Earth.
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Only the Church/Bride of Christ goes to heaven, but even the Bride of Christ will comes down from heaven with Christ at His Second Coming and He will rule over all Nations with His Bride.
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Christ will rule aver the nations with the Saints/Body of Christ/Church.

Dan.7:13-14;
13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven.
He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence.

14 He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.
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Dan.7:21-22;
21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against the holy people and defeating them,

22 until the Ancient of Days came and pronounced judgment in favor of the holy people of the Most High, and the time came when they possessed the kingdom.
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CCC 677 The kingdom will be fulfilled, then, not by a historic triumph of the Church through a progressive ascendancy, but only by God’s victory over the final unleashing of evil, which will cause his Bride to come down from heaven.
God’s triumph over the revolt of evil will take the form of the Last Judgment after the final cosmic upheaval of this passing world.
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Dan.7:27;
27 Then the sovereignty, power and greatness of all the kingdoms under heaven will be handed over to the holy people of the Most High.
His kingdom will be an everlasting kingdom, and all rulers will worship and obey him.
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#44

Continuation
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Is.2:4;
He will judge between the nations
and will settle disputes for many peoples.
They will beat their swords into plowshares
and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will not take up sword against nation,
nor will they train for war anymore.
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THE NEW EARTH AND THE NEW HEAVEN WILL BECOME ONE IN CHRIST

Revelation 21:2, 10, 24, 26;
2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.

10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God.

24 The nations will walk by its light, and the kings of the earth (Bride of Christ) will bring their splendor into it. In the brackets added.

26 The glory and honor of the nations will be brought into it.
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If there is no Universal Salvation and the nations are not saved, Christ will come down from heaven with His Bride to rule over all the Nations, and if the Nations are in hell, Christ with His Bride will rule over whom???
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Can anyone even imagine, according with God’s Eternal Plan and Will, God authorized Satan to deceive Adam and Eve, to covert the outcome of that evil “Fall” and the EVIL AFTER EFFECTS a GREATER GOOD FOR THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE, and that “greater good” would be; apart from a few people UNIVERSAL HELL???
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#45

Continuation
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SUMMARY

GOD’S ETERNAL PLAN AND HIS WILL IS: Universal Salvation!!!
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2 Pet.3:9; The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness.
Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.
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The conditions of our repentance are, FIRST to receive God’s grace of Justification CCCS (1990-1991) and The Grace of God’s Call (1996-1998)].
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God’s grace of Justification CCCS (1990-1991) and The Grace of God’s Call are irresistible graces. – Predestination of the elect, which is a DE FIDE Dogma + THE THEORY OF PREDESTINATION prævisa merita.
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God’s grace of Justification CCCS (1990-1991) and The Grace of God’s Call (1996-1998) PRECEDES our first repentance!!! – This theological FACT alone more then enough proof of Universal Salvation.
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God wants all of us to repent, but for us to repent, FIRST we need to receive God’s IRRESISTIBLE and IRREVOCABLE graces of Justification CCCS (1990-1991) and The IRRESISTIBLE and IRREVOCABLE Grace of God’s Call (1996-1998) which graces (not just enable us to repent but) PRODUCE our first repentance.

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The above two graces PRECEDES our first repentance, with other words, NO ONE can repent without FIRST to receive the above two graces, because without the above two graces, we are un-regenerated, slaves of sin and we are spiritually dead in our sins.
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Phil.2:13; “For it is God who works in you BOTH TO WILL and TO ACT for His good pleasure.”
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Universal Salvation 100 % depends on God’s will and His actions in us.
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IF God gives everyone His IRRESISTIBLE and IRREVOCABLE graces of
(1) God’s grace of Justification, (1990-1991),
(2)The Grace of God’s Call (1996-1998),
(3) God’s special grace The Gift of Final Perseverance,
then Universal Salvation is an absolute certainty, IF God gives these graces only to a few people, then apart from a few people, Universal Hell is also an absolute certainty. – Predestination of the elect, which is a DE FIDE Dogma + Infallible teachings of the Trent.
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So, Universal Salvation or apart from a few people Universal Hell is SOLELY in God’s hands.
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PROOF
If even one elect in all Christian history, would/could resist the above graces would end up in hell and God would instantly lose His omniscience.DE FIDE Dogma (the highest level of binding theological certainty).
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#46

Continuation
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GOD’S GRACE to call His children/elect to Salvation coming totally from God’s decision and it is IRRESISTIBLE and IRREVOCABLE graces.DE FIDE Dogma.
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When God calls and draws an un-regenerated/carnal man into His service/salvation WITHOUT stimulus, merit, or condition and without regard to any future supernatural merits, His calling is backed up with an ABSOLUTE DECREE and in consequence of this DECREE, God gives them all the graces necessary for its accomplishment.DE FIDE Dogma. + Infallible teachings of the Trent. + God’s free gift of Justification CCCS (1990-1991). + The Grace of God’s Call CCCS (1996-1998).
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THE COUNCIL OF TRENT Session 6 Chapter 8
. . . None of those things which precede justification - whether faith or works - merit the grace itself of justification.
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John 15:16; You did not chose Me, but I chose you.
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John 15:5; “… for without Me you can do nothing.
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Strictly speaking only a person in the STATE OF GRACE can merit, as defined by the Church (Denzinger 1576, 1582).
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MEANING, man does NOTHING and can do NOTHING to enter the state of Initial Justification/Irrevocable Salvation.
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IT MEANS:
The Grace of God’s Call (1996-1998)
Justification comes from grace (God’s free and undeserved help) and is given to us to respond to his call.

This call to eternal life is supernatural, coming totally from God’s decision and surpassing all power of human intellect and will. End quote.
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Our Initial Justification/Irrevocable Salvation coming totally from God’s decision and after our Initial Justification/Irrevocable Salvation our ability to say YES to God’s call is produced (not just enabled) by God’s operation.
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In other words, when God commands, He capacities the hearer to respond.

Yet the ability to respond is also His gift.
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Universal Salvation is the ETERNAL PLAN AND THE WILL OF GOD!!!
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1 Tim.2:3-4; This is good, and pleases God our Savior, WHO WANTS ALL PEOPLE TO BE SAVED and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
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God bless you NoelFitz and God bless every readers of the CAF.

Latin


#47

God bless Superblue and God bless every readers of the CAF.
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God’s children/elect cannot lose their salvation.DE FIDE Dogma.
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As God’s children/elect we will all stand before the Judgment Seat and our works will be judged. – 1 Cor.3:12-15.
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As we cannot lose our salvation, our salvation is not at stake at the judgment.
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If our works is up to the standard of supernatural works/works of love, we will receive rewards in heaven.

If our works are not up to the standard of supernatural works/works of love, and even if all our works rejected by God as faithless graceless works, then no reward in heaven, yet we still enter into heaven.
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This is a great loss because God determines our glory and position in heaven according to the outcome of the judgment of our works.
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My view is; when we read anything important concerning theology and we are not sure, we should test it with the teachings of the Church and with the Scripture.
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God never intended for one single person to end up in Hell.

It is NOT God’s will that anyone should perish in their sins and go to Hell.
“The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, NOT WILLING THAT ANY SHOULD PERISH, but that ALL should come to REPENTANCE” (2 Peter 3:9; etc.).
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God bless you Superblue and God bless every readers of the CAF.

Latin


#48

ALL WILL BE SAVED, is condemned by the Church.

It is a heresy.

The dangers of universalism (all will be saved)

People misinterpret or misrepresent what even popes write
http://www.catholicworldreport.com/2013/05/23/pope-francis-teaches-that-everyone-is-saved-wow-hold-on-wait-a-second/


#49

Thanks for the thoughtful reply.

I DO disagree with the Pope on chapter 8’s infamous footnote.

Not even the Pope CAN changes God’s, the Bibles, Canon Law, the Catechism and Sacred Tradition of the Magisterium; NOR are we positive that he desires too; though it does seem to be that way.

Know that I pray for Pope Francis daily.

God Bless you,
Patrick


#50

What’s your point? Nobody claims “all will be saved.”

What is claimed is that even the worst sinners may be moved by God’s grace to repent before they die. Do you deny this truth?


#51

I would like to address three major points here from the OPQ

  1. [QUOTE]ALL will be saved[/QUOTE]

2.[QUOTE]These people have been a cause of concern since it may have seemed they were rejected by the Church[/QUOTE]

3.[QUOTE]Amoris Laetitia also seems to show that the Pope believes that all will be saved[/QUOTE]

[1] The philosophy that “All will be saved” is wrong. It is illogical and immoral as well as unbiblical.

It denies the very nature of Sin as being man’s freewill choice; and God essential Justice, which MAY be tempered with Divine Mercy, but cannot remove in total GODS absolute need for Divine Justice. The “Temporal Punishment” that ALL sins cause God to impose is evidence that that.

The bible’s NT teaches often about Hell and it’s Eternal punishment.

The FACT that God DESIRES that all men be saved reflects ONLY God’s Perfect love of His created humanity.1 Tim:3-4; NOT that He will or in Divine Justice even CAN somehow overlook ALL of humanities SINS. Even in the OT times God requires that His Chosen Peoples sins be confesses to a priest… Exo 22:1, Lev 5: 16-18; which is now perfected in the Catholic Priesthood as the NORM for sin forgiveness. 1 Jn 1: 6-7, 1 Jn 5: 16-17 & John 20: 19-23

[2] To claim that married and then civilly divorced, gay’s and active homosexual are “rejected” by the RCC is to be unaware of the TRUTH.

ALL ARE WELCOME in the RCC; but actions do, as they MUST, have consequences. TRUTH as Pope Benedict XVI points out: “THERE CAN’T BE YOUR TRUTH & MY TRUTH OR THERE WOULD BE NO TRUTH”, clearly articulates ALL that is possible for any issue or ideology, or faith to actually BE, GOD"S Truths.
T
Fr. John Hardon [a former pt mentor of mine] taught this about truth: “TRUTH IS THE CONDITION OF GRACE, IT IS THE CHANNEL OF GRACE, IT IS THE DIVINELY ORDAINED REQUIREMENT OF GRACE”

It is because grace is offered but not accepted that some find themselves willfully outside FULL-Communion [meaning unable to participate licitly in ALL of Her Sacraments.] These are PERSONAL life-style choices; that CANNOT logically, or morally be blamed on “The Church.”

[3] “Amoris Laetitia also seems to show that the Pope believes that all will be saved”

Having read the document about a year ago; and having followed very closely the ensuing debates; there does seem to be a papal propensity to somehow expand the Natural Moral Laws, and the Sacred Tradition of the Magesterium, which he CANNOT do, to accommodate these sinful souls.But even if he were able to do so; IT WOULD NOT MEAL ALL SOULS WOULD SOMEHOW MAGICALLY BE SAVED.

God Bless you,
Patrick

. as manyas is licitly possible in all of the Sacramene


#52

My point has been clear from the beginning. What is YOUR point?

You previously responded to my post

One who hopes for that which he believes impossible suffers from cognitive dissonance. Matthew 19:26.

My response,

Since Jesus says only a few are saved, and we don’t know who the few are, that’s the key point, we pray for everyone. That’s a good and holy act. It’s not a contradictory, nor inconsistent behavior or attitude to have.

I’m not sure who you were accusing of cognitive dissonance, so I said the following emphasis added

Now if I knew exactly who was saved and not saved and I prayed for everyone, THAT prayer for the unsaved then would be useless.

that said
Cognitive dissonance = inconsistent thoughts, beliefs, or attitudes, especially as relating to behavioral decisions and attitude change.

What I’ve been saying, is not inconsistent with Church teaching relating to behavior, and attitude


#53

Nor is the theologian inconsistent that I quoted: Balthasar.
The Church does not teach that any human is in hell and leaves open the the larger question of the population of hell.


#54

Maybe you haven’t been reading the links I provided

here’s 1


a key point in that explanation is

the universalist argument

strikes against God's truthfulness to suggest that Scripture is full of warnings—especially warnings concerning salvation—that are empty, since God never allows anyone to fulfill the requisite conditions. The "let's make major themes of Scripture purely hypothetical" hermeneutic is not convincing when it is used by Protestants to advocate their agendas; neither is it here. It would also seem cruel of God to warn people they may go to hell, and let them be afraid of this, when it has no chance of happening.

And universalism is a heresy.

That said

Can be saved ≠ will be saved

even when adding All in front of it


#55

exactly, the theory of universalism, makes no sense.


#56

Humanity is doing much worse. Only a few according to Jesus, make it to heaven.


#57

God bless you Steve and God bless every readers of the CAF.
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Salvation is a very serious matter, we all need as much knowledge about it as much as possible.
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There is a man his name is David, he is an atheist, his way is destruction and misery (Rom.3:16), his mind is enmity against God (Rom.8:7), he accepts nothing from the Spirit of God, it is foolishness to him (1 Cor.2:14), he is spiritually dead in his sins (Col.2:13), he cannot discern between his right hand and his left (Jonah 4:11).
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God decided to save David and when he dies his home will be heaven.
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I’m sure we all like to learn from you Steve.
Please Steve explain to us, in the sequence of events from the beginning until David dies, what is God’s role in David’s salvation and in the sequence of events what is David’s role in his salvation.
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Thank you in advance.

I believe your explanation doesn’t against the thread title and I also believe brother NoelFitz like to read your explanations as well.
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God bless you Steve and God bless every readers of the CAF.

Latin


#58

My Dad said that he once browsed a supermarket book about a Protestant Pastor’s meeting with Jesus. He asked, “Lord, out of the numerous universes your hands have make, how do we (humanity) compare to other sentient creatures?” Allegedly, I would consider this religious fiction, Jesus responded calmly “To put it in Human terms, you’re difficult “.


#59

Or as St. Joan of Arc said…

About Jesus Christ and the Church, I simply know they’re just one thing, and we shouldn’t complicate the matter

We sure do complicate the matter.

Jesus warned about sin, satan and hell. I’m guessing for a reason.


#60

The possibility of Hell must be real. If not, then God is a monster.


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