Bulgaria and Lithuania fear they could be next on Russia's hit-list but U.S. Vice President Joe Biden promises: 'We're in this with you'


#1

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2584461/Bulgaria-Lithuania-fear-Russias-hit-list-U-S-Vice-President-Joe-Biden-promises-Were-you.html#ixzz2wT2QIWje

[LIST]
*]Pro-Russian militia have taken control of Ukraine’s naval base in Crimea
*]Crimea’s leader has urged the Kremlin to go deeper into Ukraine
*]Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia expressed concern over the developments
*]Biden said the U.S. will defend any NATO member against ‘aggression’
*]Its comes amid eports of FSB secret services agents flooding into Transdniestria, a breakaway pro-Moscow region of ex-Soviet state Moldova
*]The region’s leadership has signaled their wish to be integrated into Russia
[/LIST]


#2

What happened to the days of Democrats saying that they want peace and not war? Do they know that a war with Russia would be kind of a big deal?


#3

Don’t hold your breath.


#4

Open war with Russia is not an option and never was.

The American Democratic Party has been responsible for getting the US into a lot of conflicts, but trust me, no sane person in Russia or the USA wants a war among these two.

It would be very bad to say the least.


#5

No matter what, no war. No one would win it and it would be an unjust war.

Linus2nd


#6

Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania cannot afford to take the Western European route of relying on America to be the sole source of military might. They need to invest heavily into building up NATO forces in order to show Putin their determination to resist any Russian aggression.
Obama’s facade of weakness is leaves an open door for the Baltic countries to move in and integrate themselves deeply into NATO.

The threat against them is real enough. They need to take the initiative now. It is not enough that NATO is there for them, They must be there for NATO.


#7

Call me a weak, peace-loving conservative, but I’d prefer it if Obama would not try to get us into a war with Russia.


#8

The plot thickens. It has been reported that Moldavia wants to be united with Russia. Parts of Moldavia are now part of the Ukraine but it apparantly has a large Russian population that want to be reunited with Russia. Shades of WW1 and WW2. It has been reported that Russian secret agents a flooding Moldavia.

The Baltic states are getting nervous since they have large Russian populations.

Linus2nd


#9

Let’s all pray for peace.


#10

Its impossible because on March 25, 1984 Pope John Paul II fulfilled Our Lady of Fatima’s request that Russia be consecrated and now Russia is converted. High ranking Cardinals have attested to that.


#11

“If Obama tries to fool with my Beretta, he’s got a problem.”-Sen. Biden in 2008

Methinks his words are quite meaningless.


#12

A direct toe-to-toe with Russia by the U.S. would be crazy except under the most dire of circumstances.

But that doesn’t mean nobody can resist Russian aggression or that there is no part for the U.S. to play in doing it. One thing that needs to be remembered is that Russia is actually a poor country compared to the west. It’s military resources and training are not comparable to that of the U.S. or some of its allies.

Something Putin can’t risk politically is a defeat or even a significant setback for the Russian army at the hands of some state like Poland or even Ukraine. Such an event would make it plain to the Russian people that Putin is risking their treasure and their sons on his imperial adventures, shaming them in the process. Governments fall because of things like that. He won’t risk a bloody nose like that, and he wouldn’t have risked the Crimea acquisition if the Ukrainian army had been well-trained, well-equipped and resolute. Even knowing its weakness and irresolution, he stripped his soldiers of incriminating insignia for the sake of “plausible deniability” if his troops got smashed up and humiliated by Ukrainian troops in Crimea.

Probably having counted tanks, planes and soldiers, the Ukrainian government told its troops in Crimea to stand down so as not to risk an even bigger war with Russia.


#13

If they’re smart they’ll decline his offer of help and look to a country with sane leaders.


#14

Can you name a country with sane leaders?


#15

Ukraine made the mistake of taking the USA at its word after the Soviet collapse when Ukraine was left holding one of the world’s largest arsenals of nuclear weapons. We promised to guarantee their security in return for them willingly giving up their leftover Soviet nuclear weapons.

They took us at our word. Look where it got them. Much as it pains me to say it, they might have been more secure had they kept some of those nukes. Would Putin have really invaded and taken Crimea away if he had nuclear reprisal to worry about? Dunno. Even he might not be that crazy.

The question now becomes “How much land grabbing would Putin have to do before war would be justified?” Just Crimea and Ossetia? Crimea, Ossetia AND eastern Ukraine? Lithuania and Estonia? Poland? Is everything east of Germany itself effectively up for grabs or is there a point where war would become just and warranted. It’s a question that needs deciding without being publicly debated (since Putin would likely take 100% of anything declared “unworthy of war” and maybe just a bit more for spite.)


#16

Putin is like a neighborhood thief who tries the doors. If one is locked, he goes to the next, and the next. If he hears a barking dog behind a door, he moves on.

Putin reminds one so much of Hitler before WWII. If his remilitarizing the Rhineland had been opposed by France, he would have been swiftly defeated and likely deposed. He gave orders to scram if his military was met with resistance. He was too weak to take the Sudetenland, and knew it. He got it because others did nothing. Had he attempted it and been met with determined resistance, he would have been finished. He would not have attempted Austria had not Mussolini (whom Hitler thought strong, but who was actually weak) given him leave to do it.

One difference is that Hitler took over places that really did enrich his capabilities. The Skoda arms works in Czechoslovakia were world-renowned. There was great wealth to steal there and in Austria which (combined with wealth stolen from Jews) allowed him to build his military to the maximum without the inflation that would have, in any event, ruined him in time.

Putin’s Russia is not in good shape economically or socially. Most Russians are poor and have a hard life. Terrorism in Russia is chronic and is poorly controlled. The west is incomparably richer and more capable. Putin knows it, and he knows he’s filling his countrymens’ bellies with “national pride” instead of steak. So far he has stolen nothing of serious economic value, and surely Russians know that too.

The one thing he won’t risk is a serious reverse. He can’t risk getting a bunch of Russian soldiers killed; at least not yet, and certainly not by a bunch of Ukrainians or Lithuanians.

Russia has gas to sell, and that’s true. But there’s plenty of it in Europe if they would only develop it. Perhaps now they will. Perhaps we will too. The U.S. really needs to allow its economy (yes, allow) to boom. It needs to arm and train the “front line states”. Imagine for a moment a Ukrainian army with the kinds of weapons we gave the Muslim Brotherhood for free, and financed training by, oh, let’s say, crack South Korean or Israeli professionals. Perhaps even the Turks (resenting Russian support of rival Iran) would loan a few drill sergeants. What if we gave or loaned Ukraine sufficient money to hire, let’s say, Blackrock’s best? They come from everywhere and can wear unmarked uniforms like the Russian army did in Crimea, or no uniforms at all. What if Putin knew some unknown number of them were roaming around in gillie suits somewhere east of Kiev?

If we got those things done, would Putin then go shake the door of Kazakhstan perhaps? Maybe. But it would be another Chechnya, and he has trouble with the Chechnya he already has. Can “national pride” survive another one? I don’t think he’ll turn that knob.


#17

Not off the top of my head, but there has got to be at least one out there, somewhere. Or maybe they’ll just have to settle with someone less crazy than Biden. That opens up the playing field very wide. :smiley:


#18

The pope is one that comes to mind. :smiley:


#19

There ya go…found one. And a good one at that. :smiley:


#20

This is probably the best long term solution. But can you see Obama granting development aid to Poland so that they can hire Hallibuton to teach them fracking techniques? Bwahahahah! He’d rather see Putin conquer Europe first. Sad, but I suspect true.


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