Anti-Church Teaching Talk Today


#1

Today at Mass they had a “Distiguished Preacher Series” person come and speak. The talk was given after Communion, but the priest, instead of giving a homily (uh-oh), just informed everyone that the speaker would talk after Communion.

The talk itself was not bad. The speaker teaches at University of Chicago Divinity School. She talked about American Catholics. In her talk, there was nothing that alarmed me.

But afterwards, I had concerns about some of the answers she gave during a question/answer session that followed the Mass. About 20 people stayed for this. Several asked questions. At least three of them made comments preceeding their questions that sounded very liberal. It was this lady’s answers that got me. She criticized the Pope, talking about that Jesuit who left that magazine like it was the Pope’s fault. She mentioned women’s ordination. Later she was talking about homosexuality, and how that Church teaching is “just based on a few verses in the Old Testament”.

Can you believe this? I am very surprised that this was allowed in the Church. One of the priests was sitting right there.

I am sadly disappointed in this. This is that same church where I finally talked with the main priest about VOTF and those comments in the local newspaper, where he explained that he did not mean church doctrine should be changed. Yet the church allows this kind of talk. I plan on writing a note to the priest about this, but I am more and more discouraged about this parish.

Everything is all timely though (God’s timing, I believe) because just last night I went to my friend’s daughter’s Confirmation at a different parish that is closer to home. It was so wonderful. The choir sang beautiful music, some in Latin. All the kids walked in followed by the priests and finally the Bishop, with his wooden staff.

I have been to this church before a few weeks ago, and never saw any liturgical abuses. The only reason I didn’t immediately start going to this church is because when I first went back to the RCC, I wanted to go further away and be anonymous so I didn’t have to answer people’s questions since I had been away so long. At the problem church, I initially liked what I saw and continued attending there, but then all these things came up, making me see that it is quite the liberal church. So I think I will be attending the closer church afterall, which is great because it is very close to home and I do know people there (which is now a good thing, since I don’t mind the questions anymore, although no one act surprised to see me there).

Later today I was at a gathering of friends. A conversation came up with one of the women who works for a Catholic University. She was saying how the nuns there didn’t like the new Pope, how they feel women should be ordained, etc. So two times today I have had to put up with liberal Catholics.


#2

Aunt Martha,

Oh, dear. I’m sorry that it has turned out this way. At this point unless the priest next Sunday pretty much disavows anything heterodox that the lady said and mentions that she will not be invited back, I would join the person who said to run, don’t walk, to another church.

The door has been pretty much closed officially regarding women as priests. The Church’s teachings on homosexuality are quite thoroughly rooted in Tradition and the teachings on marriage and the family. A church official talking as if either of these was not the case is a Very Bad Thing.

If the other church you mentioned is nearer your home, perhaps God wants you there.

  • Liberian

#3

Right the priest a very cordial letter. If you don’t get a favorable response (you will likely get none if he in fact is liberal) then write the bishop explaining what happened.

Is there any real Catholic meat in the sermons or are they just fluff. Many times when there is liberalism in a parish you don’t hear alot of preaching on sin, especially contraceptoin. Lot’s of talk about, cant we all just get along and Luv, luv, luv, All ya need is luv. And oh aren’t you wonderful people today. The Lord is with you. Sin, that’s old school. Is the sacrament of reconcilliatoin promoted? If this is the case, yes, run.

Blessings


#4

Call your pastor and ask him what’s up and voice your distress.


#5

You could tell the lady that if the nuns don’t like the ordination of men only, they can become a minister elsewhere, but they’d have to give up being a nun. I’d be interested to hear the reply. Thanks and God Bless.


#6

[quote=AuntMartha] Later today I was at a gathering of friends. A conversation came up with one of the women who works for a Catholic University. She was saying how the nuns there didn’t like the new Pope, how they feel women should be ordained, etc. So two times today I have had to put up with liberal Catholics.
[/quote]

I would shake the dust off my feet and move on to someplace more conducive to my peace of mind. On the other hand though these “liberals” have to put up with you. Nothing like mutual pain to stimulate learning.


#7

[quote=slinky1882]You could tell the lady that if the nuns don’t like the ordination of men only, they can become a minister elsewhere, but they’d have to give up being a nun. I’d be interested to hear the reply. Thanks and God Bless.
[/quote]

All this ordination of women stuff started the gears grinding in my head.

Are most Sisters really just Priest wanna-be’s?

Or are the can’t-be’s drowning out the Sisters who are busy with God’s work? It seems we hear from so few Sisters.

Looking back, I didn’t learn my faith from Priests, I learned it from the Sisters! It seems all good decisions I’ve made in my life are rooted in what the Sisters taught me.

It has taken me only half a century to realize it.

And it was only after I grew older and thought I knew more than the Sisters (and everyone else) that I started making the really big mistakes.

I miss the Sisters.


#8

[quote=mark a]All this ordination of women stuff started the gears grinding in my head.

Are most Sisters really just Priest wanna-be’s?

Or are the can’t-be’s drowning out the Sisters who are busy with God’s work? It seems we hear from so few Sisters.

Looking back, I didn’t learn my faith from Priests, I learned it from the Sisters! It seems all good decisions I’ve made in my life are rooted in what the Sisters taught me.

It has taken me only half a century to realize it.

And it was only after I grew older and thought I knew more than the Sisters (and everyone else) that I started making the really big mistakes.

I miss the Sisters.
[/quote]

Are most, no I don’t think so, but you are right we hear from all the loud ones. I am younger so I have little firect experience with sisters other than being the principal when I was real young. If they really want to be ordained so badly, why are they nuns is my question??? Thanks and God Bless.


#9

[quote=AuntMartha]Today at Mass they had a “Distiguished Preacher Series” person come and speak. The talk was given after Communion, but the priest, instead of giving a homily (uh-oh), just informed everyone that the speaker would talk after Communion.

But afterwards, I had concerns about some of the answers she gave during a question/answer session that followed the Mass. About 20 people stayed for this. Several asked questions. At least three of them made comments preceeding their questions that sounded very liberal. It was this lady’s answers that got me. She criticized the Pope, talking about that Jesuit who left that magazine like it was the Pope’s fault. She mentioned women’s ordination. Later she was talking about homosexuality, and how that Church teaching is “just based on a few verses in the Old Testament”.

Can you believe this? I am very surprised that this was allowed in the Church. One of the priests was sitting right there.
[/quote]

:eek: :eek: :bigyikes: :bigyikes: :bigyikes:
if this happened to me, i would think of running away the moment i realized what was happening. i can’t believe something like this happened inside a church, during Mass, and on a Sunday!:tsktsk:


#10

AuntMartha

When I returned to the RCC I chose the larger of the two RCC’s I could attend. The main reason I chose the larger one was that I could talk to the priest and knew he did not just tell me what I wanted to hear. I needed to hear the truth and grow from there. My DH and I had our marrage blessed, our DD and SIL were married there and we have had many blessings there also. The Fr., that was so special to us all, died suddenly and we miss him dearly.

This same parish has now become so liberal and allows many of the things that you are worried about. So, sad as it was for me I moved to the smaller parish. (now don’t think I was shopping for a parish, we live in the country and our house is considered to be on the dividing line). My daughter was and still is a member of the smaller parish and the change was easy for me.

So do as the Holy Spirit leads you. As you said

Everything is all timely though (God’s timing, I believe) because just last night I went to my friend’s daughter’s Confirmation at a different parish that is closer to home. It was so wonderful. The choir sang beautiful music, some in Latin. …


#11

[quote=AuntMartha]Today at Mass they had a “Distiguished Preacher Series” person come and speak. The talk was given after Communion, but the priest, instead of giving a homily (uh-oh), just informed everyone that the speaker would talk after Communion.

The talk itself was not bad. The speaker teaches at University of Chicago Divinity School. She talked about American Catholics. In her talk, there was nothing that alarmed me.
[/quote]

Man, where do I even start?

For one, it is never licit for a lay person to give a homily.
Two, it is never licit to forego a homily and replace it with a "talk."
Three, Mass is certainly not the proper place for such a "talk."
Four, this woman is not even a teacher at a Catholic University. The U of Chicago Divinity School is mainly Baptist (and a liberal branch at that).

Can you believe this? I am very surprised that this was allowed in the Church. One of the priests was sitting right there.

I really wish this surprised me, but it’s completely usual in these sinful days.

Later today I was at a gathering of friends. A conversation came up with one of the women who works for a Catholic University. She was saying how the nuns there didn’t like the new Pope, how they feel women should be ordained, etc. So two times today I have had to put up with liberal Catholics.

There is no such thing as a “liberal” Catholic-- or a conservative Catholic for that matter. You’re either fully Catholic or you aren’t. Think women should be ordained? Sounds like you’re Episcopalian.

I’ll never understand this almost race-like sense in which people define themselves as Catholic. You can meet someone who was baptized Catholic as an infant, but hasnt set foot in Church for 35 yrs, and they’ll tell you they’re Catholic . . . and give you their opinion on the Church.

Give me a break. You’re defined by your beliefs. Baptized Catholic, but now you don’t believe God exists? You’re not a Catholic who “disagrees” with the Church’s teaching about the existence of God, you’re an atheist!!

Same goes for “nuns” or anyone else who professes to be Catholic, but then goes on to claim that they “disagree” with Church teaching on abortion, homosexuality, etc etc.

There is no such thing as a Catholic who believes in women’s ordination. Anyone who claims to be one is by default not a Catholic.


#12

Thanks for the replies. Here’s what happened today. A lady who helped arrange the details for the speaker called me back to discuss my concerns. I would have rather spoken to the priest, but she assured me she would share my thoughts with him. I told her all the details. This is sort of weird - I had written down some notes for myself, so that I would not forget anything when they called. On the back of the sheet of my notes was written the following in my handwriting, but I don’t remember writing it or where I saw it:
“Her answers did not reflect or explain church teaching; the answers simply argued against church teaching.”

So I don’t know if I copied it from a post someone wrote on this forum, or if I thought it up myself and wrote it down without remembering! Anyway, that’s what I started with.

She told me that they had the speaker in the Sanctuary because they have the best sound system in there (hmmm). She told me she understood my concerns (although I got the impression she didn’t agree with what I was saying). I also told her I got the impression that this Church was a more “liberal” parish. She said there are a fair amount of more liberal-minded people there, but there was also a lot of conservatives as well.

I asked her to please have the priest call me if possible.

As I have been thinking this through, I wondered if at that particular church if perhaps the liberal Catholics were overshadowing the conservative ones. I remember one poster on this forum who mentioned something to the effect that he wanted to remain at his ultra-liberal church as the lone voice of preserving the liturgy. For me, that would be too hard at this present time. I am curious if anyone else having concerns about all of this.

It was so odd, because at that question/answer session, one of the people who was making liberal comments was saying something like, “The Church is not responding to its people. I don’t know if I should go or stay.” But the Church IS responding - people just aren’t liking the answers.

One thing I am so confused about is this:

I had left the RCC almost 18 years ago back when I was buying into all these feminist ideas like abortion on demand, hating men as authority figures, etc. As time went on and I became a believer, these ideas began to pale, and then eventually I saw that the feminists were wrong, abortion was wrong, and so forth. Then when I began to look into the RCC again with an open mind, and read books and heard tapes, I saw that the Church was right after all and I was ready to be a Catholic again, and embrace the Church’s teachings. I could have chosen a faith that was less firm on its principles, but the RCC was the one that fit. So what I don’t understand is why these people who are so against the Church’s teachings - why do they still want to be Catholic? What is it that they don’t want to give up, that prevents them from leaving. (BTW, I don’t want to see people leave the Church, I just don’t get why they are staying under these circumstances.)

I talked to my friend yesterday from the more conservative church. She said that there is a group of parishioners who attend Mass daily and sit right up front. She said that they keep a close eye on things and make a fuss if they see anything that is not right. So this church does stick to the GIRM, according to my friend! It’s plain to me now that this is where I should go.


#13

[quote=AuntMartha]So what I don’t understand is why these people who are so against the Church’s teachings - why do they still want to be Catholic?
[/quote]

Maybe they want to be reformers. Maybe deep down they fight the same self rightiousness the rest of us fight.

I gotta admit that having people focus on MY opinions and tell me I am right, that I am da man, has a certain appeal. And if I ever get a taste of it . . . .you had better watch out!!! . . . . well, to have power is to abuse it.


#14

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