benedict


#1

do you think that Bishop of Rome is infallible?:slight_smile:


#2

I think the poll is misleading. It doesn’t break it down to the following:

Is the Pope Benedict XVI infallible when teaching moral and faith?

To answer the question, when the Pope teachings on moral and faith issue, he is infallible.

He is not impeccable. He can sin and make mistakes.


#3

Like manny said - He can sin and all. But when it comes to teachings and doctrines of the Church, yes, He is infallable, yes.

Jesus established the Covenant of the New Testament with us, and it is everlasting. now instead of prophets coming down (like it did in Judaism) Jesus created the Catholic Church, and by the power of the Holy Spirit, the doctrines are perfect!

I am not trying to offend you, as you are a muslim, but… I don’t understand why God would send down Jesus and then his message be totally corrupted, and a prophet have to come after 600 years, even though soo much damage has been done.

Now what sounds more reasonable?

a prophet who God let His teachings be corrupt literally instantly (as the earliest writings of Chrsitian Church Fathers speak of Jesus as Lord, etc) his teaching is corrupt

or

Jesus, who came down, sent us a great message, and established a Church system so that we have an authority to make sure our teachings are right, and, with the power of the Holy Spirit, to make Her belief perfect! :thumbsup:


#4

If you are a practicing Catholic, you are bound to believe the Holy Spirit will keep the Pope free from error when he is teaching on morals and faith issues.

In my own view, no human being is infallible, nor is any logical or theological system; the human mind is too frail to grasp truth as a whole, and the failures of dogmatic systems down the ages to come to a fundamental agreement on Truth demonstrate the limitations on human attempts at metaphysical and religious cognition. I think in the end all human religions are going to have to accept, as philosophy and science do, a closed system of infallible truth is impossible to achieve and appeals to revelation are not going to convince skeptics and non-believers. The skeptic in my view has no good argument as to why they should believe a human being is infallible; in fact, I think trying to encourage this sort of belief in any leader in any role is extremely dangerous.


#5

i will answer you from the bible ,i dont believe that prophets did that but ppl
Jeremiah 23:13 "Among the prophets of Samaria
I saw this repulsive thing:
They prophesied by Baal
and led my people Israel astray.

16 This is what the LORD Almighty says:
"Do not listen to what the prophets are prophesying to you;
they fill you with false hopes.
They speak visions from their own minds,
not from the mouth of the LORD.
36 But you must not mention 'the oracle of the LORD ’ again, because every man’s own word becomes his oracle and so you distort the words of the living God, the LORD Almighty, our God.

need more ? :slight_smile: i have a book about that ,as you know i`m egyptian ,so the book is in arabic but if you want it i cant translate it to you:)


#6

your poll completely mis-states the meaning of papal infallibility, and there is no such thing as a poll on a matter of defined doctrine. a poll is about opinion only, and expressing opionion on a matter of fact is ludicrous. another worthless polls (don’t feel bad, most polls here are worthless). Also this is a Catholic doctrine, so the topic should be discussed on the appropriate forum. On non-Catholic religions we discuss teaching and practice of other religions, who are not really interested in the pope.


#7

The poll questions definitely show a serious misunderstanding on what infallibility means.


#8

As others have stated, your poll is extremely misleading.
It’s like saying, "Was Mohammed purely evil or was he God?"
That is a misleading and unfair question because he was neither.


#9

Catholics do not believe that teh Pope is infallible in all things… he’s human you know.


#10

The pope is protected by the Holy Spirit in matters of faith and morals only. That is for the benefit of correct teaching in the Church.

However, the popes have free will and they can choose whether they will sin or not, and that is what we mean when we say they are not “impeccable”.

But, they are infallible. (see first sentence above).


#11

Yet another ignorant assumption of the catholic faith made by a muslim.
Why ask the question when you already think you know the answer amadhassan?
Do you even know what infallability means and what it means to catholics?
Seriously I am always open for debate but this is just showing the lack of catholic knowledge that you do not posess.

I really think this question is condesending because either you really want to know or you are using them to attack what you think it is we believe.


#12

While I believe he is a good man, he can teach “error”, of course as a Friend I do not believe in papal infallibility…no one in this world in infallible…there is no “divine mussel” to stop somone from speaking falsehood if they choose to.


#13

Okay again - this poll doesn’t express the catholic doctrine of papal infallibility.

The pope is only infallible in matters of faith & morals - it doesn’t mean he can’t commit sins or personal errors. If he were impeccable (couldn’t sin) why would he go to confession?

Catholig


#14

Do you really think that the OP will understand this or even want to that is the real question?


#15

Well I don’t know if he will read my post or not - or if he will take it in at all because sometimes ppl think that they have it figured out and decide not to listen to anyone else - however if he does read enough of these maybe he’ll either begin to understand papal infallibility or change his question due to pressure.

So I’ll rephrase it in case he decides to read this post:

[LIST=1]
*]Papal Infallibilty doesn’t mean the pope can’t sin.
*]Papal infallibility does mean that the pope cannot lead the Church into heresy.
*]The Pope can sin.
*]He goes to confession daily I believe.
*]And confesses to a Jesuit if I am not mistaken
[/LIST]


#16

I understand on every level exactly what you have said Catholig, But unfortunetly we can post with the biggest boldest typing and I still think ahmadhassan doesnt get it and its because he doesnt want to. None of this makes sense to him. But we keep on trying to explain it the best we can.


#17

He is infallible when the situation falls under the requirements the Church has outlined regarding Papal infallibility. I hope this helps.


#18

So it is the Catholic teaching that God takes away his Free Will to insure our safety?

Limited Free Will? A will incapable to choose love. Thats a scary thought.


#19

Why do you ask questions you already know the answer to?

Limited Free Will? A will incapable to choose love. Thats a scary thought.

Not to mention an irrelevant one.


#20

Not sure I understand what you are asking. How would preventing the Church from heresy involve taking away the Pope’s free will to choose love? :confused:


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