Are Non-Catholic weddings valid?


#1

This has probably been asked before but I’m just curious. Like, I know Las Vegas weddings are degrading and really arent dignified but what about weddings of
Anglican, Lutheran, Methodist, Hinduism, Hebrew etc etc etc. I’m
Pretty sure they are because they are dignified and pleasing to
God.


#2

[quote="callmeChris, post:1, topic:302573"]
This has probably been asked before but I'm just curious. Like, I know Las Vegas weddings are degrading and really aren't dignified but what about weddings of Anglican, Lutheran, Methodist, Hinduism, Hebrew etc etc etc. I'm
pretty sure they are because they are dignified and pleasing to
God.

[/quote]

Providing there are no impediments like previous marriages to still-living spouses or close kinship, non-Catholic marriages are presumed valid.

It doesn't matter if they were celebrated in front of a judge, an Elvis impersonator or a member of a non-Catholic clergy, if they're legal they're presumed valid.


#3

And not only (given Phemie's description) are they valid, but they may also be sacramental.

I'm not a canon lawyer, so I'll avoid going into details.


#4

This, but valid doesn’t mean sacramental in these cases.

Also, if either the man or woman is Catholic, it’s a grave sin.


#5

[quote="Rich_C, post:4, topic:302573"]
This, but valid doesn't mean sacramental in these cases.

Also, if either the man or woman is Catholic, it's a grave sin.

[/quote]

For baptized non-Catholics without an impediment, they are both valid and sacramental. In cases where you have a baptized non-Catholic and someone not baptized and there are no impediments, it would be valid, but not sacramental. If either or both parties is Catholic, such marriages, without dispensations, are invalid, and therefore, not sacramental.


#6

When one of them is Catholic it is invalid.


#7

[quote="Rich_C, post:4, topic:302573"]

                 Originally Posted by **Phemie**
                 [forums.catholic.com/images/buttons_khaki/viewpost.gif]("http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?p=9919334#post9919334")                 
             Providing there are no impediments  like previous marriages to still-living spouses or close kinship,  non-Catholic marriages are presumed valid. 

It doesn't matter if they were celebrated in front of a judge, an Elvis impersonator or a member of a non-Catholic clergy, if they're legal they're presumed valid. This, but valid doesn't mean sacramental in these cases.

Also, if either the man or woman is Catholic, it's a grave sin.

[/quote]

With non-Catholics, "sacramental" depends on the baptismal status of the spouses, not where the marriage is celebrated. A baptized Anglican marrying a non-baptized person in a High Anglican ceremony doesn't produce a sacramental marriage but two baptized Anglicans marrying in Las Vegas in front of an Elvis impersonator does produce a sacramental marriage.


#8

[quote="Andre1000, post:6, topic:302573"]
When one of them is Catholic it is invalid.

[/quote]

Sometimes, but not always.


#9

Code of Canon Law says

Can. 1060 Marriage possesses the favor of law; therefore, in a case of doubt, the validity of a marriage must be upheld until the contrary is proven.

Don't confuse valid with licit. Valid asks did it happen. Licit asks should it have happened the way it did.


#10

Why are we saying what is Sacramental or not for those who are not Catholics? :shrug: Why do we care? And do they care?


#11

That’s true, but very rare. They deal with exceptional circumstances: emergencies, being stuck on Gilligan’s Island, etc.


#12

[quote="ConstantineTG, post:10, topic:302573"]
Why are we saying what is Sacramental or not for those who are not Catholics? :shrug:

[/quote]

Because it is an objective reality.

[quote="ConstantineTG, post:10, topic:302573"]
Why do we care?

[/quote]

Because Truth matters.

[quote="ConstantineTG, post:10, topic:302573"]
And do they care?

[/quote]

Not really relevant.


#13

[quote="ValPal, post:11, topic:302573"]
That's true, but very rare. They deal with exceptional circumstances: emergencies, being stuck on Gilligan's Island, etc.

[/quote]

If I was stuck on Gilligan's Island I'd be wondering if Bigamy was valid!:p

Unfortunately I'm that old!


#14

[quote="callmeChris, post:1, topic:302573"]
This has probably been asked before but I'm just curious. Like, I know Las Vegas weddings are degrading and really arent dignified but what about weddings of
Anglican, Lutheran, Methodist, Hinduism, Hebrew etc etc etc. I'm
Pretty sure they are because they are dignified and pleasing to
God.

[/quote]

Yes, they can be.

There must be no impediments of divine or natural law. Non-Catholics are not bound by merely Catholic ecclesiastical law.

I believe the Church would expect the laws of the state where the marriage took place to have been observed.

If both spouses were validly baptised non-Catholic Christians, in addition to being valid, it would be a sacrament, too.


#15

[quote="Andre1000, post:6, topic:302573"]
When one of them is Catholic it is invalid.

[/quote]

It depends on whether the Catholic had the necessary dispensations or not. A Catholic with a dispensation from canonical form marries another baptized person validly and sacramentally in someone's garden with a justice of the peace as the officiant.


#16

[quote="Rich_C, post:4, topic:302573"]
This, but valid doesn't mean sacramental in these cases.

Also, if either the man or woman is Catholic, it's a grave sin.

[/quote]

If two non-Catholics get married and they are not impeded by divine law from doing so they marry validly.

If two non-Catholics get married in accordance with any laws to which they are bound they marry licitly.

If two non-Catholics get married and both of them are validly baptised it is a sacrament.

There are licit, valid, and sacramental marriages outside the Catholic Church. If this were not true why do non-Catholics who have been previously married need to get an annulment before they can marry a Catholic?

Only if one party is a Catholic does the Catholic Church's ecclesiastical laws have to be followed. Even then they can be dispensed.

If two non-Catholics get married in some bizarre wedding chapel in Vegas providing it's recognised by the state the Catholic Church considers it valid and licit and if both parties are baptised the Church would recogise it as a sacrament.


#17

[quote="ConstantineTG, post:10, topic:302573"]
Why are we saying what is Sacramental or not for those who are not Catholics? :shrug: Why do we care? And do they care?

[/quote]

I was simply trying to give as comprehensive an answer as I could to the opening post, which made reference to weddings that were not in a Catholic setting. Presumably, virtually all of said weddings would involve at least one non-Catholic party.


#18

Is a marriage by a catholic and non catholic when both have been baptized and are married by a judge valid? Can you do this then go through the church’s sacramental marriage ceremony?

Bill


#19

[quote="billcu1, post:18, topic:302573"]
Is a marriage by a catholic and non catholic when both have been baptized and are married by a judge valid? Can you do this then go through the church's sacramental marriage ceremony?

Bill

[/quote]

It depends on whether the Catholic has requested and received a dispensation from canonical form from his/her bishop.

If the dispensation has been granted, the marriage would be legal, valid and sacramental.

If no dispensation has been granted, the marriage is legal but invalid and must be 'convalidated'.

A simple convalidation involves the couple getting married in the Church.
A radical sanation is a convalidation accomplished by paperwork. This is a last resort when one of the parties refuses to repeat the marriage ceremony, believing the original marriage to have been valid.


#20

[quote="billcu1, post:18, topic:302573"]
Is a marriage by a catholic and non catholic when both have been baptized and are married by a judge valid? Can you do this then go through the church's sacramental marriage ceremony?

Bill

[/quote]

It can depend. See Phemie's answer above. In some countries what you describe is required. This is because the state requires a separate civil marriage from any religious one. On the other hand if the state does not require this what you describe is not what should happen because, in general, the Church says there should only be one marriage ceremony. I hope that makes sense; please let me know if it's not clear.


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