Well, The replies were interesting. Let me ask, if I may, What was your childhood like? Did you ever have dolls, with which to play?? Were you a middle child? There is fear behind your “I’s“ You realize children will make you lose control in life. Well, you still have some control when kids are healthy!
Marriage comes w children. Infertility is a gamble.
You could look for a infertile male. He probably wants kids. Life is funny that way.
Children don’t complete us. Jesus does! Maybe you are called to a chaste missionary work in a needy place.
Men & marriage don’t complete us. Jesus does.
Ephesians 3: 14-21
In Christ’s love
I shared my “opinion” multiple times by now. I refuse to comment on your or anyone else’s marriage in particular. Permanent intention against children is grounds for annullment. What do you take that to mean? I take it to mean they didn’t have a valid marriage.
Gentle child, Litany,
Do not be frightened for tomorrow or the life before you. Your life is to be full of what God wants for you. That is greater than anything, we can think or imagine. SEEK YE FIRST, THE KINGDOM OF GOD AND EVERYTHING ELSE WILL BE ADDED UNTO YOU!
Limit not your horizons but open the door for all possibilities.
In Christ’s love
I’m not surprised you’d refuse in such a case. What some folks might lack in courage, insight, and epistemic modesty, they apparently make up for in reluctance to beclown themselves entirely in public. (Jeez: I haven’t been a Catholic for long, and even I’m aware that the Church assumes a marriage’s validity unless it’s investigated and formally proved otherwise.)
The reason the church assumes validity is that it doesn’t know the inside of someone’s mind. But again. It is not up for debate that if at the time of making wedding vows there is a permenent resolution against children by either partner, then there is no marriage. The existence of marriage is dependent on the underlying reality. NOT upon the church’s assumptions.
The church assumes that if someone says “in sickness and in health” then they mean they won’t leave their spouse due to illness. If they didn’t, then there’s also a potential validity issue. But the church doesn’t read minds. She assumes people aren’t liers. I’m well aware of the church assuming validity.
If you feel convicted by my standing up for this teaching, that is no concern of mine. I’m not getting baited into inserting myself where I don’t belong. If you took a general statement I made and made it about you then that’s your problem. I have not and will continue not saying anything about your marriage.
Again, I consider you well-advised in not doing so. Where no other virtues are clearly in evidence, it’s certainly best to focus on the extant ones. And as for the possibility of feeling “convicted” … this reminds me of the sort of internet argument where Fellow A points out that Fellow B is making a gross public spectacle of himself, and the latter responds with something like, “struck a nerve, have I?” You’ve already inserted yourself where you “don’t belong,” to your shame, and you don’t get to make it about someone other than you.
Actually it does because each person is a member of the Body of Christ, & no one part can tell another that it doesn’t need it. That is Scriptural. Being branches rooted to the Vine, Who is Christ Jesus, means that we seek in life & in community (The Church is the Household of God) that which unifies us with Him - sin having the complete opposite effect. He is The Life so sin serves to cut us off from that life, separating us from Him.
I haven’t read all of the posts but I just want to comment on this, because it reminds me of pro choice sentiments.
You’re wrong to say that it will show in the parents eventually. Plenty of parents have unwanted pregnancies every day, but they will passionately assure you that they are glad they have their children. Most parents probably don’t even plan their kids! Likewise, there are abusive parents who initially wanted children.
A desire to have children prior pregnancy is not a good indicator of parenting abilities/love.
Feelings and opinions over anything and everything do change. That’s a natural part of growing up/life. I’m not going to encourage you to ‘just have a kid and hope it works out’ because that’s bad advice, but that doesn’t mean you will be a bad parent if you accidentally had one.
[I apologize, I have lost track of which thread participants are currently married et cetera]
Are you married? If not, are you open to life? Why or why not?
If you are married: Do you have conjugal relations with your spouse every day, at every hour of the day? (I will boldly presume “no”) Yet, are you open to life, day to day and hour to hour? Why or why not?
Are you perhaps married and the wife of you beyond the age when women typically are able to conceive and bear children? Yet, are you open to life? Why or why not?
As someone who never had cared to have children but was always a hopeless romantic, I simply can’t see children in my life. I HATE the thought of having them and even cried because of my fear of pregnancy/childbearing. Thus, I don’t think birth control is a sin, because I’m not obligated to have sacrifice my time for kids I’d never want in the first place.
It would be selfish,and self-centered to lead a life with out kids and again, against the plan and will of God. The openness to fertility
**[1652 "By its very nature the institution of marriage and married love is ordered to the procreation and education of the offspring and it is in them that it finds its crowning glory."162
Children are the supreme gift of marriage and contribute greatly to the good of the parents themselves. God himself said: “It is not good that man should be alone,” and “from the beginning [he] made them male and female”; wishing to associate them in a special way in his own creative work, God blessed man and woman with the words: “Be fruitful and multiply.” Hence, true married love and the whole structure of family life which results from it, without diminishment of the other ends of marriage, are directed to disposing the spouses to cooperate valiantly with the love of the Creator and Savior, who through them will increase and enrich his family from day to day.163
**[1653 The fruitfulness of conjugal love extends to the fruits of the moral, spiritual, and supernatural life that parents hand on to their children by education. Parents are the principal and first educators of their children.164 In this sense the fundamental task of marriage and family is to be at the service of life.165
1654 Spouses to whom God has not granted children can nevertheless have a conjugal life full of meaning, in both human and Christian terms. Their marriage can radiate a fruitfulness of charity, of hospitality, and of sacrifice.
It isn’t No Family Planning. The whole point is to be open to children and eventually hope to have them if by the grace of God that is what you are called to. It is not a systematic way to “get what we want.”