Does anyone like the New Mass?


#1

I would like to see if anyone likes the New Mass as it is currently presented in the majority of parishes today.

Please do not talk about your exceptions to the rule as I know there are a few parishes out there that offer a very reverent NO Mass with Latin, Chant and strict adherence to the rubrics.
Please leave out all discussion to the TLM (as I have never been to one, that is for another discussion) and lets just discuss the NO.

This is something I have seen twice in my life here in California, and I did think it was wonderful. I have traveled extensively in California and see that is the exception here, most of the time it is quite horrible and I just close my eyes so I can concentrate on the beauty of the Sacrament.

I would like to know if anyone likes the Mass as it is presented in the majority of parishes here or would they like it different.

I seem to see the majority of people on this forum would like it more reverent and properly presented. On the flip side I see the progressives want it changed more to include more freedom to involve people and make it more spontaneous.

Which side predominates and does anyone like it the way it is right now?

I look forward to the input,
In Christ
Scylla


#2

I attend what I think is a reverent and faithful NO Mass every week. Usually I am at my home parish, but there are a dozen other parishes within 10 miles where I could find the same thing. Though there is very seldom Latin or chant.

What I see others describe on these boards is beyond my experience. Last summer I did attend a Mass in Kentucky while in vacation that was rather “different” (a sister of St. Joseph gave an appeal for missions as the homily and the priest wore only an alb and a rainbow colored stole), but by and large it also followed the prescribed format.


#3

I put answer number 1 to make a point. I think that what the OP asks does not make any sense.
What do you mean with “I would like to see if anyone likes the New Mass as it is currently presented in the majority of parishes today.”?
Are you talking about all the parishes in the world, in the USA, in a specific state, in a specific Diocese?
How many people that attend Mass, do attend services in a systematic way go frequently to other parishes etc. ?
I think that you are trying to make a point using an extremely biased way of conducting a poll. Here, I am talking about statistical bias that could easily predetermine the outcome of a poll.


#4

Where staunch adherence to the rubrics is concerned, no matter how “right” or “good” it may be, I can’t help but hear Christ’s words echoing in my mind: “why do you transgress the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? (Matthew 15:3)”

Now, as I see it, God commands sincere worship and adoration, praise and thanksgiving, offering and sacrifice; all of these are offered to Him in the NO Mass, so I can’t help but think this rigid ‘go by the rubrics’ echoes the ‘go by the traditions of the religion’ of the Pharisees.

I’m not saying we should stand for any kind of liturgical abuse, but all this worrying about the rubrics over worrying about people’s love of God…it just seems like priorities are mixed up.

I’m not trying to pass judgment on people who prefer to go by the rubrics; on the contrary, I love the rubrics, the traditional mass, the TLM, and the NO with very much the same passion. I can’t help but think, though, that maybe some people forget the point of the rubrics, and stick to the rubrics just because they are the rubrics and “that’s just the way it should be done.”

Please, I’m not trying to offend anyone here, I’m sure that you all are faithful Catholics (after all, you spend your free time in a Catholic forum), but that is how I feel about the rubrics. They are lovely, and they are good rules and guidelines for worship, but if the Spirit moves the heart of a faithful parish in a different direction, what rubrics can stand in the way of the Almighty?


#5

Cristiano,
I am using a very focused and maybe extreme poll as I want clear and focused answers. Any variance from the GIRM or what is specified in Vatican II is either acceptable or not.

Thank you for picking number one, maybe I am just picky and overreacting. Tell me, you wont hurt my feelings. If need correction correct me, and I thank you.

But I will insist that the majority of parishes do not have strict rubrics which adhere to the documents of Vatican II nor to the GIRM.

Does your Mass retain Latin and use some chant, with strict adherence to the rubrics? If not then it is not being conducted according to the documents of Vatican II and the GIRM.

Do they fraction the consecrated blood? Or do any of the minor abnormal things that are frequently commented about on these forums.

If so would you like the Mass to be more in line with the rubrics?
That is the poll, does variance matter? I deliberately made the poll extreme to get honest answers. I don’t like lukewarm answers, as I am Catholic, thanks again for your honesty.

God Bless
Scylla


#6

So those of you who love it!!!..

So you would not like to change anything?

God Bless
Scylla


#7

I don’t think anyone can make a choice on your poll unless they’ve actually BEEN to a “majority of parishes” in the US.

You have had a bad experience where you live. I, OTOH, have traveled extensively with work and for pleasure for 15 years, and can say that the # of times I’ve visited a parish with abuses can be counted on one hand (including visits to relatives in SoCal and the Bay Area of Northern California).

In my current diocese, and my former home diocese (major metro area) I have not encountered anything abusive. Same goes for my travels with the exception of about 4 parishes.

And, yes, I do like the NO Mass. But, I can’t speak for all the parishes I’ve never been to.


#8

I love it the way it is. No changes.

Or maybe just one change. I wish there were a magic formula that would make the parishioners SING OUT with a full head voice instead of standing mute without even opening the missalette to follow the words. Hymns or CCM, it doesn’t matter. So many people just don’t sing. I think it’s because they don’t like to sing. Very sad. Their parents should receive three lashes with a wet noodle! A love of singing and music develops in the home.

I agree with those who say that it is highly unlikely that you can make an accurate judgement about what happens in the majority of parishes in the U.S. unless you travel extensively. In our diocese, the bishop is very strict about abuses in the NO.

I have attended Masses in about 20 different parishes in four different states since becoming Catholic. Never once have I seen anything that would be considered “abuse.”

I did see one parish where after the Mass, a group of people gathered around the piano, and the excellent musician played contemporary Christian music while everyone present joined in and sang along. It happened AFTER Mass. There was an Adoration Chapel right next to the sanctuary for anyone who wanted a place for quiet prayer and meditation. I personally thought it was a really neat thing, a “family sing-a-long.”

But that’s the only really “different” thing that I saw.

Oh, and in one parish in our diocese, the priest plays the keyboard and does his own cantoring. Not sure if this is because of a lack of cantors or not. I suspect that’s part of it, but the priest had a very “Elton John” singing and playing style, so I really don’t think he minded very much!

Love it.


#9

They are lovely, and they are good rules and guidelines for worship, but if the Spirit moves the heart of a faithful parish in a different direction, what rubrics can stand in the way of the Almighty?

Hi KA!

The Spirit does not move the faithful against the norms established by the Church to which Christ gave the authority to bind and loose. No such contradiction exists within the Trinity; the Almighty is not divided against Himself.


#10

Oh, and in one parish in our diocese, the priest plays the keyboard and does his own cantoring. Not sure if this is because of a lack of cantors or not. I suspect that’s part of it, but the priest had a very “Elton John” singing and playing style, so I really don’t think he minded very much!

Uhhhhh… Is this priest “helping out” as another priest “presides?” One of the big problems with the orientation in the NO (or lack of orientation) i.e. priest facing congregation, is that it lends a false air of priest as performer. The situation you describe, without being there, sounds like it was very likely way too focussed on the “performance” of the priest.

There is a reason the priest and the faithful faced east together in th litrugy from teh Church’s earliest days. The worshipping community was not a closed circle gazing upon one another. They looked to what is to come, through Christ in the Eucharist, together… and the faithful did not sit focussed upon the priest, reacting to his every move.

To address the OP, I love the fact that the NO, in that it is the Sacrifice of the Mass, is heaven on earth, but I lament all that was lost. Just the one change of no longer facing east together has led to a situation where much of the “qualtiy” of the liturgy hinges upon the “performance” of the priest.


#11

There was no answer that worked quite right for me.

I’m very happy with the way my parish celebrates the Mass.

I might wish that it was a bit quieter before and after Mass. I’m hoping it will be in a couple of years when our new hall is built. Then the choir will have a place to practice before Mass. Whether or not that will prevent the early birds from wanting to greet each other and chat will be another matter. I don’t see my parish making such a request as long as the choir has to practice in the Church. Those who wish to pray go to the Blessed Sacrament Chapel anyway.

I might attend a Tridentine Mass occasionally because I like a lot of variety but I wouldn’t attend on a regular basis if I had a choice.


#12

I voted option #2.

Look, if we were talking about a major league baseball game, would you be complaining about rubricism? There is a whole lot of rubricism there. You know, Maynard? You don’t just make up the rules as you go along, running to whichever base you want in any order.

And, you don’t argue with the ump for very long, either.

I’m sorry, but it’s an offensive question, just to ask if anybody “likes” the Mass? Is this a poll like, less filling or tastes great? Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don’t?

The Mass we have is a very ancient liturgical rite of religions, established by Jesus Christ, who is the real God Almighty. First of all, the Mass is the genuine continuing representation of Jesus’ death and resurrection. What’s not to like about this?

Sure, if anything is going on that does not follow rubrics or causes a disturbance it is really inappropriate. I suggest that if you don’t like rubrics, then why don’t you just spit it out what you want?

There is no other thing on earth like the Mass. If you’re comparing it to a stage play or the latest movie or harry pothole, or whatever, than you’re comparing things that are not meant to be compared.


#13

That’s not quite what I meant…

I’m saying doesn’t Love, especially Love of God, trump whatever ‘mistakes’ occur during Mass?


#14

I like both the New Mass and the Mass of 1962.

I have been to Masses that have been very reverent and uplifting. There wasn’t any Latin or chant, but the holiness of the priest shone like a beacon.
However, I do believe that the New Mass is more open to abuse. Gender neutral language for one or priests that appear to be more concerned with their “performance” than celebrating the Mass with prayerful reverence.
I was only a child when the New Mass came in and my experience of the TLM is fairly recent. The one thing that struck me most was that with the priest leading us in prayer and consequently, having his back to us, his personality ceased to be a factor in how Mass was celebrated.
I hope that makes sense.


#15

If I had to go to the NO, it would be either the Latin NO or Polish NO.


#16

I voted I love the NO Mass
However I also love TLM
not because of the form of each but because of the miricle that takes place each and evevy time a mass is celebrated.
I have also been lucky to be in many faithfull parishes


#17

I assume you mean the non-Latin mass though I doubt if it qualifies as “new” any more. I have been to 'new" masses with horrible music, liturgies, sermons, etc. and to “new” masses with beautiful liturgies in which there was a strong sense of community and piety, thoughtful and provocative sermons, etc. Some of the worse have been children’s masses (which seem to have faded away recently). I once was at one in which mouse cartoons were shown on the ceiling of the Church!. One of the best was one I attended this summer while on business/vacation in Maui with wonderful music and total church involvement with a really good sermon by a priest who was obviously a native Hawaiian. (I think it was St. Vincent’s but I could be mis-remembering this as I type). The point is that while some masses have better aesthetics than others, what really matters is the Eucharist, not the format or rite. I have not been to a Latin mass for decades but hope to do so shortly. But I think that nostalgia is not what it used to be.


#18

I love the Mass in whichever form it is correctly celebrated. I’ve been to mass in many countries (St. Peter’s little chapel in Italy :wink: and the Shrine of the Black Madonna in Poland rank as two of the best…can you have two best??)

It is only in recent times that I’ve become aware of the term rubrics. It has made me sensitive to seeing things done incorrectly, and when appropriate I’ll make a gentle suggestion.

Having predominantly served in and been served by military parishes for the majority of my majority, one thing I could always count on was if you didn’t like the way the current guy did things, he would be leaving in two years anyway…I’ve seen from orthodox to “what the heck was that we just sat through” as far as celebration. (The former MUCH more often than the latter.)

Funny story - at daily mass a couple weeks ago, the priest announces at the beginning of the Eucharistic prayer, that he would recite #1 in Latin. Beautiful - most of the people are in the age category that I KNOW they grew up with this and would probably appreciate the nostalgic moment.

Immediately following Mass, as we departed, an 84 YO woman approached me to complain she hated Latin, it is a step backward, and since she didn’t understand Latin, during consecration she didn’t know when to recite to herself the meditation, “My Lord and my God” that she has grown accustomed to over the years. I smiled and assured her if she watched Father in the future, it would come to her. There was no changing her mind though.:shrug:


#19

I haven’t been to the TLM (but hope to go!), Since I came into the Church I’ve been to a number (around 25) of parishes on the West Coast (never been to one east of CA, OR, or WA) - and I can count on one hand the parishes I’ve been to where there wasn’t an abuse,

Being concerned with the rubrics, at least for me, is a measure of the obedience of the parish/priest/bishop(?) to the Vatican and since that is where the successor of Peter works it is central to the faith. If it is true that we worship as we believe, if there is irreverence or disobedience to Peter…I feel that makes a difference to the “fruit”.


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