Can we examine mortal sin please?


#1

Many of us are getting caught up in uncertainty about their state of grace because of misunderstanding. There are daily questions wheather a sin is mortal or venial.
We do not believe in “Assurance of Salvation” or “Faith Alone” , as in the doctrines, when they contradict a continual conversion of heart. Nor do we believe them when they deny neccessary fruits of repentance. But this does not mean we cannot or should not be confident that we are going to heaven!
What disturbs me, is the fear among us that because a particular sin is labled mortal by the Church, and we commit it under varying circumstances, we think we are going to hell if we die. Two examples, would be missing Mass and masturbation. I believe these actions have the potential to be mortal sin because the Church teaches, however, it would take a considerable amount of contributing factors in order to be so. Namely the underlying sin in these to be mortal would lie in our hearts! I mean, if in our hearts we do not consider them damaging sin or if we do not have remorse for our failings.
What i am saying is that just because we may not have fully reconciled ourselves in Jesus, does not mean that we arent reconciled out of the ultimate penalty of death.
Two scriptures to support this would be 1Cor.10-15 (focusing on a foundation on Jesus)
And Matt.18:21-35 (focussing on Purgatory which is corrective punishments in order to purify the heart but not damnation!)


#2

I agree that there’s a danger in being tempted to reduce grace and sin to mere ingredients in a formula, a mechanistic approach to our justification. But the categories of venial sin (forgivable sin) and mortal sin (sin that leads to death), are instructive in our examining our relationship with God. The Catechism offers this statement regarding not only the deliberateness but also the persistence required in order for a sin to be mortal:

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell; for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end.


#3

[quote="fhansen, post:2, topic:332694"]
I agree that there's a danger in being tempted to reduce grace and sin to mere ingredients in a formula, a mechanistic approach to our justification. But the categories of venial sin (forgivable sin) and mortal sin (sin that leads to death), are instructive in our examining our relationship with God. The Catechism offers this statement regarding not only the deliberateness but also the persistence required in order for a sin to be mortal:

1037 God predestines no one to go to hell; for this, a willful turning away from God (a mortal sin) is necessary, and persistence in it until the end.

[/quote]

Thanks! Great qoute from the Cat.! Persistence til the end would mean remaining in complete unrepentence and remorse til death. This is almost NEVER the case with someone questioning their state of grace here.


#4

[quote="rcwitness, post:1, topic:332694"]
Many of us are getting caught up in uncertainty about their state of grace because of misunderstanding. There are daily questions wheather a sin is mortal or venial.
We do not believe in "Assurance of Salvation" or "Faith Alone" , as in the doctrines, when they contradict a continual conversion of heart. Nor do we believe them when they deny neccessary fruits of repentance. But this does not mean we cannot or should not be confident that we are going to heaven!
What disturbs me, is the fear among us that because a particular sin is labled mortal by the Church, and we commit it under varying circumstances, we think we are going to hell if we die. Two examples, would be missing Mass and masturbation. I believe these actions have the potential to be mortal sin because the Church teaches, however, it would take** a considerable amount of contributing factors in order to be so*.* Namely the underlying sin in these to be mortal would lie in our hearts! I mean, if in our hearts we do not consider them damaging sin or if we do not have remorse for our failings.**
What i am saying is that just because we may not have fully reconciled ourselves in Jesus, does not mean that we arent reconciled out of the ultimate penalty of death.
Two scriptures to support this would be 1Cor.10-15 (focusing on a foundation on Jesus)
And Matt.18:21-35 (focussing on Purgatory which is corrective punishments in order to purify the heart but not damnation!)

[/quote]


#5

What disturbs me, is the fear among us that because a particular sin is labled mortal by the Church, and we commit it under varying circumstances, we think we are going to hell if we die.

I may be wrong, but the Catechism (the Church) does not label specific sins as “mortal”…but uses terms in specific sins as…" moral evil…gravely immoral…gravely contrary to the moral law…grave offense" such as abortion (2271; 2272)…and for Sunday Mass obligation…"…Those who deliberately fail in this obligation commit a grave sin (2181). For the sin against the 6th Commandment…"…Among the sins gravely contrary to chastity are masturbation, fornication, pornography, and homosexual practices.2396.

Specifically, the Church is calling each of us to rely on three things in judging ourselves…(1) examine our conscience…(2) determine if the three elements are in place for a sin to be mortal…(3) use the Sacrament of Confession regularly and especially whenever in doubt or concern about a possible a rupture of communion with him [God]. and at the same time it damages our ** full communion with the Body of Christ…His Church**.

The Church’s Dogma is clear…

1035 The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the** souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, "eternal fire**."617 The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.

The Church is clear on our journey to God in this life…in this"valley of tears"…and uses Saint Paul’s admonition:

GOD’S SALVATION: LAW AND GRACE

1949 Called to beatitude but wounded by sin, man stands in need of salvation from God. Divine help comes to him in Christ through the law that guides him and the grace that sustains him:

Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.1 1 Phil 2:12-13. ]

So for me…this fear of going to hell…if I commit a Church defined serious/grave sin…is a grace…a grace to do what the Holy Spirit and the Church are guiding me to do…examine my conscience thoroughly each day…beg for God’s mercy daily for all my sins…and go to confession regularly…and go ASAP if it is a defined serious/grave sin by the Church’s dogma/doctrine.

…and let the Our Lord Jesus, through his priest…acting in persona Christi…judge my objective culpability for committing that sin. I simply think its bad spirituality to…after committing what is a defined grave sin…to resolve a fear of going to hell for that sin…by conjuring up a sense of peace because I am probably not culpable…and it is not a mortal/deadly sin. In other words…objectively I know I committed a grave sin (no question about what I did)…but I judge that subjectively…its not a mortal/deadly sin because of a lot of mitigating factors/circumstances.

I fear my ability to “rationalize” more than my actual sins…

Quotes from the movie The Big Chill

I don’t know anyone who could get through the day without two or three juicy rationalizations. They’re more important than sex. Michael

Ah, come on. Nothing’s more important than sex. Sam

Oh yeah? Ever gone a week without a rationalization? Michael

One of the things I remember very vividly…going out on combat missions…the priest-chaplains…always came to our staging area…and got all of us Catholics together…and gave us General Confession absolution and forgiveness for all our sins…and when we got back…if we did…he was always hanging around with his purple stole and sacrament prayer book…to hear our individual confessions…for any grave sins that he had already absolved (a stipulation for General Confession). The Padre once told me that if he could not give that General Confession absolution and forgiveness of our sins…before for the combat mission…and someone did not come back alive…he would have been an emotional wreck. I saw him and other priest-chaplains going to confession to each other…often. Good enough for a Padre…good enough for me and my sorry soul.

Matthew 7: 13-14 (Revised Standard Version -Catholic Edition)

The Narrow Gate

13 “Enter by the narrow gate; for the** gate is wide and the way is easy,[a] that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many.** 14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard, that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

Just some thoughts for consideration.

Pax Christi


#6

Thanks Lancer,
I see what you mean about rationalization. It does not help us and even destroys goodness from God, given to us for our benefit. Someone can rationalize to many degrees. Perhaps i am rationalizing some...? But my point is regarding salvation and those who do have a love for Christ and though they fall into a "mortal" sin, are most likely not going to hell because of it when they have remorse and a "spirit of regret". I am not wishing to diminish Church teaching, but encourage a better conversion of heart. All sins our conscience is bringing to our attention should and need to be given to Christ. The normal and righteous way is through the Sacrement of Reconciliation. It completes the repentant persons confession, and penance completes the satisfaction of the sinners remorse. But that is Christ's way of wiping out all consequences of it. There is a difference with that and "suffering the loss" of sin's damage through our Lord's purging, but escaping the ultimate penalty of death because the "foundation" of Christ's passion against sins may be in our hearts.


#7

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