Did Lucifer sin while in Heaven

Did Lucifer sin while in Heaven when making his decision to rebel? I was told there is no sin possible in Heaven as its occupants are completely at peace with no wants or needs. So how could Lucifer have even considered rebellion? I assume he had no wants or needs. Could John Doe who recently died and went to Heaven rebel about something?
It would seem that Heaven is not a place where there is no needs or wants.

The usual view, as I understand it, is that the angels were tested prior to obtaining the Beatific Vision of God. It’s the Beatific Vision that is so wonderful it’d be perfectly fulfilling and satisfying. All the angels made their choice. Those who chose to do the will of God were given the beatfific vision. Those who directed their will against God never had it.

So, if by “being in Heaven” we are referring to the Beatific Vision, then the answer is no: Satan never had that. There might be other ways to think of the “heavens,” but in the sense you are asking (where people say Heaven is a place of perfect peace and satisaction that is completely fulfilling) we would mean having been given the Beatific Vision.

Were they told that they could have Beatific Vision if they accept God? If yes, then they must be stupid to rebel and choose Hell instead of Heaven. To me the story seems just a myth.

Well, I don’t think we should imagine them sitting around thinking and debating and being taught about it. Saint Michael conquering the devil with his sword is a popular image, but that’s a very human depiction of them. That is not how angels exist or act; they’re way of being is something other to our way of being.

But to directly adress their question, we don’t know exactly what knowledge they had. I imagine it included knowledge of God’s divine plan for Creation and knowledge that they would participate in Him and his eternal life, but that may be nothing more than speculation on my part. I think the only thing that can be known is that they were given sufficient knowledge to make an informed decision and be held responsible for that decision.

I cannot see how what you said is related to what I discussed.

The first paragraph is a response to you referring to it as myth. The second paragraph directly responds to your question.

That is not really an answer. Considering the fact that the story was not revealed completely and the fact that it is contradictory proves that it is a myth.

That doesn’t follow.

…the fact that it is contradictory proves that it is a myth.

No contradiction has been demonstrated and one doesn’t even seem remotely apparent.

It follows. The story is very important. It is about why we are here in a realm which is ruled by Satan. This is one of the most important things which should be revealed by God. The story should be coherent which is not.

There is of course contradictions in the story. Why Angels rebel? Why are they still free? Why are we ruled by them? Etc.

Just because you want the story doesn’t mean we need it.

There is of course contradictions in the story. Why Angels rebel? Why are they still free? Why are we ruled by them? Etc.

Not one of those is a contradiction.

I think that is you who need a story to believe because that is you who is a believer and follow a system of belief which is not internally clear and consistent for Its followers.

There is a contradiction. You put a glass of win and poison in front of a intellectual being , human, and he chooses poison. He then go to live in fire of Hell eternally. Which part of this story is reasonable?

STT this isn’t your thread. Start another.
To the OP

I believe the angels were given a choice, knowing they would be placed below Mary, a creature like us, as the mother of Jesus Christ, and Jesus as The Son of Man.

Lucifer was not happy, rebelled, other angels did also. They got booted out of Heaven forever. No idea if they saw God first. In Job God asks lucifer (as satan) a question.
Angels are much smarter then us. Those in Heaven don’t require purification. John Doe does require purification. So he wont reach Heaven until he is ready.

Satan and his demons (still angels, although in disgrace forever) didn’t rebel for wants or needs. It was a prideful sin. A theologian can explain this better!

They detested us creatures. And to be placed below the Blessed Virgin, and be required to honour her. Gabriel greets Mary with ’ Hail full of Grace,

Stop projecting, please.

There is a contradiction. You put a glass of win and poison in front of a intellectual being , human, and he chooses poison. He then go to live in fire of Hell eternally. Which part of this story is reasonable?

They’re not computers, which from other topics you think all rational beings should be. It’s a being declaring “No, not thy will be done; my will be done.” It’s not a calculation of reward and punishment.

You assert a poor choice was made. I agree. But that’s not a contradiction.

“The usual view, as I understand it, is that the angels were tested prior to obtaining the Beatific Vision of God. It’s the Beatific Vision that is so wonderful it’d be perfectly fulfilling and satisfying. All the angels made their choice. Those who chose to do the will of God were given the beatific vision. Those who directed their will against God never had it.”

Then it seems like the dissenters were given a bum deal. They could have at least been given a sample of the Beatific Vision. For so many highly intelligent, superior beings, as were the angels supposed to be, to disagree on the debate whether or not to follow God’s will, tells me "God’s Will’ must have been at least in some respects, not logical, or not sensible to them. It was definitely not acceptable by all.

It all sounds pretty much like a made up myth to me also.

Scroll down to the part about the Angels.

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p1s2c1p7.htm

God gave all His creatures free will. Us and the Angels. They are creatures too.

Sorry if I sound offending. I didn’t mean too.

Lets think of 1000,000,000 Wesrocks. They are all similar to you. We exam them with a glass of wine and poison. How many of them choose poison?

Or not preferable from their perspective, anyway.

In what way does it sound like myth to you (moreso than any other aspects of the religion)? What are you imagining?

The analogy is wrong for a couple of reasons. One, 1,000,000,000 different men all belong to the same essence/form of a human being. Angels are each unique: each angel the only mode of the type of existence specified by their essence. We refer to them all as angels, but that type of grouping is not a true genus in the way “human being” is. Second, again, it’s not just a choice between reward and punishment. It is “accept My will and share in My glory or don’t.” Some may still choose to reject His will out of preference for their own designs even should it mean accepting punishment for it.

That’s your choice.

"In what way does it sound like myth to you (more so than any other aspects of the religion)? What are you imagining? "

After 12 years in a Catholic grade and high school and 4 years at a Catholic university, I can’t ever recall having read any reasonable argument or proof that all this is even remotely true. Similarly the talking snake in the garden ,etc, etc, I personally do not trust much of anything based on, or taken from the old testament writings of ignorant bronze age authors.
Jesus at least had some believable and logical things to say in the new testament.

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