I don’t mean just canonized with a couple of credited miracles after death, but genuinely recognized as having achieved the spiritual heights of Padre Pio while living.
Why only Popes or Cardinals?
I think he’s trying to find out whether or not our Church leaders have achieved as much spiritually as the laity. I reckon St Peter cannot but have been deeply spiritual - lots of miracles happened in his life, healings and what have you (even people touched by his shadow were healed in Acts).
Likewise St Leo the great. Imagine being able to scare Attila the Hun away from Rome by the sheer ppower of your personal presence! That sort of power only comes from great holiness :getholy: when it doesn’t come from the devil.
Remember that one’s spiritual “caliber” (by this I assume you mean holiness) is not measured by supernatural events like miraculous works, visions, locutions, bilocation, stigmata, etc., but by trying to do God’s will in our lives. There is no way to tell whether God considers Padre Pio holier than any Pope, canonized saint, etc., or even holier than the lady next door who tries to live as an image of Christ in ordinary ways every day.
Each person’s holiness is unique to that person and manifests in different ways.
Often the holiness is not readily apparent in most cases.
Take Pope John Paul II. He has a very deep spirituality, love of God and his people and while visible in his dealing with groups and during his saying of the Mass (if you payed attention to him all the time). The holiness was observable if you looked carefully for it.
The two that immediately come to mind are John Paul II, and Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen.
I think he’s trying to find out whether or not our Church leaders have achieved as much spiritually as the laity.
Padre Pio was not a layman.
I don’t think he was saying that Padre Peo was a lay person. Only looking for someone who’s strong faith is seen by anyone and everyone. Padre Pio suffered a lot, and did alot of wonderful things in his life. But I don’t think we should be looking for someone just like him. Why would we want to?
While it’s nice to have such examples, but we should also be looking elsewhere for other types of examples as well. Sometimes the best ones are those that nobody notices.
H.H. Pope Benedict XVI
H.E. Cardinal Hoyos
Both alive and well
My bad - I didn’t mean to say laity, I simply meant St Padre Pio was not a high-ranking church official or anything, is all. open mouth, remove foot
If you read the OP’s other threads you will see that he judges the 1.2 billion Catholics against Padre Pio and said that any of us who did not measure up to Padre Pio is weak in their faith.
He hasn’t explained who gave him the authority to make such a judgement!
The last Pope recognized for great sanctity was Pope St Pius X.
Also as far as I am aware he is the only one accredited with the uniquely petrine miracle of healing someone when his shadow passed over them.
Since this is what you were asking.
edit: As far as someone above said, Pope Benedict may be recognised as a great Pope one day, but a lot of liberals gonna have to get eaten first.
Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI are the only ones I can see fit that discription after the death of Padre Pio
that is true, St Padre Pio is a great Saint but so is St Therese of Lisieux who spent her life doing ordinary little things for God
It is an unfair comparison to make against any pope or cardinal. Padre Pio was a great miracle worker, whose role and gift in life was healing and assisting folks with evaluating their spiritual life.
Popes and cardinals have different roles and talents. Being good organizers, spirtual leaders and administrators and managers takes a different set of talents.
But even still, Pope John Paul II is said to have been linked with many miracle healings as well. He also spoke 6 or 7 languages (although those were learned and not of a miraculous nature, being able to keep each in mind without getting totally confused is quite a talent.)
And although the great Padre was spiritually gifted, he was also known to be a bit of a grump and at times have a very disagreeable disposition. Cardinals and popes have to perform for a different audience and few have the luxury to be disagreeable or grouchy.
As far as sanctity goes, only God can judge that, I think all of our recent popes and many cardinals are as pious or saintly as anyone can be.
STM that being canonised is enough - & only God knows the answer anyway.
Every saint has been given his place in history. St. Pio of Pietrelcina certainly has his, similar to St. Francis. The world needed him as we grow further into a new age of materialism and sin.
I can’t think of any high ranking individuals other than the afore mentioned Popes John Paul II and Benedict XVI and Fulton Sheen. But if we include priests, Fr. Solanas Casey comes to mind. Although he wasn’t a stigmatist, another priest with amazing grace surrounding him. And he was an extremely simple man, and lived here in the U.S.
I was amazed to find out the St. Pio was the first Catholic priest to receive the stigmata. We’ve been around for 2000 years. You would think there would be dozens!
I never really thought of him as a great saint. What did he contribute to theology or our understanding of God. He was given a lot of supernatural gifts but that does not make him a great saint. I saint that is not given anything, not proof, just endless doubt, now that is a great saint.
I’m not sure I understand what you mean by someone who has given endless doubt being a great saint. That sounds counter-productive to me. I’m assuming you’re comparing him to Blessed Teresa of Calcuta. There is no comparison. They were two completely different people with completely different vocations and had completely different lives. And I believe her contribution was outstanding, not just from the giving standpoint, but her inspiration as being a humble servant without the reward.
As for St. Pio, how much do you know about him? He wasn’t called to be with the poor, and neither were saints such as St. Therese of Lisseux. But he was called to pray, and his vocation was more directly involved with souls, rather than human flesh. It is known he battled the devil, and needed days to recover from it. He advocated for souls daily. He was given a special vocation that I feel most of us won’t understand until we too have moved on from this life and on to the spiritual realm. God doesn’t bestow this “supernatural gifts” on someone for show. He had a specific mission in life.
He is an amazing saint. I believe he will remain among the more known saints in history.
I doubt that myself but I also hope that all saints will never be “forgotten”. However my gut tells me he will probably end up a “forgotten” a feast day about “The guy who did all that stuff, you know? That guy.” Many a saint has had many an amazing miracle and they are all but forgotten too. I will not deny he was given a lot of supernatural Gifts. If he said he fought with satan he probably did. However it is because of this that I think less than more of him spiritually. A prayer from someone that has not been given any gifts and is constantly fighting, not Satan, but rather for faith in God is infinitely more beautiful. His is the way of those who have not seen yet believe in a see of painful doubt, He is truly blessed, and he can teach the normal man that does not experience God in any realistic way, more than some on who actually experiences God regularly.
John 20 (24-29)
But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. The other disciples therefore said unto him, We have seen the LORD. But he said unto them, Except I shall see in his hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and thrust my hand into his side, I will not believe. And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you. Then saith He to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. And Thomas answered and said unto him, My LORD and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen Me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.