Catholic views on the end times


#1

The church i joined in 04 was not a Catholic church. I was taught there about the end times. That in the end all the faithful would just disappear. The ani christ would be in charge for 7 years during which time those left behind could still have a chance to come to Christ...basically every thing in the Left Behind book series. Now that I am in the Catholic church i understand Catholics dont believe this. Im quite sure i will be dead long before Christ returns but im a curious type and would like to know what the thoughts and beliefs of the Catholic church is. I am also the type of person who needs to know why! If you could please give me verses to support the beliefs it would sure help me understand.
Thanks :)


#2

I Think it goes a bit like this…
I am the way ,the truth and the light. no one knows the hour of Jesus return…
Its in Revelations somewhere… and I’m sure I quoted it incorrectly…
in other words… no one knows… I’v watched good meaning people on Christian television shows that say we are in the Final days… from when I started watching T.V in the 50’s…
and if it were that close… we would have seen it by now… the world I think has a long way to go yet… Jesus return will not be in our lifetime… but really… does it really matter ?
Just try to be humble & charitable in your life and pray to God for your life…
because life is actually darn good…

                 God Bless

#3

[quote="shelly5254, post:1, topic:335835"]
The church i joined in 04 was not a Catholic church. I was taught there about the end times. That in the end all the faithful would just disappear. The ani christ would be in charge for 7 years during which time those left behind could still have a chance to come to Christ...basically every thing in the Left Behind book series. Now that I am in the Catholic church i understand Catholics dont believe this. Im quite sure i will be dead long before Christ returns but im a curious type and would like to know what the thoughts and beliefs of the Catholic church is. I am also the type of person who needs to know why! If you could please give me verses to support the beliefs it would sure help me understand.
Thanks :)

[/quote]

We believe what the scriptures say and it doesn't say :

[quote="shelly5254, post:1, topic:335835"]
That in the end all the faithful would just disappear. The ani christ would be in charge for 7 years during which time those left behind could still have a chance to come to Christ...basically every thing in the Left Behind book series.

[/quote]

The passages they quote do not describe what they say will happen. for example: The scripture that says we will be caught up (raptured) is 1 thes chapter 4

"16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up( raptured) together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. "

Trumpets blaring, dead rising. that doesn't sound like a secret return to get the believers so they won't have to suffer. This is describing Christ's triumphant return once and for all. Notice it is those who are left that are raptured

Now lets look at the "left behind" passages:
Matthew 24

37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.*** 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left. ***

Luke chapter 17:

26 “Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it be in the days of the Son of Man. 27 People were eating, drinking, marrying and being given in marriage up to the day Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.

28 “It was the same in the days of Lot. People were eating and drinking, buying and selling, planting and building. 29 But the day Lot left Sodom, fire and sulfur rained down from heaven and destroyed them all.

30 “It will be just like this on the day the Son of Man is revealed. 31 On that day no one who is on the housetop, with possessions inside, should go down to get them. Likewise, no one in the field should go back for anything. 32* Remember Lot’s wife! *33 Whoever tries to keep their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life will preserve it. 34 I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. 35 Two women will be grinding grain together; one will be taken and the other left.” [36] [e]

And what does the bible say about the people who were destroyed in Sodom and gohmora?

Genesis 19

15 With the coming of dawn, the angels urged Lot, saying, “Hurry! Take your wife and your two daughters who are here,*** or you will be swept away when the city is punished.***”

16 When he hesitated, the men grasped his hand and the hands of his wife and of his two daughters and led them safely out of the city, for the Lord was merciful to them. 17 As soon as they had brought them out, one of them said, “Flee for your lives! Don’t look back, and don’t stop anywhere in the plain*! Flee to the mountains or you will be swept away!”*

Notice that in both the "Left behind" passages the event is compared to Noah and Lot and it's the bad guys who were taken and the good people left behind.

You want to be left behind.

Why? because

Matthew chapter 13;

24 Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. 25 But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. 26 When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.

27 “The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’

28 “‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.

“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’

29 “‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may uproot the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters:*** First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned;*** then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”

So to summerize. Everyone stays here. Then 1 day Jesus returns in Glory. The dead rise, trumpets blare. The wicked are taken and burned. Those who are left behind (the saved) will be caught up (raptured) in the air with our lord and the new creation begins.

This is the view of the church from the beginning. The "Left behind/ Rapture" concept of the evangelical Protestant Christians has only been around for about 150 years.


#4

We are in the End Times and have been since Pentecost. Many in the first decades of the Church Era were convinced that Jesus would return in the lifetime of the Apostles. St. Paul particularly wrote in some of his earlier letters that time is so short that it wouldn’t be worthwhile to make long term plans (e.g. marriage). His later letters corrected this by giving instructions for a longer life.

The phenomenon is known as the “receding parousia” or “receding eshaton.” Many new believers actually experience it today, expecting the Second Coming shortly after their own conversion and allowing for a “delayed” return as they grow older. The irony is that while the perception of the End is getting further away, in fact it is coming closer.


#5

I know we do not believe in the Rapture. Personally, I try not to dwell on it too much


#6

Here is the teaching of the Catholic Church about the Last Things:

When each of us dies, our souls are immediately taken to the presence of God and judged. This is called the Particular Judgment. At this point we begin our eternal destiny. If we are going to hell, our souls go directly there. If we are deemed worthy of heaven, our souls will go directly to heaven, or if we are going to heaven but are in need of purification, we may go to Purgatory first for a while (everyone in Purgatory will eventually go to heaven). Whatever our fate, our souls will stay there (heaven or hell) until the end of time, at which time the Second Coming will occur.

At the Second Coming at the end of time, those Christians still alive and who are in a state of sanctifying grace will be taken to heaven (what some Protestants think of as of “the rapture”). Then will occur the General Judgment. At that time the souls of the living and the dead will be reunited with their bodies and brought together in God’s presence and judged before all. Those who have already been judged in the Particular Judgment will be brought from wherever their souls were -heaven, hell or Purgatory-- and have their judgment confirmed before all, so that both the justice and mercy of God will be manifest to all.

After this, time and Purgatory will be no more and all will enter with their souls and bodies into their eternal destiny, either hell or heaven.

This is an extremely bare-bones sketch, so if you want to get the details, see the five articles I linked below:

www.pacifier.com/~rosarweb/ll57n1.htm
www.pacifier.com/~rosarweb/ll57n2.htm
www.pacifier.com/~rosarweb/ll57n3.htm
www.pacifier.com/~rosarweb/ll57n4.htm
www.pacifier.com/~rosarweb/ll49n6.htm

In addition, you have to learn to recognize erroneous teachings about the End Times popularized by fundamentalists. In other words, toss out the “Left Behind” and “Late, Great Planet Earth” baloney. Here are some resources to help you develop some discernment in these areas:

catholic.com/library/rapture.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/2000/0011fea2.asp
catholic.com/library/false_profit.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/2002/0211fea3.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/2000/0001fea1.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/1995/9510ntg.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/2002/0209fea5.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/1998/9812chap.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/2003/0304bt.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9705chap.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/1994/9409fea4.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/1994/9410fea2.asp
catholic.com/thisrock/2000/0009bite.asp
carl-olson.com/rapture_articles.html


#7

[quote="shelly5254, post:1, topic:335835"]
The church i joined in 04 was not a Catholic church. I was taught there about the end times. That in the end all the faithful would just disappear. The ani christ would be in charge for 7 years during which time those left behind could still have a chance to come to Christ...basically every thing in the Left Behind book series. Now that I am in the Catholic church i understand Catholics dont believe this. Im quite sure i will be dead long before Christ returns but im a curious type and would like to know what the thoughts and beliefs of the Catholic church is. I am also the type of person who needs to know why! If you could please give me verses to support the beliefs it would sure help me understand.
Thanks :)

[/quote]

There are twoo good Catholic books out there that can help you in dealing with the end times rapture and dispensationalism. One is "Will Catholics be Left Behind" and the other is the "Rapture trap". Both explain the history and error of what we were taught and the Catholic position on end times and Christ second coming.


#8

Really, please Catholic brothers and sisters, don’t pay attention to the End.

…do not worry about tomorrow;
for tomorrow will care for itself.
Each day has enough trouble
of its own.
(Matthew 6:34)

What about now?

[RIGHT]And the Rapture Myth is
for people too cowardly or
too proud to believe they
will see the Tribulation.
[/RIGHT]


#9

Many Protestants believe in the pre-tribulation rapture myth, mostly evangelical conservative types, but it certainly isn’t taught as doctrine in mainline established churches such as the Anglicans and Presbyterians. Its mostly an American phenomenon created by the intellectually challenged Tim LaHaye and his Left Behind series of multi-million dollar making novels. The tribulation will be a time of great persecution for all Christians. The stage for this persecution is I believe ] already well underway. God help and preserve those who are to endure it. It will make the Great Diocletianic Persecutions look mild by comparison. The rapture comes after the persecution / Great Tribulation, not before! Scripture confirm it 100%. I think most Catholics avoid discussing end-time eschatology because they are often accused as being part of the Anti-Christ which is an intensely offensive notion. The Catholic Church is not the Beast as many idiots believe; the body of the Catholic Church and its members are the Bride of Christ. Tim LaHaye is inadvertently or deliberately? fulfilling biblical prophesy…Mat 24:3-5,10-11 (NIV) …“Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?” Jesus answered, “Watch out that no one deceives you, for many will come in my name,… At that time many will turn away from the faith… and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.” !!!


#10

Thank you all so much for clearing this up for me! Being a convert, obviously i have a lot to re-learn! What i am finding amazing is that, all those things i was taught before never settled well with me. Now that i have joined the Catholic church everything is sliding right into place :slight_smile: i understand why people say “welcome home”


#11

I agree with most everything you except this pre-tribulation Rapture stuff was created by fundamental protestants about 150 years ago, not by Tim Lahaye. He just sensationalized it


#12

[quote="Didascalia, post:9, topic:335835"]
Many Protestants believe in the pre-tribulation rapture myth, mostly evangelical conservative types, but it certainly isn't taught as doctrine in mainline established churches such as the Anglicans and Presbyterians. Its mostly an American phenomenon created by the intellectually challenged Tim LaHaye and his Left Behind series of multi-million dollar making novels. The tribulation will be a time of great persecution for all Christians. The stage for this persecution is I believe ] already well underway. God help and preserve those who are to endure it. It will make the Great Diocletianic Persecutions look mild by comparison. The rapture comes after the persecution / Great Tribulation, not before! Scripture confirm it 100%. I think most Catholics avoid discussing end-time eschatology because they are often accused as being part of the Anti-Christ which is an intensely offensive notion. The Catholic Church is not the Beast as many idiots believe; the body of the Catholic Church and its members are the Bride of Christ. Tim LaHaye is inadvertently or deliberately? fulfilling biblical prophesy....Mat 24:3-5,10-11 (NIV) ..."Tell us," they said, "when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered, "Watch out that no one deceives you, for many will come in my name,.. At that time many will turn away from the faith... and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people." !!!

[/quote]

There are many more protestants that do not teach this at all. Some of the biggest critics
and those that have written books against dispensationalism come from different mainline protestants. The problem is that it is promoted by very cleverly written books that became very popular not just Tim Lahay but earlier authors like Hal Lindsey and Jack Van Impe.
I did mention two very good Catholic Books but if you look in the back at the reference books they use, they have many protestant authors as well as Catholic sources.


#13

**Traditionally **the Church has understood that the Antichrist will show up 3 and a half years before Christ comes again. This will be a period of severe persecution. The Antichrist will demand that everyone worship him and those who don’t will be persecuted by him. During this time Enoch and Elijah (the 2 witnesses mentioned in Revelation) will preach to the Jews, and they will be killed by the Antichrist but God will raise them up before the sight of many people. The Antichrist will attack God’s people with a massive army which is Armageddon. A series of wrath by God will come upon the followers of the Antichrist, then Christ will come again and destroy the army of the Antichrist and throw him and the False Prophet into hell. Then the final Judgment will happen when everyone will be raised from the dead, all the souls of the just and unjust will be put back into their bodies, and the just will have glorified bodies, and the unjust will be cast into the Lake of Fire.

The Church traditionally holds that since Pentecost the Devil has been bound, symbolically a thousand years (meaning a very long time). This binding of the Devil means that Satan has been limited of his power for a period of time so that the Church can spread throughout the whole world, unlike before when God’s people were limited to a small area in the middle east because Satan was not limited of his power. But once the Devil is unbound of his limitations during the Great Tribulation he will give his power to the Antichrist and the False Prophet and they will have great power to persecute God’s people. But it will only be for 3 and a half years until Christ comes again. There have been some ancient Christians who believed that the 1000 year reign will be after the Great Tribulation, but that was probably the result of a misguided Messianic teaching by the Pharisees that did not expect the Messiah to come as the suffering servant but only come and reign as king and overthrow the Roman Empire, which is evident by why the disciples and others were confused by the Crucifixion. That misunderstanding was probably why some of the very early Christians were expecting a physical kingdom by Christ rather than the spiritual Kingdom that Christ established. Unfortunately some Protestants have revived that teaching of a physical Messianic kingdom, and added yet another false teaching they call the rapture, which they teach that Christians will be raptured before the Great Tribulation while non-Christians will be left behind, while Catholics understand the rapture to be the Second coming of Christ after the Great Tribulation.


#14

[quote="robwar, post:7, topic:335835"]
There are twoo good Catholic books out there that can help you in dealing with the end times rapture and dispensationalism. One is "Will Catholics be Left Behind" and the other is the "Rapture trap". Both explain the history and error of what we were taught and the Catholic position on end times and Christ second coming.

[/quote]

I would also recommend two books by Michael Barber: Coming Soon and Jesus and the End Times.

Sally


#15

@ COPLAND 3 Some very interesting observations Copland. I have often wondered why during the tribulation that men will seek death and not find it?
Rev.9:6 "And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them."
I wonder if this terrifying verse has something to do with a "living purgatory?" Sometimes when debating the idea of purgatory, people usually rapture believers ] will point to the fact that those living prior to Christs second coming and Gods judgement will not have undergone the purification process of purgatory, perhaps part of the tribulation has a purgatorial purpose?
Any thoughts/ideas on this?

Just as a heads up the entire Douay Rheims study bible is online for free at sites.google.com/site/douayrheimsstudybible/home


#16

Pay no attention to Christs words regarding the end! Why should we ignore the warnings given to us by Christ in the book of Revelation? In the Gospel of Matthew you quote, Christ specifically tells and warns us to “watch” for the end, not to "pay no attention to it!"
Matthew 24:42 "So you, too, must keep watch! For you don’t know what day your Lord is coming.


#17

[quote="Didascalia, post:9, topic:335835"]
Many Protestants believe in the pre-tribulation rapture myth, mostly evangelical conservative types, but it certainly isn't taught as doctrine in mainline established churches such as the Anglicans and Presbyterians. Its mostly an American phenomenon created by the intellectually challenged Tim LaHaye and his Left Behind series of multi-million dollar making novels. The tribulation will be a time of great persecution for all Christians. The stage for this persecution is I believe ] already well underway. God help and preserve those who are to endure it. It will make the Great Diocletianic Persecutions look mild by comparison. The rapture comes after the persecution / Great Tribulation, not before! Scripture confirm it 100%. I think most Catholics avoid discussing end-time eschatology because they are often accused as being part of the Anti-Christ which is an intensely offensive notion. The Catholic Church is not the Beast as many idiots believe; the body of the Catholic Church and its members are the Bride of Christ. Tim LaHaye is inadvertently or deliberately? fulfilling biblical prophesy....Mat 24:3-5,10-11 (NIV) ..."Tell us," they said, "when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered, "Watch out that no one deceives you, for many will come in my name,.. At that time many will turn away from the faith... and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people." !!!

[/quote]

You may not believe in the Biblical doctrine of the "catching up" of all believers prior to the tribulation, but the apostle Paul did. Paul is the only Biblical writer to teach this doctrine. Don't confuse our Lord's 2nd coming to earth to set up His earthly kingdom with the "rapture." They are two entirely different events.
QC


#18

is it ok for catholics to use scripture? :)

paul writes this in the last days and i think we are in the last days.

But know this, that in the last days perilous times will come: For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, unloving, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, despisers of good, 4 traitors, headstrong, haughty, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having a form of godliness but denying its power. And from such people turn away! 2 Timothy 3:3-5


#19

No, they are not. In 1 Thessalonians 4, St. Paul is talking about what will happen to believers that are on earth when the Second Coming occurs. There is no “rapture” separate from the Second Coming and there will be no “earthly kingdom” after these events. Dispensationalism is a man-made, unbiblical doctrine cobbled together by fringe Protestants in the 19th century and never believed by any Christian before then, including the Apostles. Please see my previous post, especially the links to the articles.


#20

YIKES! Perhaps that was a poor choice of words, thank you so much for correcting me!

Sorry, I just get a little irritated by doomsday talk, every Anti-Catholic points to one pope and says “THERE’S THE ANITCHRIST”, then that pope passes and the new one comes along and the Anti-Catholicis like “NO THERE’S THE ANTICHRIST!” There are also these Rapturists, who arrogantly believe that by their faith they will be spared the horrors of the Tribulation, every single president (I think) is accused of being the Antichrist, it’s all just madness.


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