California on 'verge of system failure’

theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/economy/california-on-verge-of-system-failure/article1609891/

*It’s a story that’s being repeated all across California – and throughout the United States – as cash-strapped state and local governments grapple with collapsed tax revenues and swelling budget gaps. Mass layoffs, slashed health and welfare services, closed parks, crumbling superhighways and ever-larger public school class sizes are all part of the new normal.

California’s fiscal hole is now so large that the state would have to liberate 168,000 prison inmates and permanently shutter 240 university and community college campuses to balance its budget in the fiscal year that begins July 1.*

So much for three strikes and you're out. :D

**Yeah,

those who recklessly waste the fruits of others labors give themselves 1000+ strikes.

It is time for us to vote them out!!
**
Sancta Maria, Mater Dei, Ora Pro Nobis Peccatoribus!

mark

[quote="Zatzat, post:1, topic:202488"]

So much for three strikes and you're out. :D

[/quote]

Unfortunately, indiscriminate revolving-door releases end up costing more than they save.

If this was the business world, Texas could have a hostile take-over of the failing California. Then the ones who caused this mess could be fired and the programs that sent them into bankruptcy could be canned.

[quote="Zatzat, post:1, topic:202488"]
theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/economy/california-on-verge-of-system-failure/article1609891/

*It’s a story that’s being repeated all across California – and throughout the United States – as cash-strapped state and local governments grapple with collapsed tax revenues and swelling budget gaps. Mass layoffs, slashed health and welfare services, closed parks, crumbling superhighways and ever-larger public school class sizes are all part of the new normal.

So much for three strikes and you're out. :D*

California’s fiscal hole is now so large that the state would have to liberate 168,000 prison inmates and permanently shutter 240 university and community college campuses to balance its budget in the fiscal year that begins July 1.

[/quote]

Don't forget all the California UNIONS who won't budge - just like Europe. Unfortunately they will want the rest of the US to bail them out for their over-spending and wastefulness.
I say no.

[quote="Mark77, post:2, topic:202488"]
**

It is time for us to vote them out!!
**

[/quote]

The only problem with that plan, is that you then have to vote new people in. And just where are these super heroes hiding??? :shrug:

[quote="WatchingMedia, post:4, topic:202488"]

Don't forget all the California UNIONS who won't budge - just like Europe.

[/quote]

Yeah, it's not fair that all those public school teachers (who contracts are developed by unions) are living in multi-million dollar mansions, being chauffered to and from their schools, spending their summers "off" in their villas in the south of France... :rolleyes: As a union member, I am very cautious and critical of how my union represents me and our group of teachers. Sometimes some unions totally push for greed and extravagance -- I can agree with that completely. But most of the time, at least here in the fair state of Colorado, the unions are just the vehicle for establishing a fair contract for both sides.

My point is that UNIONS are not the source and end of California's problems, just one more easy scapegoat for those who don't want to assume any personal responsibility.

Gertie

Unions are a part of the problem.
If members have to have a few unpaid days off, or their benefits were to be brought in line with the private sector, or they are asked to make some other sacrifice they refuse, strike and march.
When was the last time you heard of a UNION doing what was best for their State or Society due to economic hardship in the State?
I'm not just picking on teachers UNIONS, but all public sector Unions. All those who are paid by the taxpayers should no longer be Unionized,.
Taxpayers can no longer afford this.

Ununionized - Government salaries and benefits need severe review with an eye toward cutting as well.

Unions put big money and workers into electing those who perpetuate whatever is best for the UNION. Not what is best for their State, or Society. They do not care what is best for the State or Society. Its- me, me , me.

The days when most unions were "fair" in the US have long been gone - fair wages for work done; fair benefits with the majority of those in their State are no longer the case.
Unions have become greedy with "better salaries" and "better benifits" for work done.

Unions and Government Workers have the best wages and benefits when averaging out incomes in States, etc.

Governor "Ahhnold" could go a long way towards fixing his state with a stroke of his pen.

Decertify all public sector unions.

[quote="WatchingMedia, post:7, topic:202488"]
Unions put big money and workers into electing those who perpetuate whatever is best for the UNION.

[/quote]

Not in Colorado! :extrahappy: We voted to make it illegal for unions to support or promote any political issue or candidate. Saves me the trouble of having to request to have that portion of my dues refunded me every year :thumbsup:

[quote="WatchingMedia, post:6, topic:202488"]

When was the last time you heard of a UNION doing what was best for their State or Society due to economic hardship in the State?

[/quote]

Actually our teachers union did just that this spring when the union and the administration worked hand-in-hand to come up with a way of making ends meet -- with a seriously decreased budget -- in a way that would have the least impact on students. The union reps at the table approved a salary freeze and unpaid furlough days (among other monetary concessions) for the coming school year; and I was deeply moved by the overwhelming support for these sacrifices that I saw in my colleagues at our union meetings. This support was not coming from teachers at every stage in their careers, including our "veterans" whose approaching retirement pay would be negatively impacted.

There is a spirit of sacrifice and looking out for others that is inherent in the ranks of school employees.

As for other government employees, I can't say much because I just don't know enough about the subject. But before you go off on a rant about how terrible the unions are because they fight for better salaries and better benefits, consider how you would feel if those salaries and benefits were for the support of your own family.

So what would you like to see in government jobs?

No job security? Fire at will? No due process for firing?
No insurance (health, dental, life) benefits?
Minimum wage?
Pay based on "average family income" for the immediate neighborhood?
Pay based on "average family income" for city, state, US?
Pay based on some performance rating? (Who would do the rating? Would this be a paid position? On what would the rating be based?)
Standardized pay schedule (like most school districts have) based on experience and level of education?

What seems fair to you?

Is your solution to California's financial problems to just shove all government employees under the bus? Is it your belief that the lady working at the DMV who issues car registrations is the cause of CA's problems? Or is it the librarian at the local library? Or perhaps the man fixing the road in front of the library? Really?? And how exactly would adding tens of thousands of people to the unemployment lines in the state contribute to finding a solution to its financial troubles?

I completely agree that unions should not be allowed to participate in politics! But keep in mind that the people whom these unions represent are actually working for their pay. Don't you agree that they should be paid something for their work?

I know the media all like to batter government employees, saying they are lazy and never do anything, but that's not been my experience in any of my own encounters with local, state, or national government institutions. Let's face it, the media likes to batter the Catholic Church as well -- so maybe we shouldn't be so quick to believe everything we see and hear from the media.

Gertie

[quote="Gertabelle, post:9, topic:202488"]
Not in Colorado! :extrahappy: We voted to make it illegal for unions to support or promote any political issue or candidate. Saves me the trouble of having to request to have that portion of my dues refunded me every year :thumbsup:

[/quote]

Colorado isn't a democracy?

[quote="Zatzat, post:10, topic:202488"]
Colorado isn't a democracy?

[/quote]

I note that Gertabelle says they voted for this measure.
A democracy with policies you disagree with is still a democracy.

[quote="Gertabelle, post:9, topic:202488"]
Not in Colorado! :extrahappy: We voted to make it illegal for unions to support or promote any political issue or candidate. Saves me the trouble of having to request to have that portion of my dues refunded me every year :thumbsup:

Actually our teachers union did just that this spring when the union and the administration worked hand-in-hand to come up with a way of making ends meet -- with a seriously decreased budget -- in a way that would have the least impact on students. The union reps at the table approved a salary freeze and unpaid furlough days (among other monetary concessions) for the coming school year; and I was deeply moved by the overwhelming support for these sacrifices that I saw in my colleagues at our union meetings. This support was not coming from teachers at every stage in their careers, including our "veterans" whose approaching retirement pay would be negatively impacted.

There is a spirit of sacrifice and looking out for others that is inherent in the ranks of school employees.

As for other government employees, I can't say much because I just don't know enough about the subject. But before you go off on a rant about how terrible the unions are because they fight for better salaries and better benefits, consider how you would feel if those salaries and benefits were for the support of your own family.

So what would you like to see in government jobs?

No job security? Fire at will? No due process for firing?
No insurance (health, dental, life) benefits?
Minimum wage?
Pay based on "average family income" for the immediate neighborhood?
Pay based on "average family income" for city, state, US?
Pay based on some performance rating? (Who would do the rating? Would this be a paid position? On what would the rating be based?)
Standardized pay schedule (like most school districts have) based on experience and level of education?

What seems fair to you?

Is your solution to California's financial problems to just shove all government employees under the bus? Is it your belief that the lady working at the DMV who issues car registrations is the cause of CA's problems? Or is it the librarian at the local library? Or perhaps the man fixing the road in front of the library? Really?? And how exactly would adding tens of thousands of people to the unemployment lines in the state contribute to finding a solution to its financial troubles?

I completely agree that unions should not be allowed to participate in politics! But keep in mind that the people whom these unions represent are actually working for their pay. Don't you agree that they should be paid something for their work?

I know the media all like to batter government employees, saying they are lazy and never do anything, but that's not been my experience in any of my own encounters with local, state, or national government institutions. Let's face it, the media likes to batter the Catholic Church as well -- so maybe we shouldn't be so quick to believe everything we see and hear from the media.

Gertie

[/quote]

Having lived many years in the DC area, I've seen the waste, and laziness in Government. I've also lived in CA, and MI regarding Unions, which 50 years ago were necessary, but not today with all the greed.

However, your post is most refreshing.
Denver has a good Bishop too ! Consider yourself lucky. :)

We have to tell Obama's socialistic minions that unions should follow Colorado based upon your post - NO CAMPAIGN MONEY, NO CAMPAIGN WORKERS. And then NO POLITICAL FAVORS.

This may come as a surprise to you, but most states have right to work laws. People in private industry have to do a good job or lose their job - not be carried by a Union.

Private companies compete with each other for the best employees they can get - ie benefits etc.
Government employees once they have a little seniority are there forever, if they simply do a mediocre job. Very difficult to fire them. Many years ago, it was not so, but now Government employees and their benefits make more than those doing similar jobs in the private sector.

To be fair, people should realize that not all public sector employees are unionized. As a civil engineer, I've considered working for state, federal and county level agencies at times (mostly when I've grown sick of a job description that consists of making rich, unscrupulous developers - which is nearly ALL of them - into RICHER unscrupulous developers), only to find that engineers with my level of experience in those jobs make about 60% of what I do.

Perhaps that's because they aren't union. So? If they are paid less, how come people take the jobs? Beause the JOBS themselves are nicer in many ways than the dog-eat-dog private sector jobs. At times the pay scale gets so low that they DO need to raise it to attract competent help. So they do.

[quote="WatchingMedia, post:12, topic:202488"]
Having lived many years in the DC area, I've seen the waste, and laziness in Government. I've also lived in CA, and MI regarding Unions, which 50 years ago were necessary, but not today with all the greed.

However, your post is most refreshing.
Denver has a good Bishop too ! Consider yourself lucky. :)

We have to tell Obama's socialistic minions that unions should follow Colorado based upon your post - NO CAMPAIGN MONEY, NO CAMPAIGN WORKERS. And then NO POLITICAL FAVORS.

This may come as a surprise to you, but most states have right to work laws. People in private industry have to do a good job or lose their job - not be carried by a Union.

Private companies compete with each other for the best employees they can get - ie benefits etc.
Government employees once they have a little seniority are there forever, if they simply do a mediocre job. Very difficult to fire them. Many years ago, it was not so, but now Government employees and their benefits make more than those doing similar jobs in the private sector.

[/quote]

:thumbsup: I saw the same thing too when working in DC. And don't even look at Crook County, IL about the subject if you don't want your stomach to turn.

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