Discussing homosexuality


#137

@Thorolfr I’m honestly sorry to point this out.


#139

LifeSite News is not exactly a reliable source.

But to the extent the CDC is, this article is not showing that gays are necessarily violent with each other. It is showing that they are often victims of violence - some of which (such as when they were children, which is mentioned in the article) may very well be coming from people who are not gay.


#140

It does, clearly !!!


#141

[quote=“adgloriam, post:138, topic:496850, full:true”]

I have found myself being trolled by protestants [/quote]

How do you know they’re Protestants? The old CAF showed each member’s religion, but the new one doesn’t. Unless I’m missing it.


#143

Have you actually looked at the CDC study mentioned in the lifesitenews article? Here’s what the statistics are from the study:

Lifetime Prevalence of Rape, Physical
Violence, and/or Stalking by an Intimate Partner

For women:
Lesbian 43.8%
Bisexual 61.1%
Heterosexual 35.0%

For men:
Gay 26.0%
Bisexual 37.3%
Heterosexual 29.0%

Severe physical violence by an intimate partner in their lifetime was reported by 16.4% of gay men and 13.9% of heterosexual men.

Nearly 1 in 3 lesbians (29.4%), 1 in 2 bisexual women (49.3%), and 1 in 4 heterosexual women (23.6%)
experienced at least one form of severe physical violence (e.g., hurt by pulling hair, hit with something hard,kicked, slammed against something, tried to hurt by choking or suffocating, beaten, burned on purpose, or had a knife or gun used against them) by an intimate partner in her lifetime.

https://www.cdc.gov/ViolencePrevention/pdf/NISVS_FactSheet_LBG-a.pdf

Heterosexual men are worse off for “Lifetime Prevalence of Rape, Physical Violence, and/or Stalking by an Intimate Partner” than gay men. It’s true that gay men have experienced more “severe physical violence” from an intimate partner in their lives (16.4%) than heterosexual men (13.9%), but the heterosexual men experienced this from a woman which is less likely to happen. Men are apparently more violent than women since 13.9% of heterosexual men have experience severe physical violence from their female intimate partners whereas 23.6% of heterosexual women have experienced severe physical violence from their male intimate partners. So, it’s not all that surprising that for relationships involving two men, the numbers would be slightly higher than for a straight man. And, of course, gay men experience less severe physical violence (16.4%) than what heterosexual women (23.6%) do. So, if we’re talking about who’s most likely to experience violence, gay men or straight women, it would be straight women, and straight men would be the ones who are most “notorious” for being violent.

Bisexuals are the ones who suffer from violence the most.


#144

But gay men are not as violent towards each other as straight men are to straight women.


#145

Courage is a great resource if you are experiencing SSA.

https://couragerc.org/

Including their documentary “Desire of the Everlasting Hills.”
https://everlastinghills.org/


#146

Thanks for your thoughtfulness! I appreciate it. Unfortunately, as I have been experiencing this since approximately 1975, I don’t think it’s going away anytime soon. I do seem to be dealing with it. But thank you for the links. :slightly_smiling_face:


#147

What about Church shootings?


#148

Churches can, of course, be targeted for violence. For the gay welcoming Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches, 20 of their congregations were bombed or set on fire by arsonists between 1968 and 1997, which is a large number of a denomination that currently has only 222 congregations.


#149

Well there was a shooting at that gay bar last year so I guess it’s not as safe as it sounds. But that goes against your point.


#150

I admire your courage, you will be in my prayers.


#151

I still don’t know what your point is. I never said that there are places where gay people or anyone else are 100% safe. But it would still probably be safer for me and my partner to go as a couple into an Episcopal church which has made a point of saying that they welcome LGBT people and have a rainbow flag outside their church than if we went as a couple into a fundamentalist Baptist Church. At the very least, we would not have to worry about being verbally abused, harassed, or made to feel unwelcome in the Episcopal church.


#152

You started talking about gay congregation shootings not me.


#154

Personally, I don’t think you were obligated to note your position on homosexuality (at least not from what I read), but I don’t have an issue with you doing so.

I don’t really see anything wrong with how the conversation turned out. What were you expecting? He seemed open to discussion and to be equally willing to drop the subject out of politeness. That seems to turn out well all things considered.


#156

Thank you so much. You are in my prayers, as well.


#157

OK. Although I have serious misgivings, because very few of the gay people I know go around being involved in violence and domestic abuse - and the proportion that do are probably the same proportion as the number of straight people I know who get involved in violence and domestic abuse - let us assume for a moment, for the sake of argument, that you and Lara are right and gay people are violent towards each other or more likely to be the victims of violence.

This to me is like saying members of a certain race are violent towards each other or more likely to be the victims of violence. Usually the main driving factor is NOT that these people are innately mentally prone to violence; such statements usually come from bigots or oppressors. The main driving factors are often rooted in a lot of societal causes including things like social and economic factors, self-esteem, whether people in that group have good family lives as children, etc. Someone with low self-esteem who was abused at home is likely to also be in abusive relationships as an adult because that is all they know.

A significant number of gay people did not grow up in a nice, loving household, due either to the breakdown of the family generally (which also causes many straight people to grow up in a bad environment) or because they were gay and not accepted by parents. Even where the parents are accepting, many gay young people get bullied by their peers. I am not going to turn around and say to these people as adults, “oh you gay people are more violent!” Especially when the gay people I know who did grow up in nice, loving families with parents who loved them have gone on to live lives similar to my own; stable, with long term relationships, they own homes, pay taxes, have respectable and admirable jobs, and are not posting drama on their social media. They are just like me except they are gay.


#158

There is no way to avoid “SSA” that I know of. For most people, it is just something that they realize about themselves when they enter puberty at age 12 or 13. Since no one knows what causes someone to have one sexual orientation as opposed to another, how could someone avoid the sexual orientation that they end up having?

Also, it appears that you are conflating sexual orientation with gender identity. They are two completely different things. As Wikipedia says:

Gender identity is one’s personal experience of one’s own gender, i.e. the range of characteristics pertaining to, and differentiating between, masculinity and femininity. Gender identity can correlate with assigned sex at birth, or can differ from it.

Sexual orientation is an enduring pattern of romantic or sexual attraction (or a combination of these) to persons of the opposite sex or gender, the same sex or gender, or to both sexes or more than one gender. These attractions are generally subsumed under heterosexuality, homosexuality, and bisexuality, while asexuality (the lack of sexual attraction to others) is sometimes identified as the fourth category.

A gay men who experiences romantic or sexual attraction to other men can still have a very masculine gender identity, identifying as a male and being very masculine.


#160

This was exactly my experience upon turning twelve years of age in 1975. I realised I was attracted, physically and emotionally, to men in the way my friends were attracted to women. I had no name for these feelings, having never been exposed to nor heard of homosexuality. To this day, it is a mystery to me how this happened. It is of course, possible (some might say probable) that it was a deliberate action of God Himself, that I might have an onerous cross to bear at a relatively young age, thus helping me to learn empathy and avoid the insensitivity and self-absorption of callow youth, something I am afraid I still indulged in!


#161

Did you watch the movie “Brokeback Mountain”?

People wish to be “normal”, with regular lives - spouse of the opposite sex, children, acceptance into society. They knew there were potentially very bad consequences if they openly expressed SSA. They could even be killed. If they were able to repress it and live in a “normal” man-woman relationship, they did so.

For many years, homosexuality was considered to be a mental disorder. In the USA, you could be barred from certain jobs, or lose your job. During the Cold War in USA, gay people were considered to be a security risk because they could be blackmailed, or worse yet they were seen as potential traitors and blackmailers themselves. Gay relations were often criminalized and in many places in US and UK, those laws were enforced.

Families were often ashamed to have a gay person in the family. Some families committed their gay kids to a mental institution for life.

I could go on and on but I think you get the idea.


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