Can we be confident in our Salvation?

As opposed to non Catholic accussations. I dont think we need to subscribe to once saved, always saved to know our foundation in Jesus. To say,“No matter what I do, I am saved” is the sin…but not to say,"I know I am saved.

Thanks,
Michael

Not only CAN we be confident we SHOULD - indeed MUST be confident in our salvation.

No runner competes in a marathon without confidence that they can an will finish the race.

The trick is to not permit confidence to become presumption…or at the other extreme…to allow a lack of “surety” due to our struggles to become despair.

Peace
James

:thumbsup:

I am not Catholic, but am a Christian, and have a problem understanding this as well. John 3:16 says that “whosoever believes in Him (Jesus) shall not perish, but have everlasting life,” yet to me that does not mean that once saved, we can just go out and do anything we want and be guaranteed salvation.

If I am saved one day, but go out the next day and murder someone, then die before I repent and ask for God’s forgiveness, but am given “last rights,” am I still “saved”? This idea makes no sense to me based on what the Bible actually teaches us about living a righteous and Christian life.

Another case in point is the fact that many Italian and other “mobsters” are Catholic and wear a cross around their neck, yet they commit unspeakable sins against their fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, then die with no remorse or repentance for their acts. Then at their funerals, the Priest gives them last rights and the are buried. Is this why people like these have to go to Pergatory? Is that why people say that God does give us a second chance to save our souls before being accepted into Heaven?

Please enlighten me on this subject. I am not educated in this discussion at all and would appreciate a more indepth answer.:confused:

May God bless you and keep you in all you do and say this day and forever more.:signofcross:

I am not Catholic, but am a Christian, and have a problem understanding this as well. John 3:16 says that “whosoever believes in Him (Jesus) shall not perish, but have everlasting life,” yet to me that does not mean that once saved, we can just go out and do anything we want and be guaranteed salvation.

initial salvation is offered us and received through faith and sacrament. Baptism is God’s free gift. It is His love and forgiveness, we did not nor could ever earn. It is justifying but His work is not finished in us…that requires our co-operation, but not without His grace. And it is feminine cooperation…meaning we submit our will to His.

If I am saved one day, but go out the next day and murder someone, then die before I repent and ask for God’s forgiveness, but am given “last rights,” am I still “saved”? This idea makes no sense to me based on what the Bible actually teaches us about living a righteous and Christian life.

God is in eternity, we are not taken out of the book of life until our final judgement (that is my impression, not sure how Church explains)

Another case in point is the fact that many Italian and other “mobsters” are Catholic and wear a cross around their neck, yet they commit unspeakable sins against their fellow brothers and sisters in Christ, then die with no remorse or repentance for their acts. Then at their funerals, the Priest gives them last rights and the are buried. Is this why people like these have to go to Pergatory? Is that why people say that God does give us a second chance to save our souls before being accepted into Heaven?

we cannot know or presume to know other’s salvation. But some sins in others are evidently mortal/grave and in contradiction to the laws of Christ. They are wolves and hypocrates.
As for last rights after death…i have not heard of that nor would I understand it. Those in a state of Purgatory are saved because of the foundation of their faith, yet still have sinfullness that has not destroyed their state of grace in Christ but must be purged of, and/or they have temporal punishments yet to be accounted for

Please enlighten me on this subject. I am not educated in this discussion at all and would appreciate a more indepth answer.:confused:

May God bless you and keep you in all you do and say this day and forever more.:signofcross:

hope I helped some…?
Michael

rc answered well…but I just have to stick in my nickle…:shrug:

Agreed…one has to ask the question, What does believing in Jesus really mean?
It does no good to just stop with John 3:16.
There is a great deal that goes along with this belief. Yet there those (thankfully few) who DO hold to the idea that future sins (while they should be avoided if possible) are already forgiven and as such one’s salvation is not in jeopardy.

If I am saved one day, but go out the next day and murder someone, then die before I repent and ask for God’s forgiveness, but am given “last rights,” am I still “saved”? .

Such a case as you describe would be rare, but certainly there are many cases where a person has sinned but not confessed.
Jesus gave authority to His apostles (and through them to their successors) to forgive sin. The priest, in giving last rites is exercising this authority. Of course…God will dispose of the matter at Judgement and will do so with perfect justice.

This idea makes no sense to me based on what the Bible actually teaches us about living a righteous and Christian life

Amen -
Very well said and something that we always need to keep in mind.
But we also have to remember that we are under the law of Love and not under the OT law. Because we are under the law of Love, each person will be judged to that standard and not to how well they adhere to some prescribed set of laws - such as the Jews did in the OT and which Paul preached against.
Now - before anyone thinks I’m opening the floodgates to all sorts of shenanigans…the Law of Love is actually more difficult than the Law of Moses. It requires an internalizing of the principles of Love and our continual effort at improving…Or as you say above, living a righteous life – but in point of fact we are not simply called to a righteous life…be are called to perfection in Love (Mt 5:48)

Another case in point is the fact that many Italian and other “mobsters” are Catholic and wear a cross around their neck, yet they commit unspeakable sins against their fellow brothers and sisters in Christ,

Yes - there are many, and not just “mobsters” who claim the title Catholic but are merely, what is called, “cultural Catholic”.

then die with no remorse or repentance for their acts.

Actually we do not know what the state of their soul is at the point of death…

Then at their funerals, the Priest gives them last rights and the are buried.

Just as a point of order…last rites are not given to a dead person…

Is this why people like these have to go to Purgatory? Is that why people say that God does give us a second chance to save our souls before being accepted into Heaven?

I can understand where some would think this…but such is not the case. Purgatory is not a “second chance”.
If the person you describe above…and unrepentant mobster comes before Christ in arrogance and tries to stand on his baptism or monies given to the church or whatever…he will be reminded of the verse about not all those who cry Lord Lord will enter the Kingdom but only those who do the will of the Father.

However - if a person has a true repentance - even at the last moment - such a one will throw themselves at the foot of Christ in abject sorrow and ask for no more than what they truly deserve. For such a one who is truly repentant God’s Mercy is great - yet they are not perfected in Love, as required by Mt 5:48 and so such a one goes to purgatory to attain that perfection.

Now - having said all of that - your earlier comment about living a righteous life comes into play here because - how we live our lives predisposes us to certain attitudes, outlooks and decisions. The possibility of a mobster having a true deathbed conversion is, IMHO, very remote…yet I cannot say who has or has not had one…

Please enlighten me on this subject. I am not educated in this discussion at all and would appreciate a more indepth answer.:confused:

Huge amounts have been written on these things…I hope my humble effort above helps just a little…

May God bless you and keep you in all you do and say this day and forever more.:signofcross:

And you as well

Peace
James

Thanks for posting…always
Michael

As always, James so well and thoroughly covered,you are so very good at this gift of Apologetics. Peace, Carlan

:blushing:

Nobody knows in advance that they are saved. What we can say, objectively speaking, is that if we die in a state of grace we are saved.

Yes, you did, and thank you for such clarification. I am soooo happy :extrahappy: that I am a Christian and that Christ is my personal Savior and my Light. I am a sinner as is everyone else, but thank goodness that Jesus came and saved us.

:blessyou:

Amen Carl.
And May God continue to be near to you on your journey.

Peace
James

This is true…but I think it also true that one can “know” - maybe not perfectly but with a fair amount of certainty - whether one is in a state of grace or not.
And if we are unsure, or if we genuinely believe (or know) that we are NOT in a state of grace…we have only to go to our confessor to discuss and resolve the matter. :thumbsup:

Peace
James

Right…If we Believe in our hearts and live according to our belief, then we believing Truth. That is a pure knowledge. This is the confedence God desires for us! Not a constant uncertainty of every day wondering if we are going to hell. But everyday being thankful in true response to the salvation given to us. We believe the Truth.

I opened this thread to Catholics who let the devil doubt their faith. He wants us to think we need to be good enough. That is not the meaning of “Faith and Works” doctrine.

As the Catholic Answers tract states:

What To Say

“Are you saved?” asks the Fundamentalist. The Catholic should reply: “As the Bible says, I am already saved (Rom. 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8), but I’m also being saved (1 Cor. 1:18, 2 Cor. 2:15, Phil. 2:12), and I have the hope that I will be saved (Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15). Like the apostle Paul I am working out my salvation in fear and trembling (Phil. 2:12), with hopeful confidence in the promises of Christ (Rom. 5:2, 2 Tim. 2:11–13).”

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