Biden: Israel right to stop Gaza flotilla from breaking blockade

“They’ve said, ‘Here you go. You’re in the Mediterranean. This ship — if you divert slightly north you can unload it and we’ll get the stuff into Gaza,’”, he said. “So what’s the big deal here? What’s the big deal of insisting it go straight to Gaza? Well, it’s legitimate for Israel to say, ‘I don’t know what’s on that ship. These guys are dropping… 3,000 rockets on my people.

“Look, you can argue whether Israel should have dropped people onto that ship or not — but the truth of the matter is, Israel has a right to know — they’re at war with Hamas — has a right to know whether or not arms are being smuggled in.”
During the interview, Biden also blamed Hamas for the crisis that has wracked the coastal territory and for the ongoing state of conflict with Israel.

“As we put pressure, and the world put pressure on Israel to let material go into Gaza to help those people who are suffering, the ordinary Palestinians there, what happened? Hamas would confiscate it, put it in a warehouse [and] sell it.

haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/biden-israel-right-to-stop-gaza-flotilla-from-breaking-blockade-1.293833

*Even a blind squirrel (Say it ain't so, Joe Biden) occasionally finds a nut!
*

Sancta Maria, Mater Dei, Ora Pro Nobis Peccatoribus!

mark

A re-armed Hamas in Gaza is a certain recipe for military repercussions that will kill Gazans. Breaching the blockade is only in the interests of those who are interested in war.

Joe Biden is showing the necessary American leadership here.

Glad to see Biden show some sense on this issue. Anyone else finding it increasingly difficult to be Pro-Israel Westerner these days?
Here in Ireland it is virtually impossible. We have idiots protesting in our cities with Hamas and Hezbollah flags shouting Allahu Akbar. Not only that, Irish churches and gay rights groups (specifically LGBT Labour) are condemning Israel. Do these groups not realise that Israel has little persecution of Christians and LGBT people? Do they not realise that Hamas' sponsor-in-chief, Iran, execute both Christians and LGBT people for no good reason?

Frankly I am just baffled that Western-minded people could find it within themselves to support Hamas, and it says a lot about the state of our world if we have to suprisingly thank the vice-President of the leader of the free world for supporting one of the few free country's in the middle east. :mad:

[quote="grampben, post:4, topic:200472"]
we have to suprisingly thank the vice-President of the leader of the free world for supporting one of the few free country's in the middle east. :mad:

[/quote]

Israel is a free country??

Really?

Why is there no Israeli nationality then?

Could it be that if there was, then Palestinians would have an inaniable right to return to their land??

As per his 1970 ruling in the Supreme Court Shimon Agranat stated “There is no Israeli nation separate from the Jewish people.”

I guess it's a free country if you happen to be born the right side of the tracks eh!

Most free countries still assume responsibility over their borders, their immigration and defining their national character

Anti-Semites really don't like the idea of Jews having the same freedoms and doing the same things as every other people do for themselves. We all get that.

[quote="Darryl1958, post:6, topic:200472"]
Most free countries still assume responsibility over their borders, their immigration and defining their national character

Anti-Semites really don't like the idea of Jews having the same freedoms and doing the same things as every other people do for themselves. We all get that.

[/quote]

Some people equally dont like the idea of an arab people being denied their enaniable right to live in their homeland, freedom of movement, freedom of expression, freedom of religion, freedom to engage in trade....

Not everyone gets that it seems.

Tell me this Sir, do those of us Britons with Norman descent have an indelible right to return to Northern France? Do those of Viking descent have an inalienable right to return to their ‘home’, Scandinavia? Do the Celts in Britain and Ireland have every right to exterminate any immigrants that have came to these islands since the Romans? Of course not. Get real, and get some valid arguments while you’re at it.

Wow... Biden is actually right about something. Well, kudos, credit where it's due.

[quote="grampben, post:8, topic:200472"]
Tell me this Sir, do those of us Britons with Norman descent have an indelible right to return to Northern France? Do those of Viking descent have an inalienable right to return to their 'home', Scandinavia? Do the Celts in Britain and Ireland have every right to exterminate any immigrants that have came to these islands since the Romans? Of course not. Get real, and get some valid arguments while you're at it.

[/quote]

Lol.

Nice dance.

Now, back to the actual question which you didnt answer; if Israel is a free country as claimed, why is it that there is no Israeli nationality.

Is it because if there was one, arabs who currently have no right of return to their homeland, no right to free movement, no right to free trade, would automatically get it??

And why if the supreme court in Israel categorically states there is no such thing as an Israeli national, has passports being stating Israeli under nationality for jews travelling abroad??

Mr. Ornan, 86, said that denying a common Israeli nationality was the linchpin of state-sanctioned discrimination against the Arab population.

"There are even two laws -- the Law of Return for Jews and the Citizenship Law for Arabs -- that determine how you belong to the state," he said. "What kind of democracy divides its citizens into two kinds?"
.... "Imagine the uproar in Jewish communities in the United States, Britain or France, if the authorities there tried to classify their citizens as 'Jewish' or 'Christian'," said Mr. Ornan.

mrzine.monthlyreview.org/2010/cook060410.html

The answer to what kind of democracy divides its citizens into two kinds - is apartheid.

The international community condemned out of hand South Africa for just this - but not a word against Israeli for its apartheid?? Huh??

Free country indeed!

20% of Isreali citizens are Palestinians, with all rights that Jewish citizens have (and Druze, and Circassian, and Christian…)and there have Palestinian Arabs in EVERY Knesset.

How many Palestinians have citizenship rights in Jordan? Syria? Lebanon?

The world screams about Isreal, but conveniently ignores the 2+ million Arabs living in UNWRA camps…in Arab countries.

[quote="grampben, post:8, topic:200472"]
Tell me this Sir, do those of us Britons with Norman descent have an indelible right to return to Northern France? Do those of Viking descent have an inalienable right to return to their 'home', Scandinavia? Do the Celts in Britain and Ireland have every right to exterminate any immigrants that have came to these islands since the Romans? Of course not. Get real, and get some valid arguments while you're at it.

[/quote]

Of course not

Unless you are Jewish of course :D

Listen Guyonthestreet, mate, Arabs and other minorities enjoy the same rights as Israeli Jews.

[quote="grampben, post:13, topic:200472"]
Listen Guyonthestreet, mate, Arabs and other minorities enjoy the same rights as Israeli Jews.

[/quote]

No.

They dont.

para 207: The two-tiered cviil status under Israeli law, favouring "Jewish nationals (le'om yehudi) over persons holding Israeli citizenship (ezrahut), has been a subject of concern under the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights, particularly those forms of discrimination carried out through Israel's parastatal agencies (World Zionist Organization/Jewish Agency; Jewish National Fund and their affiliates), which dominate land use, housing and development.* The Committee on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights also has recognized that Israel's application of a "Jewish nationality" distinct from Israeli citizenship institutionalizes discrimination that disadvantages all Palestinians, in particular, refugees.**

ceia-sc.org/page37/page175/page175.html

From a source title “Campaign to End Isreali Apartheid”, no less.

Unbiased, of course. One would point out that discrimination and “apartheid” are not mutually exclusive. One can point to cases of discrimination in the US, maybe even instutional discrimination, but that does not equate with an “apartheid state”.

In Saudi Arabia, a Muslim’s testimony in court is worth 2x that of a Christian.

Any comparable Isreali law?

[quote="scipio337, post:15, topic:200472"]
From a source title "Campaign to End Isreali Apartheid", no less.

[/quote]

The ''source'' is Gladstones report. :rolleyes:

Goldstone Report, A/HRC/12/48, 25 September 2009

Here's the link to the full security councils report:

securitycouncilreport.org/atf/cf/%7B65BFCF9B-6D27-4E9C-8CD3-CF6E4FF96FF9%7D/IP%20Goldstone%20Report%20Final%20Sep%2009.doc.pdf

And, again…

"One would point out that discrimination and “apartheid” are not mutually exclusive. One can point to cases of discrimination in the US, maybe even instutional discrimination, but that does not equate with an “apartheid state”.

In Saudi Arabia, a Muslim’s testimony in court is worth 2x that of a Christian.

Any comparable Isreali law?"

Isreal admits these shortcomings, and works to amend them. See recent Supreme Court rulings against the JNF:

adalah.org/eng/jnf.php#committee

And again, where is the equivalent gesture in Muslim lands?

[quote="scipio337, post:17, topic:200472"]
Isreal admits these shortcomings, and works to amend them. See recent Supreme Court rulings against the JNF:

adalah.org/eng/jnf.php#committee

[/quote]

Read any State Department Human Rights report on Israel and the Occupied Territories and you'll find that isn't the case. The Israeli Supreme Court is toothless and their decisions routinely ignored. Discrimination against non-Jews, and even Jews who aren't Orthodox, is a cornerstone in Israeli law and practice.

And…

where is the equivalent gesture in Muslim lands?

[quote="scipio337, post:19, topic:200472"]
And........

where is the equivalent gesture in Muslim lands?

[/quote]

If you're looking for Supreme Court rulings that their governments have no intention of abiding by then I'm sure there are plenty. Unenforced "gestures" are meaningless.

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