Christmas is bad?


#1

Here is a an interesting article from a conservative news website. It’s about Christmas and it’s origins and the various points of view from athiests, pagans, middle-of-the-road evangelicals, and fundamentalists.

worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=29995

Check it out

Martin


#2

My take on this, if you Christians go into every holiday you have, Christmas, Easter, Halloween etc and say, “this is pagan, that one is pagan too,” and abstain, you’ll be left with no holidays to celebrate, no days of having fun. That would be a veritable pity. :frowning:

Enjoy the coming holiday! :slight_smile:


#3

It’a a pretty wide-ranging article. Just to address the “we shouldn’t celebrate Christmas because it and it’s symbols are pagan and unbiblical” nonsense, here is a good article that pretty much lays that to rest.

cathinsight.com/apologetics/adventism/christmas.htm


#4

It’s incorrect to say that Christ’s Mass is a pagan holiday. It’s a Christian feast celebrated at the winter solstice. No one “took the day away from the pagans.” No one prohibited the pagans from celebrating their holiday. It’s just that over time, there were fewer pagans and more Catholics. The pagan celebration fell into the background as Catholics celebrated that day to mark the birth of Christ. Who cares if it’s not the “real” birthday of Jesus? – only the JW’s and a few others.

Christmas now incorporates many customs from many cultures that that had nothing to do with Christianity per se, but that doesn’t make them bad. Christians are not honoring pagan beliefs; the symbols have been Christianized.

“Easter” is from Ester or Eastre, the name of a goddess and her festival. But it is a Christian festival in commemoration of the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, observed the first Sunday after the first full moon after the vernal equinox.

We don’t know exactly what year Jesus was born, much less the precise day; nor do we know the date of His Crucifixion and Resurrection. But the Church chose certain days to mark the events.

Big deal. The “controversy” the article describes is much ado about nothing.

It is essential for a society to have a time set aside for gift exchange. Christmas serves an important anthropological as well as religious need.

Is Christmas bad? Only if you overextend your credit cards.:stuck_out_tongue:

JMJ Jay


#5

[quote=Imprimartin]Here is a an interesting article from a conservative news website. It’s about Christmas and it’s origins and the various points of view from athiests, pagans, middle-of-the-road evangelicals, and fundamentalists.

worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=29995

Check it out

Martin
[/quote]

In my opinion it is a non-issue. We celebrate Christmas as the birth of Jesus Christ, nothing more.

Gerry :slight_smile:


#6

Of course, I believe that christians should celebrate Christmas. I was just astounded that there was so much debate on all sides about it. I knew there were issues with Easter and Halloween but not christmas. I decided to write a letter to the editor and here it is:


#7

The fact of Christmas is not bad of itself, but the tradition and practices behind it is.

What most people do not understand is that Christmas is based on pagan beliefs introduced by the RCC to incorporate pagan and Christian beliefs.

Christ means Messiah. Mass in the catholic vernacular means sacrifice. Jesus did it once never to be done again. Why would they call it that!

This is supposed to be a celebration of His birth, why would they want to crucify Him again.


#8

Do people realize that pagan and christians are the same people? We talk as if they are separate ethnicities. It was common that new convert to christianity could keep local customs. Considering in many locals resources are limited in the early church why should people change what they eat, wear, or decorate in celebration of their beliefs.

My biggest pet peeve is that the modern day Santa resembles a pagan god. Modern day Santa being fat and jolly come from a coca cola campaign from 100 years ago.

Do people in Australia celebrate Christmas? Since it is their longest day of the year… not the shortest. Not matter where the Church placed Christmas on the calander, we would have this argument.


#9

[quote=Luke24]Mass in the catholic vernacular means sacrifice.
[/quote]

No, it doesn’t. Mass is from Latin, and it means to send forth.

[quote=renee1258]Modern day Santa being fat and jolly come from a coca cola campaign from 100 years ago.
[/quote]

No, it doesn’t. This particular urban myth is debunked rather nicely by Snopes.

[quote=Katholikos][Christmas is] a Christian feast celebrated at the winter solstice.
[/quote]

In the northern hemisphere, winter solstice occurs on December 21.

– Mark L. Chance.


#10

I like this one!

True, that the old pagans, became the new Christians and brought their culture and customs along with them. Bad? or simply human?

The fact that modern day pagans celebrate some of their own holidays on or around the same date as Christian holidays, and even use some similar elements (after all, religions do tend to use similar elements of ritual) does not mean they are celebrating the same thing.

Halloween is NOT the same as Samhain even if they fall on the same day. Just like your birthday cake does not commemorate anything other than your birthday reguardless of what other events may have taken place on the date of your birth.

I celebrate Winter Solstice on the 21st. It is NOT a pagan version of Christmas, nor do I ever consider Christmas a Christian version of Solstice. They are entirely different, even though they do have some similar elements. And some years I celebrate both.

I think Christmas is a wonderful thing, and can be a beautiful sacred day if you choose to make it so. Or it can be just another day of the year for those who don’t bother to keep it. To think the day, or the manner in which the neighbor celebrates it has some type of inherent power is an odd sort of magical thinking.

I believe it only has the power you give to it.

cheddar


#11

I love it. It brings up the tired old arguements about Catholicism being “paganized Christianity”, when it in truth is Christianized Paganism.


#12

[quote=Luke24]The fact of Christmas is not bad of itself, but the tradition and practices behind it is.

What most people do not understand is that Christmas is based on pagan beliefs introduced by the RCC to incorporate pagan and Christian beliefs.

Christ means Messiah. Mass in the catholic vernacular means sacrifice. Jesus did it once never to be done again. Why would they call it that!

This is supposed to be a celebration of His birth, why would they want to crucify Him again.
[/quote]

Luke24,
It doesn’t matter to God that christian practices used to be pagan practices. The bible says so.

Martin


#13

[quote=Luke24]The fact of Christmas is not bad of itself, but the tradition and practices behind it is.

What most people do not understand is that Christmas is based on pagan beliefs introduced by the RCC to incorporate pagan and Christian beliefs.
[/quote]

What have you in mind ?

Christ means Messiah. Mass in the catholic vernacular means sacrifice. Jesus did it once never to be done again. Why would they call it that!

Mass appears to be from “missa est” - “it [the Liturgical action] is over”. Sacrificium is the Latin for “sacrifice”.

This is supposed to be a celebration of His birth, why would they want to crucify Him again.

The Mass does not** in any way whatever** affect the unique sacrifice of Calvary - it re-presents and draws upon it, but cannot repeat it.

Catholic teaching and theology absolutely excludes all notions of re-sacrificing Christ. As the Mass is a Sacrament, to re-sacrifice Christ is impossible: if it were possible that He could be, the entire sacramental doctrine of the Church would collapse.

I wish somebody would explain what is wrong with re-using pre-Christian feast-dates for Christian feasts. I’ve asked a few people who object to using pagan things for Christian purposes whayt is wrong with doing so - but all they do is quote verses from the Bible. If they can’t put together a coherent and reasoned explanation for their position, it’s hardly surprising if others are not convinced of the strength of their position. ##


#14

[quote=Luke24]The fact of Christmas is not bad of itself, but the tradition and practices behind it is.
[/quote]

Then you are excused from participating:D

What most people do not understand is that Christmas is based on pagan beliefs introduced by the RCC to incorporate pagan and Christian beliefs.

Wrong. The Catholic Church changed pagan festivals into Christian feasts.

BTW, I am a Roman Catholic, meaning I belong to the Roman (or Latin) Rite Church. Other Catholics may not be Roman. They may be Byzantine Catholic or Maronite Catholic or some other kind of Catholic – but we’re all Catholics, sharing the same faith, united under the Pope. It would be best to call the Church by the correct name – the Catholic Church.

Christ means Messiah.

Christos (Greek) and Messiah (Hebrew) both mean “anointed one.”

Mass in the catholic vernacular means sacrifice. Jesus did it once never to be done again. Why would they call it that!

This is supposed to be a celebration of His birth, why would they want to crucify Him again.

I suppose you’re one of those Protestants (or however you identify yourself) who thinks that Catholics believe we crucify Christ over and over again at every Mass. I’m sorry to disillusion you, but you’re wrong.

The Holy Sacrifice of the Mass*** is*** a sacrifice, but the word Mass comes from the words of the dismissal in Latin. The priest says to the congregation: Ite missa est. ‘Go, you are sent forth.’ [Literally, ‘it (the liturgy) is finished’]. It became common usage for the faithful to call the liturgy “missa” – Mass in English. In Spanish, it’s Missa.

See how much you can learn here? Hope you hang around.

Peace be to you and to all who post at Catholic Answers.

JMJ Jay


#15

Oh, Christmas is a horrid thing!

Celebrating the birth of our Lord Jesus!
How repugnant!

Wo would ever want to do that?

Better question: Who wouldn’t?
Hmmmm, could it be SATAN?!?!?


#16

[quote=Imprimartin]Here is a an interesting article from a conservative news website. It’s about Christmas and it’s origins and the various points of view from athiests, pagans, middle-of-the-road evangelicals, and fundamentalists.

worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=29995

Check it out

Martin
[/quote]

Was listening to EWTN and a caller said that maybe on the 4th July we should wish happy holidays too.
Anyway what do Americans wish each other on the 4th July ?
Is it happy 4th or what ? because from this distance it’s rather hard to tell.:ehh: do you think people would object to saying happy holidays on the 4th ?
I also heard a caller refer to the Christmas tree being symbolic to the tree of life, well it is evergreen and doesn’t shed like other trees, unless of course we cut it down.


#17

Hey, Everybody! :wave: SEASON’S GREETINGS!. . . and you know Whose season it is!


#18

Hey Luke 24:::Providing you have a job, how about giving back your Christmas pay or giving it to charity, if you hate Christmas so much?


#19

If pagans can be baptized, why can’t their holidays? God created everything, and called it all good. It was the pagans who hijacked God’s creation, and we’re just taking it back.

Anyway, as someone said, a day is a day, and can like any of God’s creation be used for good or bad purposes. Days don’t “belong” to any one person or group. I also agree with the one who said this is really a non-issue; a tempest in a teapot. I wonder where it all came from when there are so many real problems to be dealt with.


#20

you’re a mean one, Mr. Grinch


DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.