Well, even if I am right, I suppose it couldn’t be proven any more than your take on things. If either or any could undeniably be proven we would have what? Probably at least 90% of the world’s population operating under the same religious beliefs?
Many don’t want God to intervene to prove himself; they just want God to intervene because they want and need help. Desperately.
Humans :shrug: they do think they know what they want or need. As an example I like to use, my son is not allowed over his friends house. He thinks it is partially bc they dont watch the kids enough, he can try to work around that or think I am being mean/wrong.
They are heroin addicts… so yeah he is not old enough or ready to be told the answer. Though he thinks himself ready.
Um…just because Satan and Demons make certain choices, it doesn’t mean others will or would. Many would make more choices that God wants them to if he intervened. We hear the stories all the time about people who have something happen to them that they think God did, and they change their lives.
So then…perhaps God can do more of that, yes?
The first point I absolutely agree. Which is why some people don’t choose what satan did
And I am reminded of a joke. A man is swimming and he prays and says God get me through this I will donate all my money and become a monk, he is halfway “God I will donate most of my money and help the poor”. He gets close to shore and “God help me I will donate my next paycheck”. As he hits the shore “God, thanks I might do something later” and later he says “yeah I totally swam that by myself becasue I am awesome”.
Perhaps the next time he needs a hand swimming it won’t be there?
People aren’t asking to be puppets with no free will.
They are merely asking for God to intervene.
On their terms, as a child thinks their parent should. Do we always intervene or grant our children’s desires? And when we don’t are we evil? Or are we doing what is best?
If you were assured salvation and to be in heaven forever with God…I don’t think many religious people would consider that being a slave.
See my post before I saw yours about the value of a friend. The “slave” as I called it is worthless. These people seek in essence to be worthless and handed what they want in return for nothing.
As it is now, many already feel the slave mentality…but they are not %100 assured of salvation. At least with the other scenario, they know for sure what the end result will be. And that knowledge would go a long way.
Again to my other post
But let me get this ultra human…
Leader 1 says “later we may have to do X”
His people jump up out of respect and have it done perfectly for the sake of their leader
Leader 2 says “Do X NOW!!” And we make excuses and undermine jerk man.
But sometimes when you have a great leader and a crew of 10. 9 of you jump to. You do without the leader ever giving an order.
However 1 must be treated like leader 1 is lesder 2.
I had leaders like this in the military. Ever seen starship troopers? When they insult the lieutenant? The other member punches them?
I had a Sgt. Like that, if you had a guy Sgt… is a jerk the response was “No, you suck clearly so watch your mouth”
Despite one being so good to his people, so skilled at his job, and so near as perfect as an imperfect human could be there were always the few who were incapable of processing it properly.
So I say in a similar way, is it God who makes the slave? Or is it them who decides that He who is good is bad?
Another one I have stated is a renter who was for years up to 6 months behind on rent. Landlord was a doctor who probono took care of the renter’s dying mother. Years later upon eviction after years of falling behind tbe landlord offered this: “pay next month on time and I will let you stay and cut your debt in half”. The renter then lazily paid 2 weeks later and the landlord evicted.
The renter thinks the landlord is a mean sneak who renigged on their deal…
I see this as a great examole on how one’s opinion of God can be quite flawed.