DC reboots their comics...again

Yep, it's another Zero Hour, Crisis, or whatever. So you know what that means: DC's rebooted again. I don't like this. Continuity is a necessary evil in comics. If they really want to keep us reading, they need to give us less crossovers. I think crossovers should really be rare.
Your thoughts?

If you ask me, the mainstream of western comics comprised of both DC and Marvel have always found to be lacking in consistency and continuity. It’s why I’ve never gotten too much into comics (no offense to fans). Seeing so many versions/revisions of the same superhero/storyline just really does a number on my mind. :blush:

@rocklobster
Hey rockobster it's interesting to see someone bring this up!.I'm kind of a comic book fan myself.Do you know and/or would mind* why* their doing this?.I've seen a few covers of the new comics like one of Superman with shorter sleeves but I dont understand why there doing this?.Is it really all because of the current Flashpoint company crossover going on right now?.Would it have been to predictable if they had done this after Final Crisis?.I have'nt been into Flashpoint that much but if there going to reboot some DC titles will this mean that* Flashpoint* is to DC comics what* House of M* was to Marvel in terms of it's impact?.It's kind of disappointing to see DC do this even with there longest running line ups like Action comics which was nearing it's 1000th issue!.That would have been such a big accomplishment for comic books like I mean one for the world record books.Maybe they'll resume the regular numbering of there issues if they like "abandon" the idea of a reboot.

It's called "get the new readers". And yes, it's all connected to the Flashpoint event. Flashpoint rebooted most of the entire universe (except Vertigo, which is always excluded from these events because it's technically a separate entity.)

[quote="Lost_Wanderer, post:2, topic:249428"]
If you ask me, the mainstream of western comics comprised of both DC and Marvel have always found to be lacking in consistency and continuity. It's why I've never gotten too much into comics (no offense to fans). Seeing so many versions/revisions of the same superhero/storyline just really does a number on my mind. :blush:

[/quote]

Didn't you hear? Continuity is now optional in popular culture ;)

Personally I really dislike how they didn't fully reboot Batman... it's never been the same without Dick Greyson's Robin....

Pointless rebooting and not going back all the way to the "Golden Age" period.

:eek:
First, I will wait for the shock that a brother reads comics to subside.
:eek:

Now, I went out to the local comic store today and bought some comics I am into.

Along with my comics they gave me a free DC Comic (The New 52) which covers what is being discussed here.

Growing up I was into Marvel, mainly the X-Men (and derived mutant comics) and a little Avengers. Never was a fan of DC Comics.

After looking through this I see 4 comics that look very interesting to me and I plan to get them when they come out..

It is always nice to start out a series with #1 as you will not be as lost as you could be jumping in later in the comic series.

So I guess the DC reboot has worked with me, they are getting a "new reader".

Here's what blogger Linkara, of "Atop the Fourth Wall" fame, said about the topic when he talked about it on his blog. I agree wholeheartedly with his opinion:

I remember back in the 90's, Marvel used to have this fold-out front cover that had a cast listing and told you the story so far. That's what DC should do, not start everything over and create more continuity snarls.
Edit: Oh and sorry about the obscenity in the quote. I had no idea that word would get censored.

During the period just after Crisis on Infinite Earths which is to an extent the grandfather of the modern reboot Alan Moore did a story called 'Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow'. It's one of the quintessential Superman stories and was meant to be (perhaps) the final fate of the silver age Superman before the Superman titles were rebooted. It riffed on the 1950's and 60's trend for imaginary Superman stories showing Lois and Clark married or Superman ruling the world or Lex Luthor as a hero and so forth. Anyway the story opened with the line 'This is an imaginary story? But aren't they all?' I think it's a great way to view superhero comics. Pick the era you enjoy best. For me that's the Earth-2 and Earth-1 era of pre-1985. For someone else it's something entirely different of course.

[quote="JharekCarnelian, post:9, topic:249428"]
During the period just after Crisis on Infinite Earths which is to an extent the grandfather of the modern reboot Alan Moore did a story called 'Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow'. It's one of the quintessential Superman stories and was meant to be (perhaps) the final fate of the silver age Superman before the Superman titles were rebooted. It riffed on the 1950's and 60's trend for imaginary Superman stories showing Lois and Clark married or Superman ruling the world or Lex Luthor as a hero and so forth. Anyway the story opened with the line 'This is an imaginary story? But aren't they all?' I think it's a great way to view superhero comics. Pick the era you enjoy best. For me that's the Earth-2 and Earth-1 era of pre-1985. For someone else it's something entirely different of course.

[/quote]

For me it's the Golden and Silver Age....

Man I really get peeved when Batman fans say the Joker doesn't have a set origin... Yes he does! and the '89 film got it mostly downpat, although it added alot of new material to the origin story.

I'm such a nerd....

[quote="colliric, post:10, topic:249428"]
For me it's the Golden and Silver Age....

Man I really get peeved when Batman fans say the Joker doesn't have a set origin... Yes he does! and the '89 film got it mostly downpat, although it added alot of new material to the origin story.

I'm such a nerd....

[/quote]

In true fanboy mode I must protest and say that is the Earth-2 Joker! Although of cours the whole Earth-2 and Earth-1 stuff was itself an early example of retooling and to some extent rebooting things. As witness the versions of Green Lantern and Flash which are more famous than the originals but arrived on the scene many years after them. Regarding the Joker that prompts me to say that with regards to him killing Batman's parent's in the Burton movie that was an addition I didn't love. I'm in two minds as to whether Batman's origin works best with the killer been known (as when Joe Chill is considered to be the murderer) or if it works better when the killer is anonymous.

Some of the Golden age and Silver age stuff is great. Totally wacky and off the wall and capable of not taking itself too seriously and thus paradoxically often been all the more enjoyable and 'serious' in a sense for it. I suspect we might both be fans of writers like Roy Thomas and Kurt Busiek in the modern era somehow given your remarks...

For an added bonus Batman instilling moral guidance into kids about how stupid bigotry is. Would you argue with the Dark Knight?

http://i868.photobucket.com/albums/ab243/hall0weenjack/batmanvsracism.jpg

I think one of the weaknesses of American supehero comics the constant monthly schedule whereas European comics (at least many of those of in continental Europe as I exclude the UK from thsi comparision) have been produced at a more measured pace. It's noteworthy that a large number of the best superhero tales have been produced as limited series or by a particular writer in a particular period on a book. Conversely there are an awful lot of totally forgettable filler issues over the last 40 years from DC and Marvel.

And Superboy also seems to have been teaching the good folks of Smallville a similar lesson to Batman:-

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/1962/superboyisawesome.jpg

From another age when Batman wasn't ALWAYS been portrayed as a misanthrope. Thank God Grant Morrison has managed in recent years to inject some elements of both light and darkness into Batman again. A host of lesser imitators all riffing off Frank Miller's work (including Frank himself of late) with regards to Batman for 20 plus years was becoming very tiresome.

To our OP don't worry about the reboots. It's the nature of the genre. Superhero comics have a built in turnover rate as buyers age and move away from been hardcore fans to either just buying the odd titles that interest them or moving away from it entirely as a hobby. The publishers know that well, hence the reboot cycles.

[quote="JharekCarnelian, post:12, topic:249428"]
I think one of the weaknesses of American supehero comics the constant monthly schedule whereas European comics (at least many of those of in continental Europe as I exclude the UK from thsi comparision) have been produced at a more measured pace.

[/quote]

I'm not so sure about that. Manga is produced pretty much with the same pace, the most popular ones are release one chapter weekly in fact.

Granted, maybe the amount of pages have something to do with it. Still, I would say manga tends to be way more linear and consistent than mainstream superhero comics.

In true fanboy mode I must protest and say that is the Earth-2 Joker!

He's the original! and also certain later canon comicbooks have also given it as the Earth-1 joker's origin too(some have even suggested his name is "Jack N..." something!)! But I agree that it is still somewhat questionable as the origin for Earth 2 Joker. Nevertheless it's the original character's canon origin story!

Regarding the Joker that prompts me to say that with regards to him killing Batman's parent's in the Burton movie that was an addition I didn't love. I'm in two minds as to whether Batman's origin works best with the killer been known (as when Joe Chill is considered to be the murderer) or if it works better when the killer is anonymous.

If you've ever read the original two origin story comic books("The Origin of Batman" and "The First Batman"), you'd understand why. Frankly it's my 2 favourite ever issues of any comic book.

Especially "The First Batman" where they revealed that Joe Chill was a stooge acting on behalf of Boss Zucco..... and it was really a mafia hit, to cover up corruption that Bruce's dad had unwittingly uncovered and opposed.

I loved how it revealed that the "Bat" motif really originated with his last fond memories of his father and that the Bat that flew into his window was really just subconciously triggering his memories of his late father, who once used a halloween costume of a Bat(ironically worn due to coincidence or even destiny), to terrify the head of Gotham's then underworld. It reminds you of how everything was ment to occur for a purpose, it's a story about destiny. It really gave a real strong meaning as to why he made the childhood connection between a Bat and justice. That's why it was eventually restored to the Canon even for the modern Batman too.

It makes much more sense to me than the later "explination" that he fell down a well and was scared by bats when he was a kid himself(although I also like that when it's an addition, as it too adds another dimension to the character).... that never made much sense to me on it's own, and it was great when they restored this explination to the canon of even the modern Batman.

It's like that one wonderful scene in the '95 film "Batman Forever" where Robin tells the story of how he became known as Robin to Alfred... that was one really touching emotional scene in an otherwise average film. His dad gave him the nickname "Robin" after he saved his brother.... I liked that too.

I've read both those stories. They do indeed given a sense that destiny is at work. They've been restored (for now) as we have people with greater imaginations working on Batman again. Instead of people endlessly riffing on 'The Dark Knight Returns'. My feeling on that era of Batman has changed considerably over the years. While I think it's an interesting tale I no longer see it as the seminal work I once did years ago and think many other writers such as Mike Barr and Doug Moenech understood Batman possibly better. There's a sequence in a short story by the former writer of Batman rescuing a child which I think sums up the character nicely. Batman in disguise has been listenign to information which leads him to where a child snatched for ransom is been held. We see the child's face only as Batman enters the room and her saying 'oh it's you' followed by Batman knocking out her captor. The story ends with Batman carrying the child away. Here's a little sequence of Barr's (with art by Alan Davis, one of the best artists ever for my money) that I think catches the essence of the character more in many ways than the whole of Frank Miller's work:-

http://uk.wrs.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0WTf2kwjC5ONScAysNWBQx./SIG=122cj89bu/EXP=1311702192/**http%3a//www.theartofcomics.com/rich/DavisA2.JPG

You know, I think they should also reboot Watchmen. They should make it all kid friendly and remove all that pointless 'philosophical' stuff which didn't advance the story at all. I mean really, a giant squid? Rorschach being a psycopath? Pff, we don't want clever, complex stories, we want action! We want Superman! Watchmen fans want to see Superman in Watchmen! How on earth didn't they have Superman?! And what was with the panels, I didn't know what on earth was going on. Huh, Alan Moore is so overrated and can't write to save his life. We should stick with Frank Miller, Rob Liefield, Todd McFarlane, Chuck Austen and the what possiblyis the geaest comic writer ever, the master who brought us the unforgetteble One More Day, Joe Quesada. Sigh. If only Moore could write as good as him and Gibbons draw as good as Liefield.

The sad thing with Miller of all the people on your list is that once he was a great talent. His Born Again saga in Daredevil is fabulous and has one of the best ever uses of Captain America ever. His sad decline is painful to watch, at times I wishfully think he is just parodying himself and those who copied his earlier work in a particularly subtle form of satire. Then I realise he really has jumped the shark that badly.

By the way this is from one of my favourite Batman stories ever:-

http://www.asitecalledfred.com/comics101/images/2004/jan28/scars.jpg

http://www.asitecalledfred.com/comics101/images/2004/jan28/unmasked.jpg

I have/had that one in the "Grestest Batman Stories Ever Told" collection. Till it got damaged due to my room flooding during a storm. It was on the floor... damn. It also had the two Batman issues I mentioned, my 2 fav comics ever. Although it's not a definitive collection.

I can't remember which issue it is, but one of my other favs is when Deadshot returns after his original stint in prison... what an underrated Batman nemesis he is... Ironically, while I don't like Nolan's films, I'd love to see him show up in a Nolan Batman film... He just seems to fit the style of bad guy you'd think Nolan would actually portray well.

[quote="JharekCarnelian, post:18, topic:249428"]
The sad thing with Miller of all the people on your list is that once he was a great talent. His Born Again saga in Daredevil is fabulous and has one of the best ever uses of Captain America ever. His sad decline is painful to watch, at times I wishfully think he is just parodying himself and those who copied his earlier work in a particularly subtle form of satire. Then I realize he really has jumped the shark that badly.

By the way this is from one of my favorite Batman stories ever:-

http://www.asitecalledfred.com/comics101/images/2004/jan28/scars.jpg

http://www.asitecalledfred.com/comics101/images/2004/jan28/unmasked.jpg

[/quote]

From when is hat issue dated? I haven't read Batman: Hush but the same thing happens in that comic. It looks like from the seventies or the 50's. I know Catwoman wore that silly costume during that time.

Speaking of Catwoman's costume, and while I am not implying liking her sultriness and the sexual overtones which she is written with, my favorite costumes of hers are the animated series costume, the current catsuit with the goggles (I say current as I haven't bought any modern comics for quite some time now, just a few graphic novels. I know alot of this stuff from the internet) and the '90's purple catsuit with the thigh high boots, the long gloves and the free flowing hair. It was just so elegant.

On the subject of costumes, I really hate the new costumes they have given to the JLU, especially Superman's. The goofy high neck, the silly robotic boots, the rough untidy hair, the overtly long sleeves, etc... and no red underpants!

Seriously now, I think the red briefs are an integral part towards the Superman costume because not only do they divide the suit but they also pay homage to the circus strongmen of the thirties and forties who usually wore some variation of 'underpants'.

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