Doctor contemplating take over of Tiller practice,2933,524829,00.html?test=latestnews

Carhart, 67, is one of a handful of remaining doctors in the United States who perform third-trimester abortions, and it is uncertain if a new generation of providers will take over the cause. Schools and universities don’t offer many programs to train physicians on how to perform the procedure, and Carhart said younger doctors who might be interested in stepping forward are afraid they or their families will be harmed.

I would guess medical students don’t want to do 3rd trimester abortions because they have a conscience.

For the life of me, I can’t understand what medical emergency or condition would require the assassination of a third trimester baby, especially if one needs to travel to Kansas to do it. :confused: I would assume if something catastrophic happened during the third trimester, the woman would go to the hospital, and give birth prematurely.

I certainly know how you feel.

Here is something reprinted in The Atlantic (online edition) a couple days ago (please note I am not stating this is right or wrong, just an example of how this happens sometimes): *At 17 weeks gestation our baby had been diagnosed with major heart defects requiring a minimum of three risky open-heart surgeries beginning at birth, and would later require a heart transplant. At 19 weeks we were finally given our amnio results which revealed our baby also had Trisomy 21.

A surgeon at the major teaching hospital where we’d had our fetal echocardiogram informed us that even if our baby somehow survived his palliative surgeries, this latest diagnosis meant he would not ever be eligible for a heart transplant. As we sat talking quietly in our living room, our priest shared with us that he’d spent time at the same hospital where we’d had our fetal echocardiogram and where our son would have had surgery.

He was there to support the family of a three-month-old who was having heart surgery. In the three weeks or so that he tended to this family, he also met 10 other families in the waiting room, each of whom also had young babies undergoing heart surgery. Sadly, within the short space of time our priest was there, every single one of those babies died.

Our priest came away from that experience feeling that this world-renowned children’s hospital was basically experimenting on babies. He saw their futile suffering and likened it to being crucified. The family he had gone there to support later told him that if they had only known what their baby would be forced to go through before dying, they would never have chosen surgery. Our priest told us that he believed we were not choosing our son’s death, only choosing the timing of his death in order to spare him a great deal of suffering. Something he said that brought us great comfort was “God knows what is in your hearts.” God knows our choice was based on mercy and compassion. Who would better understand our hearts than God, who made the choice for His own Son to die? *


Trisomy 21 is also known as Downs Syndrome.

There is a world of difference between deciding for or against risky surgery for a baby and killing it through abortion.

A world of difference.

And furthermore, having a baby with Downs Syndrome is not a catastrophic health problem for the mother.

I don’t know if I phrased my post poorly, it was not my intent to start an argument with you, because we are of the same opinion.

I am just sharing something I have read recently about why someone sought out a late-term abortion…there is also a story on the same website about how some OB/GYNs do not feel comforable aborting (I don’t even know if that is the correct term) a baby who already has passed away (which is a medical issue for the mother).

Wasn’t arguing, just stating what trisomy 21 is that’s all.

My reaction was to the article not you, sorry if it came across that way.

killing a child for a defect is Eugenics at its finest. And in started with psychopaths like Sanger (racist eugenicist) and Hitler (Anti Semite).

My oldest nephew was born with a cleft lip, though it was pretty mild, definitely not as severe as some babies. Babies diagnosed with this “defect” are often aborted, even though its fixable by surgery. Same with a Club Foot.

Does anyone remember who Samuel Armas is? He’s the baby who had surgery while still in his mother’s womb.

Just because a child MIGHT be born with a defect doesn’t mean the child shouldn’t be given the chance to LIVE and be LOVED. Even if the baby only lives for thirty minutes, three hours 93 days (Baby Faith @ ) or 99 days (Baby Elliot, see doesn’t mean the baby should suffer the horrible death of abortion.

I think the pro life movement shold have spent more time highlighting George Tiller’s wrong doings. We all condemn this assassanitation, but more leaders should have done what Randall Terry did and have labled him a mass murderer. There should have been more condmnations of the pro abortion movement I feel. I don’t care if pro abortion pundents will make the false claim that people who dared to call Tiller a “killer” are responsible for his death.

I blame the shooting on the culture of death that Row has created in america. Tiller’s loss is no more tragic than any 1 abortion that he performed.

Carhart, 67, is one of a handful of remaining doctors in the United States who perform third-trimester abortions, and it is uncertain if a new generation of providers will take over the cause. Schools and universities don’t offer many programs to train physicians on how to perform the procedure, and Carhart said younger doctors who might be interested in stepping forward are afraid they or their families will be harmed.

I wonder what makes guys like this tick. I mean, he really thinks fear of harm is what keeps the average young doctor from performing these “procedures”. He does not seem to be able to fathom that other schools, universities and doctors may have a sense of reverence for life, and that he might be the odd one here.

I do not think that empathy for young women could be the reason for supporting abortion, especially late term. Anyone who could kill a baby I think would be incapable of true empathy on any level. I worked in a lab once and had to sacrifice a lot of mice. I sorta had to stop thinking about what I was doing after a while, and that was just with mice.

No, I wonder if some of these folks are motivated by some perverse desire to kill. I know it’s speculation, but it seems a bit like former doctor Michael Swango who deliberately poisoned his wife and a lot of his patients. In Swango’s case it was a crime, but the “law” allows for folks like Tiller and Carhart to operate in broad daylight. It’s chilling, when you consider the possibility of both the individual and societal psychopathology at work.


---- SpaceNeedle, this is not an attack on you, but what a stupid article!!! It does not give any real insight into why somone would chose a late term abortion. It DOES point out how people will go to any lengths to twist the truth (especially when it makes a priest look bad).

Risky, experimental surgery is never “required” as the article states. I can’t believe that no one in that scenario thought through the options enough to realize that sometimes a baby is born and doesn’t survive long but is still worthy of life, no matter how short. Nothing but eugenics thinly disquised as compassion. :mad:

I wonder if he contributed money to charities not related to hacking up babies.

I wonder if the Legionaries of Christ creator created that organization as some misdirected superego that can’t seem to overcome the id-ridden ego. I don’t know if I believe in that Freudian stuff, but they are the best symbols for explaining what I’m thinking. I wonder if hedonistic radicals do some or all good things out of a subconscious guilt.

If he doesn’t fund other causes or that’s not the reason, it could be like what I read in this pamphlet about how sexual immorality leads to going further.

Maybe it’s either/or an ego thing too. If you could not admit to others that you’ve been doing horrible things to others much less to yourself, you might try to shut out your conscience to keep doing it. Your conscience might be corrupted by lying to yourself enough, though, especially if you want to think yourself a good person (and thus, you can’t admit you’ve done evil, even if it started with ignorance).

It could just have been for the money, though, or in the name of eugenic causes (Has he written anything about himself?). Why they don’t get health inspections like hospitals and normal clinics, despite claiming it’s pro-woman, I can’t figure.

You know, I’m hardcore pro-life, I condemn the killing, I think this is terrible news, I’m completely on your side… but I think Carhart’s right about this.

Most of our med schools have little to no reverence for life, especially unborn life. Our current generation of college students is much more pro-life than earlier generations, but we still have a long, long way to go. There’ve got to be 20%… at least 10% of doctors (and I think a great deal higher) who passionately believe in the woman’s right to kill her unborn child, and who think that somebody ought to help out.

The decrease in abortionists is much sharper, so far, than the decrease in active, impassioned pro-choicers in America. Some of that’s certainly due to the gross-out factor now that we have ultrasound, and some of it may be due to a subconscious recognition of the life that abortion takes. But I think the only way to account for a lot of the decline is to accept Carhart’s assumption: violence against abortionists scares the hell out of doctors (literally!). Donating time and effort for the abortion cause is one thing, but risking your life? The lives of your family? Knowing that becoming a major-abortionist could make you a target for the rest of your life? Even in your church?

I don’t think of myself as a coward, but, if I were pro-abortion rights and training to be a doctor, the Tiller assassination would scare me off, I guarantee you. The “good” I would see myself doing as an abortionist would be far outweighed by the evil that could and very possibly would be inflicted on me. That same reasoning goes through the minds of tens of thousands of young, pro-abortion rights doctors every year. Result? A lot fewer abortionists.

The fact that violence from our side damages their side doesn’t change any of the moral calculus on either side. George Tiller was still evil, and Scott Roeder’s decision to kill Tiller was still wrong. It might be a little uncomfortable for us to admit that Roeder’s act of domestic terrorism, evil though it was, might very well work to reduce the number of abortionists in this country… but our discomfort doesn’t change the morality or the effect.

You know, I agree with you. I think there is a significant number of pro-choice doctors and medical students out there. So why don’t they put their practice where their mouth is? If somebody ought to help out, why not them? Well it could be fear, for some. But maybe while they personally believe in a woman’s right to choose, because it makes one feel like the master of one’s destiny, they just can’t get themselves to believe it sincerely enough to actually become the hit man.

Amazing, that while our schools try to turn out secular humanists without a sense of the sacrosanct, they just can’t erase what God put in their hearts.


I think a lot of it is ego. A lot of it has to do with the fact that these so called Drs. have no soul. With Carhart, there was an incident where his barn was burned down by some zellot. This drove him to pursue the cause. I hope that operation rescue does the same work they did when Tiller was at the clinic. I know the game has been changed, but there has to be a group that holds late term abortionists to account.

“Doctor contemplating take over of Tiller practice”

Scoundrel. He might meet the same fate. He should rethink taking such a mortally sinful path.

He’s probably possessed.

No good human, can contemplate doing this stuff. I believe the claims of the exorcist priest Fr. Euteneuer that the abortion industry at its core is a demonic/satanic profession.

I mean, didn’t someone post the disturbing audio of Tiller talking bout his killing? (i didn’t listen to it, but i’m sure Dr. Kevorkian like disturbing.)

Two people got in trouble for being spies for Cuba for three decades. I bet communists won’t get extra scrutiny, but we will because of Tiller’s murder. It’s probably that academia, the media and teachers’ unions are overrun by them and the other leftists in government, newspaper, mainstream media and schools kind of find them to be right-on. I’ve seen leftists with Mao’s face on their t-shirts. The errors of Russia have been here for decades.They need the religious to be seen as crazies. They even have the religious moderates finding the devout to be eccentrics, despite the media and professors being radicals and leftists don’t see them as wackos–or less so than the religious. Am I right? When will we get some Great Awakening spoken of in Catholic prophecy by saints? When will we see who the real kooks are?

I know I won’t be on god’s most favored creature list in the least, but if we could just see the culture of death as the hater crowd and not the devout religious who know what is (the Catholic ones having all that is in its patrimony and dogmas) and have a mass metanoia, I’ll be happy to be frightened about where I’ve failed. I would have more support in living a righteous life, I think. When you’re around the lukewarm or over-ecumenical, you wonder if you are too stiff.

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit