Doctrines of Demons

I guess i can say i am on a journey to reverting back to catholic. But another issue i have is 1 timothy 4:1-3 and it states
Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will renounce the faith by paying attention to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, through the hypocrisy of liars whose consciences are seared with a hot iron. They forbid marriage and demand abstinence from foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

Now does this apply to the catholic church know catholic church forbids priests to marry and abstaining on meats on fridays?

or am i just interpetting wrong?

You will get a number of similar answers to this question, as it is common. The easy answer to marriage is––Catholics permit marriage. Let me share this post:

As to Friday fast, it is certainly consistent with a number of verses in Scripture on proper fasting. The food is not forbidden for reasons of uncleanliness or something, which was the principle of such groups as the Gnostics who were averse to “the flesh.” See ECF comments here. :o

As to priests and marriage, I think of it this way.

Matthew 19:11-12

He answered, “Not all can accept [this] word,* but only those to whom that is granted. 12Some are incapable of marriage because they were born so; some, because they were made so by others; some, because they have renounced marriage* for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Whoever can accept this ought to accept it.”

1: No one is actually forbidden from marrying. Men who discern a call to the priesthood in the latin rite and decide to answer that call (usually) must be single and promise or vow (depending on if he is to be a parish priest or a religious order priest) to remain so. There are some rare exceptions to this priestly celibacy policy (such as men who were “ordained” as Anglican priests and decide to join the Church through the Ordinariate), and those Catholics in the Eastern Rites as that married men can be ordained. Men and women who take vows of celibacy to join a religious order do so freely, it’s their choice to do so. No one is forbidden from marrying unless the Church establishes that something about them makes marriage impossible such as not being able to consummate a marriage or already being validly sacramentally married even if civilly divorced.

2: As for the abstention…it’s only forbidden for one day a week in one liturgical season. This is hardly “forbidding foods” in my opinion.

Jimmy Akin has a good article addressing these verses you may find interesting.

In the original historical context, the passage appears to refer to what we would call “Gnostic’” groups, which regarded marriage and the eating of certain foods as intrinsically wrong. That’s not the Catholic position at all–in fact, Catholic Christianity took much of its shape from the struggle against these groups, affirming the goodness of the created world.

Edwin

ThunderFox. I will just focus in on the fasting aspect of your question as the marriage portion has been answered by others (the Catholic Church does NOT forbid marriage).

Men becoming Priests in the Latin Rite have agreed to forgo marriage “for the sake of the kingdom” (there are a few exceptions which I won’t get into here).

Virgins incidentally are extolled in Heaven in Revelation 14:4 for “follow(ing) the Lamb” in the context of choosing Virginity just as Jesus.

ThunderFox. You asked (quoted below with some minor syntax changes)

I guess I can say I am on a journey to reverting back to Catholic. . . .1 timothy 4:1-3 . . . states:

Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will renounce the faith by paying attention to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons, through the hypocrisy of liars whose consciences are seared with a hot iron. They forbid marriage and demand abstinence from foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

(Wouldn’t this classification as “doctrines of demons") apply to the catholic church . . . (concerning) abstaining on meats on fridays?

The answer is “no”.

There is a big difference in demanding abstaining from certain foods altogether as “immoral” and abstaining from these certain moral and good foods for brief time.

The Apostles also had a changeable discipline of abstaining from meat that was from strangled animals and blood so as not to scandalize the Jews who were becoming fulfilled Jews (Christians).

This seemed good to the Apostles AND to the Holy Spirit (at the Council of Jerusalem).

ACTS 15:19, 20 a,c, 28-29a 19 Therefore my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God, 20 but should write to them to abstain . . . from what is strangled and from blood. . . . . 28 For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols and from blood and from what is strangled . . .

And recall St. Paul was at the Council of Jerusalem (see Acts 15). He could have spoken up and said: “Hey guys! Cut this abstaining stuff out! This is doctrines of demons!”

But St. Paul would never have said that. Why? Because this doesn’t qualify as “doctrines of demons” that’s why.

Fasting (under good spiritual direction) can be a very good thing too.

Notice Jesus DOESN’T say in Matthew 6 . . . . “Well you guys shouldn’t fast because it would be a doctrine of demons.”

No. Jesus doesn’t teach that. Jesus teaches: “WHEN you fast . . . .” Notice Jesus assumes His disciples will fast. Are we disciples of Jesus? I hope so. Are we on occasion fasting?

MATTHEW 6:16 16 “And when you fast, do not look dismal like the hypocrites, for they disfigure their faces that their fasting may be seen by men. Truly, I say to you, they have their reward.

Likewise in Matthew 9. Notice Jesus DOESN’T say:

"When the bridegroom is taken away from them, I still don’t want my disciples to fast because after all, that would be a doctrine of demons.”

No. Jesus DOES say:

. . . “when the bridegroom is taken away from them, then they (Jesus’ disciples) will fast.”

MATTHEW 9:14-15 14 Then the disciples of John came to him, saying, “Why do we and the Pharisees fast, but your disciples do not fast?” 15 And Jesus said to them, "Can the wedding guests mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? The days will come, when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will fast.

And look how the Apostles did and did NOT discern who to ordain.

NOT ACTS 13:2-3 (Phantom Verse) 2 While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, "Cut that fasting stuff out! Don’t you guys know this is doctrines of demons?” 3 Then after not fasting because it was a doctrine of demons, but only praying they laid their hands on them and sent them off.

Here is what really happened:

ACTS 13:2-3 2 While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, “Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.” 3 Then after fasting and praying they laid their hands on them and sent them off.

There are legitimate uses of dietary practices and illegitimate uses.

The second-century Gnostic heretics had a “dualistic” type of outlook.

They viewed everything material as bad, and only spiritual things as good. They professed certain dietary laws due to “unclean foods” as “sinful” and forbid marriage.

1st TIMOTHY 4:1-3 1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in the later times some will depart from the faith by giving heed to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons 2 through the pretensions of liars whose consciences are seared, 3 who forbid marriage and enjoin abstinence from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

I once had an acquaintance who tried to tell me eating meat was “immoral” (that didn’t go anywhere).

A periodic abstinence from meat is not the same as teaching that eating meat is “immoral”.

Just because dietary abuses exist, it wouldn’t do away with legitimate uses of dietary practices such as fasting or occasional brief periods of abstaining from meat temporarily or even longer periods of abstaining from certain foods like the Old Covenant Israelites had.

I hope this helps you on your journey back home ThunderFox.

God bless.

Cathoholic

Celibacy of the Catholic Priest Supported by Scripture

Many people believe that the Catholic Church violates the Word of God because it forbids people to marry (cf. 1 Timothy 4:3) and that it is wrong for priests to remain celibate. To get a clearer picture of this issue, let’s examine what the Bible has to say about the subject of celibacy.

Matthew 19:11-12
11Jesus replied, “Not everyone can accept this word, but only those to whom it has been given. 12For some are eunuchs because they were born that way; others were made that way by men; and others have renounced marriage because of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it.”

Jesus offers the celibate life as a gift and tells us that “The one who can accept this should accept it.”

1 Corinthians 7:1
1Now for the matters you wrote about: It is good for a man not to marry.

1 Corinthians 7:7
7I wish that all men were as I am. But each man has his own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that.

Paul reveals his own celibacy and offers an earnest wish that more people would follow his example.

1 Corinthians 7:8-9
8Now to the unmarried and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I am. 9But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.

Paul concedes that getting married is better than struggling with sexual temptation; for those that “cannot control themselves, they should marry.”

Is Paul completely opposed to marriage? Not at all. The book of Hebrews states:

Hebrews 13:4
Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.

Why then does Paul recommend celibacy?

1 Corinthians 7:32-35
32I would like you to be free from concern. An unmarried man is concerned about the Lord’s affairs—how he can please the Lord. 33But a married man is concerned about the affairs of this world—how he can please his wife— 34and his interests are divided. An unmarried woman or virgin is concerned about the Lord’s affairs: Her aim is to be devoted to the Lord in both body and spirit. But a married woman is concerned about the affairs of this world—how she can please her husband. 35I am saying this for your own good, not to restrict you, but that you may live in a right way in undivided devotion to the Lord.

From this passage, we can see Paul’s primary reason for advocating celibacy: he wants everyone to live in undivided devotion to the Lord, and in all of these verses, the Bible makes it clear that Jesus calls some men to the priesthood and offers them the gift of a celibate life to be lived in undivided devotion to God. Paul understands that not everyone is offered this gift and that not all to whom it is offered can or will accept it.

There are Catholic priests who are married; typically, these are men who were priests in the Anglican, Orthodox or other faith traditions and have converted to the Catholic faith after they were married in those churches. Under special circumstances, they may be ordained to serve as Catholic priests. Men who are already Catholic when they begin to discern their call to the priesthood must remain celibate.

The Catholic Church forbids no man to marry. However, she does desire that those who will represent Christ, who will stand in persona Christi (in the place of Christ) when administering the sacraments as priests, be like their Lord as fully as possible. This means that like Jesus, they are celibate men prepared to sacrifice their own lives in the service of God and others.

The calling and the gift is offered by God; those who choose to accept it do so freely. :thumbsup:

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