In this here thread: forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=659223 (well in the last few pages) some of us got a tad off topic and started discussing authority, or at least I think we’re discussing authority, it’s what it’s all come down to so far.
So I will post my response to some of the questions and points in that thread here as its not on topic on that thread anymore.
Develop to much? Did the doctrines of the Trinity and Incarnation develop over the centuries to much that it did not resemble what the early church taught? Yes you posted enough to make your point,but not to debunk 2,000 years of history. Schaff is incredibly well read,but sure is lacking in the comprehension department.
When it comes to the Trinity, however, we find clear and vast evidence in sacred scripture however, with the papacy, to my eye we do not… With regard to Schaff, I think he is a very capable man.
Different interpretations? Seriously? We have scores of church fathers words about the primacy of Rome where it is evident what they said and believed. It is called revisionism by many today because it conflicts with their novel beliefs,plain and simple.
We have scores of fathers who say a lot about Peter in many places yes… In no way do they all therefore suddenly think the Bishop of Rome is supreme over them… Accusing us of revisionism is rather bold… It’s more realism… We’re simply holding Trent accountable for its comments on their claims There’s no revisionism in it, it’s just what’s there in history.
All authors have opinions,but to bad opinions are merely that…opinions. An opinion with no sound evidence is nothing.
With respect, i think Schaff has rather large amounts of evidence for his claims.
Again…present to me one ECF clearly teaching the primacy of Rome is: heretical,false, to be rejected,schismatic or a usurpation of Christ in the first 500 years?
I did… As soon as we see Bishop victor in Rome attempting to use authority outside of his jurisdiction, Irenaus rebukes him for it… He has no knowledge of a universal papacy, he sees Victor attempting to interfere in something he has no right to and rebukes him…(1).
(1) - History of the Christian Church, Volume 2, Ante Nicence Christianity AD 100-325, Phillip Schaff, Oak harbor, WA, Logos Research systems inc, 1997 - m.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/hcc2.v…ml#v.vi.x-p0.1