Catholic School IB program


#1

I found a Catholic school for my five year old son and we have been very happy there. I just found out they are implementing the IB world education program. I am devastated. Here I thought I found a “home” where a love of country and God would be taught. After researching this program it is anything but love of country and God. It runs under UN guidelines and is completely counter to my believes. The principle has assured me it’s nothing more than a certification program for teachers to collaborate, whatever that means. It clearly states in it’s own literature that it teaches moral relativism. I have also found it teaches anti USA garbage and guilt inspired environmentalism, all dressed up to seem peaceful. I had recently decided to return to Catholism and have been so excited with all I have learned about the church. I planned to raise my son Catholic partly because of his attending this school and felt I would stay with the school till he graduated. In trying to research my second choice for a Catholic school I found their mission statement to also be quite “new agey” liberal sounding. For further research I went to a local nondenominational Christion schools web site and found their mission statement and beliefs. It was completely descriptive of my ideals in educating my son, to a tee. Teaching pride in America, Christian values, solid fundamental no frills academics with no new-agey descriptions. Am I in the wrong church and school here? I’m open to all advice at this point. Thanks, Julia


#2

Well, I’ll give this a go…

The Catholic Church is the Universal Church. While love of country is a virtue, don’t expect American exceptionalism (in which I believe BTW) to be high on the list of things taught at a Catholic school. There are hundreds of millions of Catholics who are not Americans, so really, the Church has no business crowing about America being a better country as a Church position. That said, I have heard both Popes of my lifetime praise the United States as being a supporter and defender of freedom, and for being a country that largely lives out its Christian sensibility.

Many of the Protestant churches you see are native American (not Native American) churches and are firmly rooted in American exceptionalism as a foundation of who they are. Not just love of country as a virtue, but love for the United States specifically. It’s just a foundational difference that comes from the origins of the churches in question.

All of that being said, no school should be using a United Nations sponsored, America hating educational program. They want to beat down our natural love for our country and make us all feel guilty for the financial and technological success born of our freedom. Never mind that we use all that success to feed and defend the world… I too would object to an IB program in a school my children went to. BTW, either the principal is ignorant, or is just trying to shut you up with that “it’s just a certification program.” It is a program with an intent and agenda unhealthy to American children, and the future of America in the hands of those children.


#3

I would ask more specific questions about it. Ask if they are using the IB programs materials in class and how they plan to explain ________ (fill in the blank with a problematic concept here…). Is it possible the principal is not completely aware of what the IB program entails? Or could she be taking some part of it and leaving others (which I don’t get - there are so many good programs out there…). I would make an appointment with her and go over it in detail so you can see exactly what they plan to do with it.


#4

Wow, two great answers, thank you both so much! I’m glad you made the non American heritage point. I just wasn’t thinking of that but the universality of the church is one of things that I have been so drawn to. I think I will just sit down with the principle and ask direct questions as suggested. I’m pretty uncomfortable doing that but then I would know exactly what I’m dealing with. After reading many of the IB documents though, I can’t imagine that there is some non-invasive use for the program. We’ll see. Thanks again, Julia


#5

This is the mission statement found on ibo.org/mission/

The International Baccalaureate aims to develop inquiring, knowledgeable and caring young people who help to create a better and more peaceful world through intercultural understanding and respect.

To this end the organization works with schools, governments and international organizations to develop challenging programmes of international education and rigorous assessment.

These programmes encourage students across the world to become active, compassionate and lifelong learners who understand that other people, with their differences, can also be right.

In my experience with IB programs, especially for Catholic High Schools, students are still taking religion classes and IB just supplements the AP and Honors programs already established. The only difference is that students aren’t learning materials from an American-Eurocentric view of the world, they are able to view the world in a global sense.


#6

You would be most fortunate indeed if you could send your child to a Catholic school that offers the IB program. My daughter’s high school does, and I can tell you as someone who works at a university that the IB program is very highly regarded. Most colleges look at IB classes as being far superior to AP. Your child will be challenged to think.

I really haven’t seen anything in the curriculum that would go against my faith or morals as a Catholic. I think if you investigate this further, you might be pleasantly surprised.


#7

I do not have any school-age children. What are the “IB” or “AP” programs?


#8

IB stands for international baccalaureate. AP stands for advanced placement.


#9

Of course colleges highly regard the IB program… they are run by liberal academics who think the worst of the United States.


#10

What, is it the US vs. the rest of the world? If you have any international connection then you are anti-US?

I’m sorry, but I work at a college and while we do have an interest in multi-culturalism, there is no atomosphere of USA bashing here. Sheesh.


#11

Everything I have read about the IB program is fantastic and it will definitley help your child in the future.

With 4 sons growing up (6, 4, 2 and 2 months) I hope that my parish eventually implements something like this.

Please take a step back and realize that within 20 years (possibly 30) both India and China will have larger (maybe not more prosperous though) economies than the United States.

This isn’t a liberal idea, this is just economic fact based upon population. With the advances in telecommunications etc… the Worlds economy will continue to grow as a global economy. The more a young person is able to gain knowledge which will prepare them for that the better they will be in the future.

This isn’t “liberal” or “conservative” those terms have no meaning here as both groups take great pride in their Nation and their Heritage. To desire social programs so that people have enough to eat isn’t anti-American, it’s Biblical. You will find young men and women who adhere to both of those terms fighting for us so that the world is a better place.

The bottom line I believe is that AP was developed in the 80s primarily aimed at gifted students in the US to earn college credits and advanced information. The IB programs just takes that to another level in that it, like the ITIL Technology framework, allows for people to work on knowledge that can make an impact globally.

On a completely different note to the OP, I would suggest more research on Global Warming from an non-biased source. God gave us this world and it’s species to care for (dominion over the animals - Genesis). While we continually pray for Christ’s return, we still need to take care of the planet He has given us. There are no, not even one, credible theories (from peer reviewed journals) that deny Global warming. There were some fabrications put up by those who found it economically beneficial to deny it during the past 8 years but we see now how that same greed led us financially as a nation. This again isn’t a Liberal or Conservative idea nor Catholic or Protestant as you will find many of the younger (like Rick Warren) evangelicals and the Vatican itself teaching us to be environmentally conscious. In fact to be completely wasteful and ignore the reality can actually be a mortal sin according to documents released last year. (update to the 7 deadly sins if you want to google it)

Joe


#12

The rhetoric that comes out of the UN…

The rhetoric spouted by European countries who are supposed to be our allies…

The academics who make the news, and so whose thoughts with which we are familiar…

The offensive and belligerent actions taken against the US by the “international community”

… followed by the expectation that we will forgive all their debt and then save them from their own internecine battles or from their enemies…

And the name-calling and hatred directed at us once we have gone and saved them, and fed them, and helped their dictators assume room temperature…

I am sorry, but any program that is run or endorsed by the UN, which has become nothing more than a third-world US bashers club, is not something I want in my children’s school. Any program that attempts to tell my children that China and Iran and Cuba and North Korea are systems worthy of respect and study, and of equal value to our own, is something I would fight. (The people, of course, are of equal value as is any human being. I mean the governments and the thugs who run them.) That is what the UN and multi-culturalism are all about.

So yes, I guess in some ways, it is the US against the world. But not because WE set it up that way.

jwashu, there is no credible evidence to support human-caused global warming. And plenty of respected scientists, a growing number, in fact, who refuse to accept the cooked data of the global warming crowd. There is growing evidence that we are seeing the fluctuations of natural cycles, through which the Earth and Sun have gone before. The human total contribution of carbon dioxide is less than 3%. Even if we eliminated that, it would make little to no difference. Climate scientists have even returned to the cries from 30 years ago of global cooling. “Climate change” is the new name for the communists that had nowhere else to go. They just found a new way to destroy capitalist economies and use guilt to do it. And then people like you go and tell us we’re bad Christians if we refuse to accept the hooey! I don’t think we have the power to destroy this planet. That is the ultimate human hubris! We can destroy ourselves, no doubt… but the PLANET? No way.


#13

The mission statement just rings odd to me. No real substance? And what do they mean by “who understand that other people, with their differences, can also be right.”? That is almost condescending in my mind. 99% of the people in this world get along with each other just fine. (It’s the bad leaders who cause the fighting.) This seems to be a pointless point to be a major part of a mission statement unless there’s more to it than meets the eye. What scares me about this IB program is when you put constitutional American philosophy up as an equal to unsuccessful forms of government as this program seems to do. Sometimes in this world, one thing is superior to another. We are scaring our children away from making this determination. As Catholics it is a given that all people, of all cultures, are God’s children and equals as human beings, yet we keep pounding and pounding in own childrens little heads that we are guilty Americans. Although all people are equal (I can’t believe we find it necessary even have to say this to each other every two seconds), our constitutional republic IS better than other forms of government. (although our government officials and corruption------another topic) I don’t approve of teaching American children from anything other than an American/Western viewpoint, now more than ever with communist China etc. on the rise as someone stated. China prospers BECAUSE of our form of government and other countries western influences. We support them. If we destroy the love of country in our children, (only basic respect of tradition is what IB claims to teach) we will loose our form of government for the next generation, then what? The entire world will suffer.
On another note, some of you seem to be knowledgeable in the IB program. Can you explain how much of what I am concerned about would show up? I was told that all courses relate back to that moral relativism ideal. I can’t emphasize enough, I am against moral relativism and what it does to the functioning of the mind and thinking style.
BTW, I read an interesting article on how intricately difficult it is for even top notch scientists to compute global warming theories. Change one small number and everything down the line is destroyed. Scientist seem to be split on both if it is happening at all and if so, can we as humans affect it. It all boils down to who we choose to believe. Faith, motives of the scientist, reporter, or politician, and maybe trusting our own consideration of the obvious. I care about the world environment more than anyone could ever dream and am saddened it has been made into a political pawn.
Thanks everyone for your input.


#14

Check out this web site:

stopcommoncore.com/
Stop Common Core

also:

truthaboutib.com/catholicoppositiontoib.html
Truth about I.B.

and:

US News article:
truthaboutib.com/catholicoppositiontoib.html

This is also related to the U.N. Agenda 21 plan.

High Schoolers indoctrinated by UN’s Agenda 21
canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/40204

Please be informed as to how the educrats are shaping our next generation to be World Citizens.

Peace,
Mimi


#15

FYI

This is four-year-old post, so the school issue with the young kindergartener that the original poster was concerned about is now in 4th grade so my guess is the issue has been resolved


#16

[quote="jwashu, post:11, topic:150566"]
Everything I have read about the IB program is fantastic and it will definitley help your child in the future.

With 4 sons growing up (6, 4, 2 and 2 months) I hope that my parish eventually implements something like this.

Please take a step back and realize that within 20 years (possibly 30) both India and China will have larger (maybe not more prosperous though) economies than the United States.

This isn't a liberal idea, this is just economic fact based upon population. With the advances in telecommunications etc... the Worlds economy will continue to grow as a global economy. The more a young person is able to gain knowledge which will prepare them for that the better they will be in the future.

This isn't "liberal" or "conservative" those terms have no meaning here as both groups take great pride in their Nation and their Heritage. To desire social programs so that people have enough to eat isn't anti-American, it's Biblical. You will find young men and women who adhere to both of those terms fighting for us so that the world is a better place.

The bottom line I believe is that AP was developed in the 80s primarily aimed at gifted students in the US to earn college credits and advanced information. The IB programs just takes that to another level in that it, like the ITIL Technology framework, allows for people to work on knowledge that can make an impact globally.

On a completely different note to the OP, I would suggest more research on Global Warming from an non-biased source. God gave us this world and it's species to care for (dominion over the animals - Genesis). While we continually pray for Christ's return, we still need to take care of the planet He has given us. There are no, not even one, credible theories (from peer reviewed journals) that deny Global warming. There were some fabrications put up by those who found it economically beneficial to deny it during the past 8 years but we see now how that same greed led us financially as a nation. This again isn't a Liberal or Conservative idea nor Catholic or Protestant as you will find many of the younger (like Rick Warren) evangelicals and the Vatican itself teaching us to be environmentally conscious. In fact to be completely wasteful and ignore the reality can actually be a mortal sin according to documents released last year. (update to the 7 deadly sins if you want to google it)

Joe

[/quote]

I am a recent high school grad (2012) and we had the IB program at my school. My school had just been certified, so only a small handful of kids actually persued the whole diploma. Most kids on the high achieving end took at least an IB class or two and sometimes tested for the certificate. Or kids just took the AP classes and took the AP test(s) because that's what they preferred or their future colleges accepted. Not all colleges accept IB yet. I took a few IB classes (never tested, though) but primarily took AP classes.

Uhh....

So I'm not really understanding the whole IB bashing. :confused:

I'm really just not understand it. At all.

OP, if you're going to bash IB, you're going to perhaps have to give a bit more evidence or support for your disliking.

I had a fantastic experience with the IB classes I took during high school. They were academically challenging. I personally prefer AP classes because they lean a little more to the standard lecture style class, but IB definitely focuses on a more interactive class. Or at least that's how the IB classe I took were. I never felt brainwashed or anti-American. :confused:

Ok, so OP, you're concerned that it teaches moral relativism? I hate to break it to you, and I honestly feel sad that you haven't realized this yet, but that's the foundation of ANY school. Not even an IB program. But there's always discussions on the differences in morals. I don't think the IB program in itself necessarily does anything to promote one set of morals over another. IB focuses a lot on culture...but I wouldn't say that's moral relativism at all. A student SHOULD be culturally aware of the various lifestyles of people in the world, even if they do not agree.

Furtheremore, you should really look into how the classes are actually taught and the teachers. I know I sound quite like a puppet of IB, which is funny because I'm actually not a big fan of the program at all, but I think you're placing way to much emphasis on the fact that the school has an IB program and not focusing enough on how the school actually functions (morals/standards of teachers, creatiing a healthy environment for students and so on). I think it's great you're so concerned with your son's education, but I think your'e jumping the gun super early on this one. No need to make a mountain out of a molehill...

If you or anyone else on this forum have any questions concerning the IB program, I would be happy to answer them. As I mentioned, I have direct experience taking IB classes within the last three years.

Best wishes and good luck.


#17

[quote="Mimi, post:14, topic:150566"]
Check out this web site:

stopcommoncore.com/
Stop Common Core

also:

truthaboutib.com/catholicoppositiontoib.html
Truth about I.B.

and:

US News article:
truthaboutib.com/catholicoppositiontoib.html

This is also related to the U.N. Agenda 21 plan.

High Schoolers indoctrinated by UN’s Agenda 21
canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/40204

Please be informed as to how the educrats are shaping our next generation to be World Citizens.

Peace,
Mimi

[/quote]

I know that this is an old thread bumped up but I have to say the IB program in my experience is not what was described at all.
My only complaint is that it was a lot of work :D and the grading is quite rigid/ standardized. It is certainly not for everyone.
It encourages a well rounded education and students to think critically and philosophically and connects subjects together... or at least tries to.

There is no brainwashing or promotion of moral relativism or anti-Americanism.

There are questions in many subjects such as "discuss the ethical implications of ....", "discuss the economic importance of...", "discuss the use of ___________ in other cultures" etc. It may encourage you to look at topics from many points of views, but never asserts that you have to say "they are all right" or asserts that you have to subscribe to a certain philosophy. They want to see you present different viewpoints, but they do not need you to say "they are all right". I wrote my history exam essays from a pretty pro-American perspective, but I also presented opposing arguments, and then refuted them. I got a 7 (out of 7) in history.

The marking criteria is pretty objective. I wrote my Theory of Knowledge essay to be essentially against relativism, subjectivism... got an A, marked by the IB.

PS: yes I'm an IB diploma program graduate.


#18

[quote="Mimi, post:14, topic:150566"]
Check out this web site:

stopcommoncore.com/
Stop Common Core

also:

truthaboutib.com/catholicoppositiontoib.html
Truth about I.B.

and:

US News article:
truthaboutib.com/catholicoppositiontoib.html

This is also related to the U.N. Agenda 21 plan.

High Schoolers indoctrinated by UN’s Agenda 21
canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/40204

Please be informed as to how the educrats are shaping our next generation to be World Citizens.

Peace,
Mimi

[/quote]

Thanks for the additional information.

It's hard to believe this was all the way back in 2009. It seems like it was just a few months ago...


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