Cheating in college.. and life, how much is worth it?


#1

Ok age old question.
How much where you , or are you willing to cheat in college ? according to your moral principles? Colleges are big money facilities in which you pay for the elite to try to indoctrinate you into your positions in life . Therefore do you find it morally wrong to
cheat?
And how far is cheating? Unauthorized exams, using Chegg for assignments?
Course Hero? Programmable calculators during exams, if your gift and talent is saving face in life and making it that way, then why not use it ?

Does it seem to you , like College is an indoctrination of how to cheat your way through life? I’ve learned that most " Honor Students" are the most dishonest people on the planet; at least in my program. The Spartans, final trial was to kill a slave; but the catch was; they where not allowed to get caught, because killing slaves was illegal.

 But, who ever wins, wins right ? or wrong ?  Surely Arnold Schwarzenegger would have never won 7 Mr. Olympias if he had not taken steroids.  Its a dog eat dog world, and the alpha males are going to get the best looking woman, and the most cash. 

Whats your thoughts on how far you push the boundary as a Catholic ?
or Christian?
thoughts ?

Cheers!


#2

The ends never justify the means. Why sacrify your soul to gain the world?


#3

God sees all.


#4

Cheating can happen in all kinds of ways but it is still wrong no matter how you accomplish it? One of the things I have learned by watching as a student as well as a teacher is that when caught the entire situation is never worth it. Assignments and tests my not seem like it but they have a purpose and that purpose is not accomplished by cheating. As a Catholic we have the opportunity to confess a cheating sin and make amends. Attend class, do not procrastinate, ask for help when needed and you will be OK without cheating. Don’t know what university you are attending but I assure you not everyone cheats and even if they did it would not make it OK.


#5

It would be great if you weren’t able to remember how you got it.

But, it seems to me, if you win by cheating - you still have yourself to deal with.

So, i won that big trophy because I cheated. Every time I walk by it, how proud I must feel.

How about that job that hired me simply because of my GPA - Okay, i know it was just a couple tenths of a point that I added to my GPA - how could that possibly matter to anyone? Except that I always have this feeling like my whole career is a house of cards - and it could collapse at any moment when the next phenom comes along that got here by legitimate means.

Sure, and I can justify it all because I know that others must be cheating too,. After all, I’m just leveling the playing field. Yes - that’s right. Those other honor students - they can’t possibly deserve it - why they are some of the most corrupt people on the planet.

And when i finally get the perfect woman because of all my own accomplishments, surely, I won’t mind if one or two of the things on her resume turn out to be a little sketchy. After all, she learned from the best - she’s only used God’s gifts to her own advantage.

What could possibly be wrong with that?

And when i do have children - who could possibly be better at showing them how the world really works?

It sounds like you really figured it out.

Good luck!


#6

I NEVER cheated, and I still graduated with honors. My GPA was 3.62, which was not as high as some of the other people I knew who got honors, but I know I did my best and I did it honestly, so that’s what counts. I never even considered cheating, really. I don’t know how I would have lived with myself if I had.


#7

Why live in misery? You will only be hurting yourself.


#8

It’s really not worth it from a spiritual and practical perspective, Even if someone reading this was not religious, wouldn’t you want honesty from others? Wouldn’t you want that good feeling of achieving something to be based on the rules and keeping them?

It seems to be a dog eat dog world but it doesn’t have to be if you plan and have a backup plan. I was so impressed, and flattered, that my last girlfriend picked me to be her boyfriend. I remember telling her once, after we had a certain conversion: “If you don’t want to see me anymore, just let me know. And if you do, just let me know.” I could already tell she was interested and we kept dating.

Life involves risk. Sometimes things don’t work out. Sometimes the other person says no. God has given me a wonderful lady friend who is intelligent, has a sense of humor and is honest with me as I am with her. I don’t want to be friends with someone who is dishonest or plays games.

In the past, when our company was really growing, we hired someone who started rumors and made false statements about a few people. He was found out and fired.

Sometimes, it feels like your only choice to get the best girl or get into that good college or to get ahead in your career is to be dishonest, to add a few things to your resume that are a little wrong or inaccurate, but, in the end, we reap what we sow. God sees our deeds even if others don’t. Those who you see getting the best through dishonest means are not to envied.

biblehub.com/psalms/37-1.htm

Peace,
Ed


#9

Cheating and lying are not worth it in the professional world. Sooner or later you will get caught.

I know as an enigneer I have had to tell the company president on more than one occasion that because the data didn’t support his decision , I couldn’t support his decision even if he thought that it wouldn’t matter.

what price is someone’s life?


#10

Really?


#11

What’s the point of cheating? I really don’t get it.

Why would you want to lie your way through life? Liars always get caught in one way or another. It’s just not worth having to keep track of everything you’ve told everyone. It’s so much easier being an honest person.

Either you want to honor God and yourself or you don’t.

I also got high grades in high school and I saw this behavior with some of the kids, but not everyone is doing it.

I didn’t cheat in college. It never occurred to me because I wanted to be there and learn all that I could. I was still a good student, but I barely made my 3.1. People in my circle of friends just didn’t condone that sort of behavior and I wouldn’t want to be around people who did. I’ve always had the “light” that made people know not to ask if I wanted to do drugs or ‘party’ or cheat because they knew I wasn’t that type of person.

Why would anyone want to hang out with known liars and cheats? That’s just stupid and a waste of time.

That’s one of the reasons why our America has deep problems these days. Lying and cheating are perfectly acceptable behavior by our leaders, so the people are following.


#12

Academic cheating and dishonesty was pretty commonplace when I was an undergraduate, sorry to say. No it is not worth it. Not only is it morally sinful (it is a violation of the commandment against bearing false witness, a grave offense), but it also has the potential to undermine your credibility and directly deprive honest students what is due to them, i.e. the good grades for which they tirelessly labored. Funny thing is, while all these students were blatantly cheating their way through their classes, they were the same ones complaining about big banks and businesses defrauding people :shrug:. I am reminded of that passage from the Gospels where Christ talks about how people that are dishonest in small matters are dishonest in large ones as well.


#13

No, cheating is not ok. I have never cheated in school for any class and there are many others like me.


#14

Most tests I took in college were essay tests. Hard to cheat on those. We did have open book tests and take home exams, though. In math and physics classes we were allowed to bring in our slide rulers. Didn’t have calculators or laptops back then.


#15

The thing about cheating in college is that a lot of real life is simply not about college. Studies have shown that it is legitimately not about what you can show about how you were educated, it’s about what you can prove. Basically, people who have gone to wildly different colleges (Ivy League vs State university, for example), but who had similar IQ’s and goals ended up making the same salaries within 5-10 years. You go to college to learn and to become qualified, and then past that it’s about how you perform in one job to the next.
So those honors students can cheat all they like, but if they can’t prove that they’ve learned any more than a non-cheating person, it’s not going to help them.
If you don’t cheat, learn more, and end up with a lower GPA, basically, years from now you will be the one who ends up with the advantage. And you will have done it all while keeping your moral code completely intact.


#16

I will say that there are limits to where I will push the envelope.
Tell me , what conditions do you consider cheating?

  1. old exams that are unauthorized.
  2. instructors solutions manuals on pdf file.
  3. test taking in small unsuspecting groups

I had two acquaintances that where class mates. During chem class, they would always share their scan trons during exams. Now one is in Dental School and the other in Physical Therapy school. So I think it is foolish to say that cheating ; is cheating yourself. Another friend of mine in medical school, has 4 years worth of old exams given to her by her brother , whom was in medical school, and her brother’s friend.
She will be a Doctor before I am an engineer. She had told me the entire class uses old exams, much like in my college of Eng.

 I believe that college is learning to pass on information and not get caught doing things. learning how to save face. I've been to both trade school, and university. I can tell you the learning stops after you leave trade school. 

I have been in college working on an engineering degree for nearly 9 years. I remember when I had first started always trying to learn the material " Honestly" unlike my peers, whom get better grades and will graduate sooner.
Going to school is simply learning to play their game,. It cost big money to go somewhere for a piece of paper, to be able to feed yourself and have a family.

I’m going to end this hear. But I will agree, that certain ways of cheating are unacceptable when it is done in a dirty fashion.

Cheers!


#17
  1. I would say that studying old exams would not be cheating unless it is explicitly stated. I know that some professional exams (like the C.P.A in America - do try to recreate old tests by having observers remember questions around the country - and then they recreate the tests - and sell their knowledge to students preparing for the exam. By doing this over the years, they accumulate a lot of old tests and so can prepare their customers with an edge.

  2. hmm, if you have access to the solutions manual that the publisher intended to be restricted to faculty - and you use that solution manual - to do your homework - then what are you learning? Perhaps you will do flawlessly on your homework, but the knowledge you would have gained by legitimately doing the work will likely suffer.

  3. Are you taking tests in a small group when it is assumed that you are taking the test alone? Are these take-home tests? I’m a bit confused how the proctor doesn’t observe it.

If I were truly concerned that other students are hurting me by using tactics that I wasn’t comfortable with, then I would speak to the professor. I wouldn’t name other people, but I would ask him/her if it was okay to study off of old tests because other students approached me to join a group. I wouldn’t name any names, I would just ask for myself. I imagine the professor is already aware of it, but at least, if not, would know to change the next tests enough to discourage it. Now, i had a professor that would give the exact same test year in an year out. He didn’t change the questions at all. And I had heard rumors of students who had old tests. But, I think if i had gone to that professor and asked if it was okay, (I didn’t), perhaps he could have made a minimal effort to change the problems enough to make someone have to at least know how to manipulate the new problem.

And it won’t just be college, you will be confronted with issues that don’t seem fair all along. You work hard at work on a project, and your boss or another co-worker gets the credit. You treat a young lady with grace and respect and she chooses a complete jerk over you. You find out that your neighbor is taking questionable deductions on his taxes.

And when you decide to cheat, who are you hurting? Well, I would claim that you are hurting yourself because you are depriving yourself of knowledge that you must not have or you wouldn’t have cheated. But maybe you don’t care about that. Aren’t you also stealing from anyone in the class that didn’t cheat. If your score on a test or in the class caused you to pass up another student, didn’t you take something from him/her?

In sports, if your cheating gives you a trophy - didn’t that trophy rightly belong to someone else? Is that different than stealing it from them?


#18
  1. I would say that studying old exams would not be cheating unless it is explicitly stated. I know that some professional exams (like the C.P.A in America - do try to recreate old tests by having observers remember questions around the country - and then they recreate the tests - and sell their knowledge to students preparing for the exam. By doing this over the years, they accumulate a lot of old tests and so can prepare their customers with an edge.

  2. hmm, if you have access to the solutions manual that the publisher intended to be restricted to faculty - and you use that solution manual - to do your homework - then what are you learning? Perhaps you will do flawlessly on your homework, but the knowledge you would have gained by legitimately doing the work will likely suffer.

  3. Are you taking tests in a small group when it is assumed that you are taking the test alone? Are these take-home tests? I’m a bit confused how the proctor doesn’t observe it.

If I were truly concerned that other students are hurting me by using tactics that I wasn’t comfortable with, then I would speak to the professor. I wouldn’t name other people, but I would ask him/her if it was okay to study off of old tests because other students approached me to join a group. I wouldn’t name any names, I would just ask for myself. I imagine the professor is already aware of it, but at least, if not, would know to change the next tests enough to discourage it. Now, i had a professor that would give the exact same test year in an year out. He didn’t change the questions at all. And I had heard rumors of students who had old tests. But, I think if i had gone to that professor and asked if it was okay, (I didn’t), perhaps he could have made a minimal effort to change the problems enough to make someone have to at least know how to manipulate the new problem.

And it won’t just be college, you will be confronted with issues that don’t seem fair all along. You work hard at work on a project, and your boss or another co-worker gets the credit. You treat a young lady with grace and respect and she chooses a complete jerk over you. You find out that your neighbor is taking questionable deductions on his taxes.

And when you decide to cheat, who are you hurting? Well, I would claim that you are hurting yourself because you are depriving yourself of knowledge that you must not have or you wouldn’t have cheated. But maybe you don’t care about that. Aren’t you also stealing from anyone in the class that didn’t cheat. If your score on a test or in the class caused you to pass up another student, didn’t you take something from him/her?

In sports, if your cheating gives you a trophy - didn’t that trophy rightly belong to someone else? Is that different than stealing it from them?


#19

No, college is not an “indoctrination of how to cheat your way through life”. At least, my college wasn’t. Cheating under any form or any circumstances was not tolerated, and often resulted in a student being expelled. Besides it being wrong, it’s also really stupid. I’m actually not sure what the point of this thread is- your post is a little confusing to follow.

I never cheated and ended up in the top 10%. “Honor students are the most dishonest people on the planet?” Really? I’m assuming you are not yourself an honor student?


#20

This is the only one out of the 3 that is a semi-gray area, because back exams can help you prepare for the real one. IMHO, it is cheating if you are not authorized to have access to the back exams. All the fraternities save the tests and homeworks so they can distribute these materials to the “in-crowd” so they can pass their assignments with minimal effort, which is completely dishonest. If the professor wanted you to be able to study from the back exams, s/he would have given them to you, and many times they do so there is no problem here.

Cheating as well. I would think that distributing instructor solutions manuals to your peers would also be a breach of copyright law. Why is it the “instructor solution manual” if the students are going to steal it?

This is so obviously cheating. Unless otherwise stated, you are supposed to take your exam individually because it is an assessment of your knowledge, not your friends’ knowledge.

Truth be told, I can sympathize with your sentiments because I witnessed the same kinds of things when I was an undergraduate. I still witness them as a graduate student :mad:. People “push the envelope” as you said because they reason that hiding this or that piece of problematic data or fudging the numbers a little over here aren’t a big deal because it’s only a very small lie, and hey, everybody else does it! It doesn’t matter if everyone else does it, as Catholics we are called to live holy, saintly lives and be a model for the rest of society. We already live in a society where people cannot trust each other so why contribute to the demise?

I remember one class I was in a couple of years ago when the professor just didn’t give a flying hoot and used the exact same 50 MC tests from the year before. People finished the exam within 5 minutes of receiving it and all received A’s because they were apparently very good at memorizing 50-character strings. Next semester, everybody’s flunking out in the second half of the course. The students then started whining to the new professor that they don’t know how to do anything :rolleyes::banghead:. You wind up losing in the end.


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