Allah says to tax and destroy the Jews and Christians

This is a part of Islam that a lot of us fine non-Muslims have problems with.

[9.29] Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.
[9.30] And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!

Why would God need tax money? This doesn’t sound like an order coming from God but rather an order coming from a King or an aristocrat. It translates pretty clearly to: “Hey if they aren’t like us tax them or kill them”. Also I would like to point out that the Jews never believed Uzair was divine as Christians believe Jesus was divine as it says in 9:30 above so The Quran is wrong there. I would like to ask the Muslims here if they believe that I as a Catholic needs to be taxed or destroyed.

Thank you!

God needed a lot of things for a lot of years and tax money sure sounds better than burnt offerings as far as I am concerned.

The koran is wrong in many places. The tax for the Jews and Christians still goes on today in the middle east.

Tax money is one thing, being ridiculed as a second class citizen is another because islam dominates. Christian babies in Egypt are tatooed with a cross on their wrist to “label” them.

Reminds me of the nazi’s with the Star of David on the Jews as they were being collected for you know what.

We as Christians and Jews are nothing to islam - islam is superior - and if you an athiest, you are way lower than Jews and Christians.

Where can I read about the Christian babies being tattooed in Egypt? Is that true? What is the purpose of labeling them?

Does it make you just as uncomfortable to know that under Christian law it was illegal for Jews to share their faith with a Christian? Such Jews were tortured and killed. And that it was illegal for a Christian to convert to Judaism, and that converts were tortured and then burned at the stake by the church? Nor were they even allowed to be buried, but their ashes scattered.

Would you like to hear about the forced conversions of Jews, and the slaughter that ensued when Jews refuesed?

Would you like to hear about the pogroms, the wholescale slaughter of villages of Jews by christians, for no other reason than that they were Christ-Killers who used the blood of Christian children to make matzah?

When you understand that paying taxes under Islam was much more merciful to Jews than living with Christians, THEN you will truly understand. At least with the Muslims the Jews could give them the tax money and be left alone.

I did read about a catholic man who wanted to marry a jewish woman back in the 40’s. He was told it could not be done, and not in the catholic church, and that if he did so he would be outside the church for doing it.
He ended up becoming an atheist.
And, they still married.

How awful!!! Getting involved with gentile women has always been the curse of the Jews.

Hi Prod,
This thread isn’t about Christian crimes that might have happened hundreds of years ago or about Muslims invading other countries and taxing non Muslims under diress. You can start a new thread on that if you would like though. As a side note of course if those things happened you say happened I find that awful.

Someone doesn’t like being shot back with an accusation :knight2:

No, it is more like having a problem with people who compare centuries old history to what is still going on in Islam. And also, comparing the bad deeds of others to justify, or even deflect from their bad deeds, is called just another excuse (or tu quoque). The bad deed(s) are still bad deeds.

And you need to go to the basic teachings. The Christians who were being bad were not following the teachings of Jesus. While the Muslims who are actually following Islam are being good Muslims. Bad muslims are ones who do not follow the bad and immoral man, Muhammed, or the Quran. Read it and wake up.

No, actually the difference is that the above quote is from the Koran itself! in other words this is what Islam actually teaches.

Nowhere in the Catholic Faith does it teach to hate or fight people of other religions. Yes, the church has been gulity of this in the past but that emphasises the fact that we are sinners, that’s all. The bible says “Love your neighbour, and pray for those that persecute you!”.

I think that’s a far more better message then what is written in the Koran. You making a judgement on peoples conduct and jnot what the actual faith teaches.

Reading the New Testament, there is an absolute lack of anti Jewishness, despite Christians being persecuted at the time. I suppose a large part of its absence in the Christian scriptures was that Christians considered themselves Jewish at the beginning of Christianity and they were obviously pre-occupied about what Jesus meant to them.

Still, i also would like to hear about the Jews treated badly by Christians, or Christian kingdoms or specifically the church. I know the church helped Jews in their most desperate hour - the holocaust, but would generally like to hear the cases where Christians were not as they should have been. Please start another thread for this.

So, if a Christian is bad, he can’t be a Christian, but if a Muslim is bad, he is still a Muslim? I am not liking your sense of fairness here.

I am awake, if I wasn’t I wouldn’t be talking with you.

You still don’t get it do you?
If a christian sins then he is still a christian, if he is a christian and doesn’t sin then he is still a christian, the same goes for muslims.

The difference bareknuckler once again is what each faith teaches, Christianity says turn the other cheek while islam says an eye for an eye.

Sorry you don’t like Islam’s difference :shrug:.

Your comments are always so smug and prideful for a Taoist:shrug: What dont you get about the difference between what is taught as doctrine through a Holy book and is current with that which christians aknowlege as wrong and sinful and not from God and in the past… Where as Islam will show you the writing that allows them to tax, kill, enslave and behead.

Yes because the tension is so much greater between the Christians and Jews rather than the Muslems and Jews these days… (sarcasm)

The difference bareknuckler once again is what each faith teaches, Christianity says turn the other cheek while islam says an eye for an eye.

** Islam says an eye for an eye and Judaism also says an eye for an eye. So where do you stand? You are the odd one out with impractical theology.

The original policy for Jesus was also an eye for an eye because he was following the Law of Moses faithfully. He was a Jew. He advised the jews to be kind and not to be too harsh and hard on the exact words of the Law. But that to use some sense and love too. That was a good advice, if it could be followed. It is the best to offer the other cheek but not always possible. It is quite impractical. Even the Christians did not and do not act according to that advice of Jesus.

It is only present in the bible in words only. No other use. P C was right in complaining about the persecution of the Jews at the hands of the christians. **

I think that when you read its texts you should then come back and discuss this. YOu will find out what many are trying to tell you is that - yes, what you just wrote is correct.

What has fairness to do with this? It is in their texts, and that I cannot help. One needs to read the Quran and at least the hadiths and Ishaq to be able to put it together because without the hadiths (at least Bukhari) and Ishaq to put some sense to the Quran - the Quran is mostly nonsensical rants. Mein Kampf was better written but has the same message, with less violence violence, or a call to it, than the Quran. Yes, I have read that too.

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