Courtship intimacy


#1

My girlfriend is agnostic. I entered the relationship because I was under the impression she was looking for direction. But that doesn’t seem to be the point anymore. She want’s more intimacy that I can give her. She has a hard time thinking that she will be able to sustain her desire to show her affection without becoming more passionate. How can I explain to her that physical pleasures are independent of what you can develop emotionally for another person? How can I convince her that she can we can show each other how we feel about each other without sharing intimacy? I am hoping this could be a step for her in the right direction toward god.


#2

I am hoping this could be a step for her in the right direction toward god.

or a step away for you.

be careful.

i think you started off on the wrong foot dating someone about whom you had a "project" mentality. it's unfair to her and it's misguided of you to try and fix her.

you want to evangelize? want to bring her closer to God? be her good, holy, virtuous Catholic pal.


#3

I agree with Monicatholic here about examining why you entered the relationship. If you thought that you could convert her, or try to give her direction, then that is problematic.

However, the situation is not without hope. What you need to do is shift paradigms. She is an “agnostic” in culture that defines “dating” as “doing it”. If the two of you are not so involved, then she wonders if your really dating. This is a tough cultural mentality. I struggled with this, and both my last girlfriend and I were both committed to chastity.

You need to look at this through the Christian mentality. You are refraining from sex to better discern if you and your potential spouse are compatible for marriage. Unfortunately, the answer may be “no”. Refraining from excessive emotional and physical intimacy makes this “no” easier. Breaking up shouldn’t be hard to do!

So what you need to do is explain that you personally need to withhold some intimacy for now, because you are discerning marriage with her. Explain that this is your need, but don’t focus to much on trying to “convince” her that it should be her need as well. Explain that If the two of you are compatible and marry, that this barrier to sexual involvement will vanish! If you and your girlfriend are truly on the “same page” then she should be perfectly happy to commit to waiting out of respect for your beliefs!

This is a scary move, because you are sharing one of your innermost beliefs, AND exposing yourself to rejection because of it. She may balk at the idea of discerning marriage. “Agnostic” sometimes means not being sure about any major life decisions.

She may only be looking for a temporary “dating” relationship, while she bides her time, but you yourself might also be looking for only a dating relationship too, if you haven’t fully discerned your life choices either! This some to think over and discuss with her.

Talking about these kind of things is a risk, but for God’s Sake (literally :p), a risk you really ought to take!


#4

Jesus,our Lords peace be whit You.
You do have a problem,if You love her,leave her because You can not give her what she wants/need. And if she loves You,she will understand and stay.


#5

sorry to say this, but I agree with everyone else here. Chastity is hard enough when two people are trying to be chaste together. When one person is pressuring you, you’re even more bound to sin.

One piece of advise I heard a priest giving about choosing a spouse is that you want to live your whole life persuing God. You’re running a marathon toward Him. A spouse can be a good running companions where you can mutually support and encourage each other toward the goal. What you don’t want to do is turn around and start running at another person, nor do you want to sort of stay behind and drag a resistant person toward the goal and thus get dragged backward yourself. You just want to find someone whose about where you are on the spiritual track, that way neither one of you is intimidated by the other and neither one is held back by the other. You just keep running, see that the other is already sort of at your side and say “Hey, maybe we could be a team.”


#6

[quote="monicatholic, post:2, topic:216614"]
or a step away for you.

be careful.

i think you started off on the wrong foot dating someone about whom you had a "project" mentality. it's unfair to her and it's misguided of you to try and fix her.

you want to evangelize? want to bring her closer to God? be her good, holy, virtuous Catholic pal.

[/quote]

I agree. I think you just need to be her friend right now and nothing more. When you can see her more as a person than as a "project" than maybe take another chance on the relationship. But you should never enter into a relationship thinking you need to fix or guide someone.


#7

You embarked on what is called "missionary dating." It is not fair to her to try to convince her to become Christian as part of your dating relationship.

Her decisions about religion must be based firmly in her own belief and the prompting of the Holy Spirit. Yes, you might be used by God as an instrument in her conversion, but not by getting "intimate" with her.

She and you have different beliefs, morals, and values. At the core of it, she does not see sexual intercourse as something that is holy and reserved for marriage where it is ordered by God for the procreation and education of children.

How can you "convince" her otherwise? You can't. Not overnight. Not easily. And not permanently. That all must come from within her, as you and she base your morality on different things. You can explain your beliefs and ask her to respect them. But, this will come up again and again.

You already have a major conflict in your relationship that is based on mismatched values. I think you know what to do.


#8

well.... Puberty is the time of life when a child's body begins to turn into an adult body. It is a very dramatic and exciting time of life. As your body matures and you come of age, you will be attracted to the opposite sex. In many cases, this attraction will be compelling and you will have to deal with it. How you deal with it will make a major difference in the quality of your life and your service for the Lord as long as you live. The Biblical convictions, or lack of them, which you develop now to deal with the opposite sex will have farreaching consequences. Believe it or not, they will reach through you to the next generation, to your children and eventually to your grandchildren.

A STANDARD MUST BE SET

   You must realize that as you come of age, someone or something (a group or philosophy) is going to set a standard or lack of one for how you deal with the opposite sex. A standard does not mean a legalistic system or a social straight jacket. A standard is a set of moral and social guidelines that you go by. You could have a very low standard or a very high one. When you go out socially or romantically with someone, some set of moral and social guidelines will guide your conduct. Everyone has standards, some low and some high.

   For example, the local public school superintendent once challenged our Christian school dress code. He said, "You have no right to dictate to your students how they dress. " I replied that I had not only the right, but the responsibility as well, and that he had a dress code in his school as well. He denied that ! So I said, "Well, I guess a female student could go to class topless ?" He said, "She certainly could not!" Therefore, I said, "See, you do have a dress code." It is just not a very high one. Everyone has some standards no matter how low they are. If you are going to have some standards, they might as well be God's standards for yourself according to the Word of God.

   Like the public school dress code, the world has low standards and expectations for dating and marriage. The truth is that some of the world's standards are down right immoral. When I use the term world, let me explain to you what I mean in a Biblical context.

#9

[quote="mmenghe, post:1, topic:216614"]
My girlfriend is agnostic. I entered the relationship because I was under the impression she was looking for direction. But that doesn't seem to be the point anymore. She want's more intimacy that I can give her. She has a hard time thinking that she will be able to sustain her desire to show her affection without becoming more passionate. How can I explain to her that physical pleasures are independent of what you can develop emotionally for another person? How can I convince her that she can we can show each other how we feel about each other without sharing intimacy? I am hoping this could be a step for her in the right direction toward god.

[/quote]

Did she know that is why you entered the relationship, to help her convert?? Or did she think you were attracted to her as a person and wanted to get closer? Your last sentence confirms that you want to lead her to Christ, not necessarily into the marriage bed. I think it's cruel to string her along any further because she is looking for something that you do not want to provide. Be honest with her, tell her that you are not going to have sex with her because you want to stay chaste until you get married. And then let her go. You will torture her trying to lead her to Christ and she will torture you with offers to have sex. Bad idea all around.


#10

The issue isn't sex. It's just more a matter of she would like to engage in more passionate actions than normal kissing. I was under the impression that it is wrong. I really just think you should stay from arousal. Am I right? I didn't begin to date her with my goal to convert her, we really do have strong feelings for each other... But I realize that this additional information doesn't really change the scenario. I'm just ashamed that I will have to call this off due to a very large issue that could have easily been avoided.

--Thanks to all for the feedback.


#11

Yet.

Yes, you are correct.

Really think hard about the purpose of dating-- it’s to discern marriage. When you meet someone and learn that they have incompatible values and beliefs, dating has done its purpose in discerning this is not a person to marry.

The thing is, you must strive to discern important matters before becoming very emotionally attached to someone-- it clouds our judgment and then we want things to work out so badly we start trying to figure out ways to compromise. That is not a good path to go down.


#12

And that is why, apart from God's commandments to reserve sex until marriage, it is a bad idea to get physical with anyone in a dating relationship, even passionate kissing. It addles the mind, it forms the ties that bind, and it's hard to unwind. LOL that was an easy rhyme! :p

In all seriousness, though - the physical bonding is what causes so many people to make the mistake of marrying a person that isn't truly suitable for them. We can't think straight once that connection is made. It's the actual brain chemicals generated during physical touching, kissing, etc. that ensure that a bond is taking place. And it's just not the right place for it. One needs to be wise in these matters and always listen for the "God nod" as I call it.


#13

There is nothing easy about this :(. I am a bit confused though, whether are you’re speaking about breaking up with her, or about calling something else off.

Whether you’re breaking up with her or otherwise trying to figure out what your next move in the relationship is, she deserves a heart to heart discussion about all this. When my last girlfriend dumped me, she was so vague about things, that I got even more hurt several months later due to the confusion about where we stood. Relationships need communication, even when they are ending.


#14

Much common sense in this post. Or maybe the sense isn’t so common because it has been lost. The young today don’t seem to realise that sex is a very, very powerful thing. The so called sexual revolution ended up adling the brains of a lot of people who were given the message that sex was an ok thing to just go and enjoy. It has far greater ramifications than that. Please feel free to correct me if you think I’m wrong, but I have had the impresion for a long time that sex has a greater impact on the emotions of women than on men and a lot of women have become lost emotionally becuase they think it’s ok to become sexually involved with someone without discerning who and what their sex partner really is.


#15

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