[quote=smokey888]The above (message # 9) was from some of his (this Pastor) research, then someone here told me to look at “Salvation” on this site and then “Salvation Outside the Chuch” … I did and now I’m really confussed because … it doesn’t look to good, it sounds a bit egotistical, here’s a part of it from this site. You tell me if it doesn’t sound like ‘only Catholics can go to Heaven’:
Everything below is from this site “Salvation Outside the Church”.
I have applied bold to some and underlined some for emphasis:
The Catechism of the Catholic Church, following historic Christian theology since the time of the early Church Fathers, refers to the Catholic Church as “the universal sacrament of salvation” (CCC 774–776), and states: “The Church in this world is the sacrament of salvation, the sign and the instrument of the communion of God and men” (CCC780).
Many people misunderstand the nature of this teaching.
Indifferentists, going to one extreme, claim that it makes no difference what church one belongs to and that salvation can be attained through any of them. Certain radical traditionalists, going to the other extreme, claim that unless one is a full-fledged, baptized member of the Catholic Church, one will be damned.
The following quotations from the Church Fathers give the straight story. They show that the early Church held the same position on this as the contemporary Church does—that is, while it is normatively necessary to be a Catholic to be saved (see CCC846; Vatican II, Lumen Gentium 14), there are exceptions, and it is possible [my remarks: doesn’t sound hopeful tho, does it] in some circumstances for people to be saved who have not been fully initiated into the Catholic Church (CCC847).
Notice that the same Fathers who declare the normative necessity of being Catholic also declare the possibility of salvation for some who are not Catholics.
These can be saved by what later came to be known as “baptism of blood” or " baptism of desire" (for more on this subject, see the Fathers Know Best tract, The Necessity of Baptism).
The Fathers likewise affirm the possibility of salvation for those who lived before Christ and who were not part of Israel, the Old Testament Church.
However, for those who knowingly and deliberately (that is, not out of innocent ignorance) commit the sins of heresy (rejecting divinely revealed doctrine) or schism (separating from the Catholic Church and/or joining a schismatic church), no salvation would be possible until they repented and returned to live in Catholic unity.
[sounds like to me you have to be Catholic to go to Heaven -]
This is one of those areas where those disdainful of everything post Vat II try to damn everyone outside of the visible Catholic Church.
The Cathecism is quite clear this is not the case and it annoys me when some Catholics try to present this as an official position. It’s not.:nope:
See in particular CCC 817, 818, 819, 821, 838, 843,846, 847,848
‘normatively necessary’ should not be seen as an implication of any sort of majority. If you add up those who never heard the gospel at all, those who heard an imperfect version of the gospel, non-catholics who were taught falsehoods about the Catholic Church together they would heavily outnumber Catholic Christians!
The CCC is ‘a sure norm for the teaching of the faith’ according to the current pope and was approved by the majority of the episcopate by consultation.
Listen to it & the Church and not disgruntled so called ‘traditionalist’ Catholics.