Here is round 2:
Here is round 2:
btw, last bit in the last link is hilarious!
Watched the ‘hilarious’ moment and it was not so. I dislike it when (some) Muslims claim to know the Bible better than Christians and then take words out of context.
Luke 19:27:“Now as for those enemies of mine who did not want me as their king, bring them and slay them before me”
The Muslim debater claimed that Jesus taught ‘Jihad’ by quoting the above. He didn’t let the other person say anything, and the video stopped there leaving the viewer assuming that the Muslim debater was right. He wasn’t. The verse above was not Jesus teaching of ‘Jihad’ but the words of a nobleman in a Parable that Jesus was narrating. Why didn’t the debater mention that?
No, not hilarious; it was deceitful.
Muslims interpreting the Bible using their theology is like English folk reading a Russian book using English: You won’t understand a thing it says and you’ll come off as a fool.
I don’t have access to You Tube on this computer, so I can’t watch the videos - but you are correct that using Luke 19:27 to justify “jihad” is completely disingenuous and deceitful. The parable is, as most of Jesus’ parables are, about the spreading of the Kingdom of God. However, Christ never preached violence. Any references He ever made to violence were metaphorical (it is a parable, after all) and referred to the Judgement of God after our death.
Is this thread supposed to be a debate about which faith is the True Faith - Christianity or Islam? I would posit that Christianity doesn’t need to use deceitful tactics to try and pursuade converts.
Jesus dose teach about violence when He instructs the Apostles to take swords with them, but He was speaking about self-defense (which is why He sharply replied “Enough!” when Peter remarked there were two swords).
Jihad has different meanings:
Corporal: Attacking an enemy, conquest or self-defense
Spiritual: Attacking a demon, who tempts the Muslim
Familia: Spreading the faith through marriage and family
Terrorism: Justifying evil acts in the name of Allah
The Muslim was speaking about conquest jihad.
Thanks for correcting me on that. But the point still stands that there is no where that Jesus advocates any sort of violence as a means of punishment or to spread the Gospel.
The concept of killing someone who doesn’t submit to the faith is diametrically opposed to Free Will (which, as I understand it, Islam denies - making the corporal understanding of Jihad permissible, and the Terrorist interpretation of Jihad defensible).
This thread seems to be a discussion about the debates. I didn’t watched the videos, only the ending ‘hilarious’ moment that Zaki mentioned and the beginning which didn’t interest me (I’ve seem many of these arguments).
What troubles me the most is that viewers of this debate will think, from the ending, that the Muslim debater ‘outsmarted’ the Christian one and majority of them will not take the time to look up that verse in the context. The Muslim debater was wrong, and unfortunately many will not know that.
I’d like to clarify that if you interpret the Bible using Christian theology, than you’ll understand the Bible. Just as there are many divides in Islam, and so many ways to read the Qu’ran, so too there are many divides in Christianity and so many ways to read the Bible. This is how Catholics interpret the Bible: vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__PQ.HTM
what a load of…
Mate one recommendation for you, see how many videos made by christians claiming to have once been muslims and converted to christianity and saying all this random stuff about islam and then (with some of the video replies) a muslim explains HOW the christians are lying. (Because the christians are dumb enough to make the claim and then have biased info about islam from their local priest). Christianity doesn’t need deceitful tactics? How gullible are you? I’ll give you a few videos if you want to take this further inshallah.
I wanted you to see the whole debate because the christian gave arguments that the muslim could answer and the muslim gave arguments that the christian did not answer sufficiently. I was hoping by showing the christians this, they would at least TRY to answer the questions posed by the muslim that the christian could not.
(btw, euchastrited, you make a good point ;))
Okay, let’s have a debate. I’m Christian, so I shouldn’t be able to win this debate.
You Muslims say that Jesus is the Messiah. Now I, too, believe this, but that’s not the point. Kindly show me, where are ten messanic prophecies in the Old Testament?
Ten is the minimum, but you can post more if you want. You can list them in any order you want. No need to post Qu’ran verses. If you can provide for me ten prophecies about the Messiah from the Old Testmanent, than you can ask me a question too.
Why did you say that you won’t be able to win this debate? :shrug: Why have this debate when two learned men have had a debate that we can view and decide personally who we view as the champion of it?
Also can you get somebody other than me to debate you, I’m still learning about Islam and my memory of christianity is not fully intact. PLUS I don’t take dawah classes.
Tell me what you think about the debate bro!
I didn’t watch it. I don’t watch YouTube debates.
Then what did you mean by okay?
I meant I was okay with you not wanting to engage in a debate.
Oh okay. Thanks bro
Tu quoque argument.