Dance in the Liturgy


#1

I recently attended a Mass where they allowed young girls to dance between the Communion and the Dismissal. Is this ever permitted? I always thought it was forbidden.


#2

If you live in the Western World, no.


#3

http://a2.idata.over-blog.com/300x270/4/32/21/12/liturgical_dance_freee_zone.jpg

:)

-Byrnwiga


#4

[quote="yankeeredneck, post:1, topic:293432"]
I recently attended a Mass where they allowed young girls to dance between the Communion and the Dismissal. Is this ever permitted? I always thought it was forbidden.

[/quote]

EWWW! I would of ran out screaming! lol

Where was this?


#5

[quote="YoungTradCath, post:2, topic:293432"]
If you live in the Western World, no.

[/quote]

Practically speaking, I'd agree, especially after it was permitted (nay, encouraged) in several very visible instances. But is it really true that it permitted, or is this just the latest "craze"?


#6

I really hope I never have to see this…


#7

[quote="ByzCathCantor, post:5, topic:293432"]
Practically speaking, I'd agree, especially after it was permitted (nay, encouraged) in several very visible instances. But is it really true that it permitted, or is this just the latest "craze"?

[/quote]

My understanding is that some cultures (read, vernaculars) allow and even "encourage" choreography in the liturgy.


#8

In western cultures it has been established that liturgical dance is NOT permitted during Mass.


#9

[quote="Deo_Gratias42, post:8, topic:293432"]
In western cultures it has been established that liturgical dance is NOT permitted during Mass.

[/quote]

But bishops allow various cultures (through immigration, etc.) within their diocese too. Sooner or later, there will be "cross-pollination" of such cultures. Just saying.


#10

And the Pope sez:

ceciliaschola.org/notes/benedictonmusic.html#Liturgical_Dancing

~Liza


#11

[quote="ProVobis, post:9, topic:293432"]
But bishops allow various cultures (through immigration, etc.) within their diocese too. Sooner or later, there will be "cross-pollination" of such cultures. Just saying.

[/quote]

So, this is a proactive pastoral allowance in America? I do appreciate that the Church has allowed for cultural norms in other parts of the world. That said, dance is not a common form of communal communication in our culture, which by definition is a "melting pot" of many.

Circling back, isn't the real question whether the USCCB has spoken on how the related pastoral norms should be applied here in the U.S.? or is this one of those things left open to the interpretation of individual bishops as it now stands?


#12

[quote="ProVobis, post:7, topic:293432"]
My understanding is that some cultures (read, vernaculars) allow and even "encourage" choreography in the liturgy.

[/quote]

Dancing during Mass may be considered a cultural accomodation in parts of Africa, but not in the United States or Canada.
This occurance should be reported to the local Bishop!


#13

[quote="lizaanne, post:10, topic:293432"]
And the Pope sez: ceciliaschola.org/notes/benedictonmusic.html#Liturgical_Dancing

[/quote]

Well, to be fair and accurate, that is what Cardinal Ratzinger said in his book before becoming Pope. What does the Church really have to say about this, officially?


#14

Somebody please find the video of Cardinal Arinze floating around.


#15

For example, has the USCCB said anything more recently than this (June 2003)?

Dance and the Liturgy

In the course of their meeting on June 17-18, 2003, the Bishop members, consultants, and advisors of the Committee on the Liturgy considered the question of dance and the Liturgy.

Recalling the recently revised General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM), the Committee was conscious of the need to take “due regard for the nature and the particular circumstances of each liturgical assembly, [so that] the entire celebration is planned in such a way that it leads to a conscious, active, and full participation of the faithful both in body and in mind….” (GIRM, no. 18) Particular note was taken of the attention paid by the new Roman Missal to gestures and movements at the Mass, which “ought to contribute to making the entire celebration resplendent with beauty and noble simplicity, so that the true and full meaning of the different parts of the celebration is evident and that the participation of all is fostered.” (GIRM, no. 42)

The “nature and the particular circumstances” (GIRM, no. 18) of certain ethnic communities was also considered, particularly by Catholic immigrants from Zaire, where dance has been approved as a part of the liturgical books of their native land. The importance of a careful observance of the rubrics of such books in regard to the quality and role of dance in the Sacred Liturgy was emphasized by several of the Bishops.

The place of dance in the liturgy in other parish Masses, however, was examined in the light of the 1975 “qualified and authoritative sketch” published by the Holy See in the journal Notitiae. The article prescribes that in western cultures, dance “cannot be introduced into liturgical celebrations of any kind” and that when dances outside of the liturgy are envisioned, they may take place only “in assembly areas that are not strictly liturgical.”

Recalling the large number of liturgical issues before them and the fact that only a limited number can be adequately prepared for presentation to the Congregation at any given time, the Committee decided not to pursue the question further at this time. At the same time, the Committee cited the need for further scholarly studies of a “historical, anthropological, exegetical and theological” (Varietates legitimae, no. 30) nature which might explore forms of movement which might be found to serve as an appropriate part of processions, which do not take on the appearance of spectacle per se, and which accompany the liturgy, rather than interpret it.

Assuming this is the latest and greatest, it appears as if the barn doors are still open …

BTW - I find it odd that the USCCB could not simply conclude that we are a Western culture, and thus follow the express prohibition of Rome.


#16

[quote="YoungTradCath, post:14, topic:293432"]
Somebody please find the video of Cardinal Arinze floating around.

[/quote]

Here is the link to it.

youtube.com/watch?v=9rJFdmmqj_s


#17

[quote="YoungTradCath, post:14, topic:293432"]
Somebody please find the video of Cardinal Arinze floating around.

[/quote]

[quote="Bakmoon, post:16, topic:293432"]
Here is the link to it.

youtube.com/watch?v=9rJFdmmqj_s

[/quote]

Had never seen that before - thanks!

As they might say in sports, the good Cardinal scored a hat-trick: he debunked dance in liturgy, secular music and Relativism all is 7 minutes 45 seconds.

While still wishing Pope Benedict XVI many more happy & healthy years, I would hope Cardinal Arinze gets due consideration in the next Conclave.


#18

… It is totally absurd to try to make the liturgy “attractive” by introducing dancing pantomimes …, which frequently … end with applause. Wherever applause breaks out in the liturgy because of some human achievement, it is a sure sign that the essence of liturgy has totally disappeared and been replaced by a kind of religious entertainment. …

Bravo! :thumbsup:


#19

[quote="George_Stegmeir, post:12, topic:293432"]
Dancing during Mass may be considered a cultural accomodation in parts of Africa, but not in the United States or Canada.
This occurance should be reported to the local Bishop!

[/quote]

I've witnessed cheoreography to Peter Jones' Glory to God and to altar girls sprinkling water during the Asperges Me in their ballet shoes. And this at a rather conservative and reverent (otherwise) parish. To tell you the truth, I did not find it that unusual at the time. Not enough to report it anyway. After all choir masters and conductors have a lot of movement when they direct.


#20

[quote="ProVobis, post:19, topic:293432"]
I've witnessed cheoreography to Peter Jones' Glory to God and to altar girls sprinkling water during the Asperges Me in their ballet shoes. And this at a rather conservative and reverent (otherwise) parish. To tell you the truth, I did not find it that unusual at the time. Not enough to report it anyway. After all choir masters and conductors have a lot of movement when they direct.

[/quote]

I saw something similar to this (altar girls/students) sprinkling the congregation with water at a Baccalaureate Mass last month for a local Catholic High School. I was horrified.


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