CARM Article on Transubstantiation


#1

I’m ashamed that I can’t defend my faith better, but some of the stuff I read on CARM confused me. Would it take a Scott Hahn to know what to say? If you care to, take a look at an article that was on their home page under the title Roman Catholicism:

carm.org/catholic/transubstantiation.htm

What would you say to this? I really need to study and understand, because most of my family have left the Church.


#2

[quote=CatholicChef]I’m ashamed that I can’t defend my faith better, but some of the stuff I read on CARM confused me. Would it take a Scott Hahn to know what to say? If you care to, take a look at an article that was on their home page under the title Roman Catholicism:

carm.org/catholic/transubstantiation.htm

What would you say to this? I really need to study and understand, because most of my family have left the Church.
[/quote]

Parts of it are accurate, if a bit unfamiliar in “Protestantese” :slight_smile: - but parts are seriously off-beam, or are worded in such a way that they seem to rest on misunderstandings. And that is before I read a quarter of it.

What it needs is a lengthy examination - not a few words in a post; there’s not the space for that.

The mistakes are not that surprising, given that Catholic accounts of transubstantiation have sometimes been worded for those without knowledge of theology or metaphysics: such as children, for whom such detail would not be a help - but that has meant a considerable degree of over-simplification. Metaphysics cannot - if one is going to speak of transubstantiation in any detail - be avoided; not because it is founded upon metaphysics rather than revelation; but because metaphysical language is the least unhelpful we have, if we are to discuss transubstantiation in detail.

The article is also ahistorical in outlook - it is not an objection that the disciples did not adore the Eucharist: it would be an objection only if development in doctrines about things believed in, & and in understanding of them, were impossible.

One must also take into account that a Calvinist author is writing with a Calvinist outlook on these matters - not a Catholic one. So one must try to see what the Calvinist understanding, & way of thinking theologically, is based on. It is based on more than the Bible. This may help:

reformed.org/documents/dogma/disc_power.html

Sections 4 & 20-22 may be a surprise to some :slight_smile: - the whole thing is quite long, but it deserves a close reading.

For this topic is a theology degree is a very helpful thing :slight_smile: ##


#3

[quote=CatholicChef]I’m ashamed that I can’t defend my faith better, but some of the stuff I read on CARM confused me. Would it take a Scott Hahn to know what to say? If you care to, take a look at an article that was on their home page under the title Roman Catholicism:

carm.org/catholic/transubstantiation.htm

What would you say to this? I really need to study and understand, because most of my family have left the Church.
[/quote]

From my brief experince, the CARM members laugh, belittle, ridicule, and scoff at the Catholic Apologetics so I do not think that anyone can convince these people otherwise. In my humble opinion, the truth of the matter is that I am not convinced that the efforts of many of these people are God-centered at all, but me-centered, i.e., THEY want to be the ones to lead you AWAY from the Catholic Church to THEIR doctrine. They are not doing it to for God, but for themselves. How often have you read them brag about leading people away from the Catholic Church? I’m not an expert, but the more they push, the more they denounce the Catholic church, the more links they prop up similar to the one that you showed, the more devout I am toward my Catholicism because the Catholic Church must be doing something right or these people would not feel so threatened. They may profess it is not about Catholics, but only Catholicsim, but after reading some of the posts the attacks are one in the same. Some people like to exchange opinions and can do so in a cordial manner. I cannot. I take their statements as personal attacks and I view their efforts as clever in that all contains the “Ah-ha! Gotcha!” factor. Again, in my humble opinion, I think people leave the Church for other denominations because the Cahtolic Church truly is God-centered. Look at the Bible-only non-denominational churches, which are people-centered with their rock bands, big-screens, and coffee shops. I think there are good churches out there, don;t get me wrong, but the Bible-only people really have a mean streak, and these are just my opinions.


#4

Split from “CARM Discussion Board”.
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#5

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