Can homosexual men become priests?


#1

Can a gay man who lives a chaste life style become a priest? And if not, why?

Thanks for the answers.


#2

[quote="Debora123, post:1, topic:274280"]
Can a gay man who lives a chaste life style become a priest? And if not, why?

Thanks for the answers.

[/quote]

This must be handled delicately. A 2005 directive stated that those with homosexual tendencies must conquer said tendencies within three years of thei ordination to the Diaconate. I suppose it would be up to the local Bishop in order to accept a chaste homosexual into the Priesthood.

This may be of some help.

~ Pius :knight1:


#3

[quote="Bl_Pope_Pius_IX, post:2, topic:274280"]
This must be handled delicately. A 2005 directive stated that those with homosexual tendencies must conquer said tendencies within three years of thei ordination to the Diaconate. I suppose it would be up to the local Bishop in order to accept a chaste homosexual into the Priesthood.

This may be of some help.

~ Pius :knight1:

[/quote]

Indeed. A man with SSA can become a priest, however, it should be mentioned that having SSA does not automatically qualify one for Priesthood, just because men with SSA have an obligation to live chastely, anyway. (This post wasn't suggesting it, I just had to add :))

I think if a man wants to be a Priest, but can not conquer the homosexual tendencies in due time, it may signify that a man has so calling. I'll let someone else elaborate, as I am no good at it.


#4

I'm not gay or a gay rights supporter but they ought to. I mean they're not having sex so, they should.

And to anybody and I mean anybody who brings up "the scandal".

[LIST=1]
*]Those priests aren't homosexuals, they're pedophiles.
*]And before you say "no, they're ephebophiles". That's still not homosexuality. Just like if you're a grown man who has sex with a 14 year old girl, you're not an everyday heterosexual, that's ephebophilia.
*]There are more heterosexual pedophiles than homosexual ones.
[/LIST]

Sorry Debora, I had to clear up that because I know a lot of people who are going to bring these arguments up.


#5

[quote="followingtheway, post:4, topic:274280"]
I'm not gay or a gay rights supporter but they ought to. I mean they're not having sex so, they should.

And to anybody and I mean anybody who brings up "the scandal".

[LIST=1]
*]Those priests aren't homosexuals, they're pedophiles.
*]And before you say "no, they're ephebophiles". That's still not homosexuality. Just like if you're a grown man who has sex with a 14 year old girl, you're not an everyday heterosexual, that's ephebophilia.
*]There are more heterosexual pedophiles than homosexual ones.
[/LIST]

Sorry Debora, I had to clear up that because I know a lot of people who are going to bring these arguments up.

[/quote]

If by "those priests" you mean those who were convicted of molesting children, the vast majority of those men were homosexual AND pedophiles.


#6

The guilty priesty priests are NOT considered pedophiles if the victim is pubescent....


#7

But they’re not considered homosexuals if those victims are not adults.

Not every single homosexual who comes into the clergy will rape children.


#8

The topic isn't about sexual predators, its a general question about chaste homosexuals. And, yes, it is possible for them to become ordained. Such individuals should find a good spiritual director they can trust.


#9

[quote="NewEnglandPries, post:8, topic:274280"]
The topic isn't about sexual predators, its a general question about chaste homosexuals. And, yes, it is possible for them to become ordained. Such individuals should find a good spiritual director they can trust.

[/quote]

:thumbsup:
There are many threads about child predators, let's just have ONE that's not!


#10

Indeed, I agree that we need a thread like this that does not turn into a witch hunt for predators.

In fact, a male with SSA could well become a fine priest. Gay friends I have had have said that their orientation has allowed them to love more completely, and they were not talking about the sexual expression of loving. Rather they were talking about having kind of a dual nature - a more developed masculine and feminine principle- that helped them relate to people. This would seem to be an excellent basis for pastoral care.

The men I have been close to have been in the helping professions, and while not celibate, that could be another choice and vocation.

Then again, I am a hetero woman so what do I know. The older I get, the less I know about men - strange creatures.


#11

[quote="Ohana, post:10, topic:274280"]
The older I get, the less I know about men - strange creatures.

[/quote]

I can go on and on about women lol :shrug:


#12

Well I bet that is right. Even Freud asked plaintively, “what do women want?” For us that is an easy peasy question, that unfortunately, we do not seen to communicate well to our brothers because we don’t speak their language;):slight_smile:


#13

Frankly, I can't understand what the fact that a man might have SSA has to do with the Priesthood at all.

First of all, there's no sin in having SSA.

And if a Priest (or anyone for that matter) were to have homosexual relations with someone of the same gender, is that really any more sinful than a straight Priest having heterosexual relations with someone of the opposite gender outside of marriage???

It's almost as if people think that non-SSA Priests have no sexual attraction at all. That's ridiculous. Of course they do. (Well, the vast majority do, anyway!)


#14

I have a friend who is gay and when he came out to his mother she called the priest who, during that conversation came out to her. He was/ is a great and devout priest. Another great priest you can google on the subject is Father Mychal Judge, he was the first victim of the 9/11 attacks.

That same friend who is gay gave serious thought to becoming a priest before he told his mother and father. His reasoning (besides being very devout )was that no one would ask why he never had a girlfriend, and he could some how save his soul as he believed the orientation he was born with was a sin. I can't help but wonder how many others feel this way.

As for straight priests, they have the same struggles with being celibate. When my mother was growing up it was well known that one of the priests in her parish had a girlfriend who lived in my mother's building.
abcnews.go.com/International/irish-catholic-priest-falls-love/story?id=9136266#.T0ZY1Zi1nzI

Alberto Cutie is another priest famous for leaving because he fell in love. I believe he became Anglican.

Celibacy in the priesthood is something I've never understood. The apostles weren't celibate, nor was the church for the first thousand years. My sister in law is Greek and she was telling me her priest's father was a priest, his father was a priest, and so on. It must be kind of nice to have whole families dedicated to the clergy and there certainly wouldn't be a shortage.


#15

[quote="VeritasLuxMea, post:13, topic:274280"]

It's almost as if people think that non-SSA Priests have no sexual attraction at all. That's ridiculous. Of course they do. (Well, the vast majority do, anyway!)

[/quote]

THIS.

People equate SSA with hypersexuality, as if a gay person is attracted to every person of the same gender. But I see a lot of heterosexual threads on this site about problems with masturbation, so it seems to me that adult thoughts in general are ubiquitous regardless of sexual orientation. A gay priest understands chastity just as much as a straight one.


#16

[quote="Ohana, post:10, topic:274280"]

In fact, a male with SSA could well become a fine priest. Gay friends I have had have said that their orientation has allowed them to love more completely, and they were not talking about the sexual expression of loving. Rather they were talking about having kind of a dual nature - a more developed masculine and feminine principle- that helped them relate to people. This would seem to be an excellent basis for pastoral care.

[/quote]

This is understood as a problem by the Church not an advantage. The relation of a priest to the laity is that of a spiritual father.

Instruction Concerning the Criteria for the Discernment of Vocations with Regard to Persons with Homosexual Tendencies in View of Their Admission to the Seminary and to Holy Orders
Congregation for Catholic Education

"Such persons, in fact, find themselves in a situation that gravely hinders them from relating correctly to men and women. One must in no way overlook the negative consequences that can derive from the ordination of persons with deep-seated homosexual tendencies."

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/ccatheduc/documents/rc_con_ccatheduc_doc_20051104_istruzione_en.html


#17

[quote="Abba, post:16, topic:274280"]
This is understood as a problem by the Church not an advantage. The relation of a priest to the laity is that of a spiritual father.

Instruction Concerning the Criteria for the Discernment of Vocations with Regard to Persons with Homosexual Tendencies in View of Their Admission to the Seminary and to Holy Orders
Congregation for Catholic Education

"Such persons, in fact, find themselves in a situation that gravely hinders them from relating correctly to men and women. One must in no way overlook the negative consequences that can derive from the ordination of persons with deep-seated homosexual tendencies."

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/ccatheduc/documents/rc_con_ccatheduc_doc_20051104_istruzione_en.html

[/quote]

Exactly. Here the Vatican just leaves it at "deep-seated tendencies" which caused some problems. (It lacks the clarity and decisiveness Americans would like, but instead gives a general guideline each bishop can apply prudently.) A few days after this document, the WSJ had an editorial attacking the Church for banning all with SSA from the ministry. As far as I can see, Deep-seated tendencies would refer to someone who identifies himself as homosexual to the extent that:
a. the bishop / superior can't trust he will remain chaste, or
b. his dealings with others are as a HOMOSEXUAL in a way that hinders his complete imagining of Christ as an Alter Christus.
It does not seem to ban all with SSA.

Those are my thoughts; I am by no means an expert.


#18

No, a homosexual man cannot become a priest. Even if he is chaste for a number of years. When a man becomes a priest, he is giving up the chance to ever get married to a woman or having a family. That is true abstinence. A homosexual man isn't giving up anything except for sex.

-Lead us not into temptation and deliver us from evil-


#19

[quote="MPSchneiderLC, post:17, topic:274280"]
Exactly. Here the Vatican just leaves it at "deep-seated tendencies" which caused some problems. (It lacks the clarity and decisiveness Americans would like, but instead gives a general guideline each bishop can apply prudently.) A few days after this document, the WSJ had an editorial attacking the Church for banning all with SSA from the ministry. As far as I can see, Deep-seated tendencies would refer to someone who identifies himself as homosexual to the extent that:
a. the bishop / superior can't trust he will remain chaste, or
b. his dealings with others are as a HOMOSEXUAL in a way that hinders his complete imagining of Christ as an Alter Christus.
It does not seem to ban all with SSA.

Those are my thoughts; I am by no means an expert.

[/quote]

Couldn't some interpret "deep seated" as not being able to change or something. As in: if someone felt they could become heterosexual, or described themselves as "bisexual" these people might be eligible to the priesthood? Whereas people that felt SSA was a cross they would bear their entire lives might not be eligible, because it is deep seated?

Personally, I would definitely not fit into either of those 2 things you list. I'm still a virgin, I've never had sexual or romantic encounters of any kind for that matter. And at this point I'm committed to keeping it that way. And I do know what you're saying. Some people are so blatantly homosexual about everything that they are that it just rubs off in EVERYTHING they talk about or do. But, for myself most people have no reason to not think that I'm straight.

Am I right to think that the intent of this is to keep out progressive priests who might secretly want the Church to change its position on homosexuality? or God forbid, even gay marriage? As well as people they can't trust to be celibate? Do those people have "deep seated homosexual tendencies"... or do all the people with SSA that follow under my first description fall under "deep seated homosexual tendencies?"


#20

Thanks for the responses everyone!

I always thought they could be priests, but I went to a different Church last Sunday and the priest there made a crass remark. :(

...So it got me wondering. Thanks again for everyone's input!


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