Does God punish people with hell? And does faith make you do good works automatically?


#1

Some Christians say: God doesn’t put people in hell. But what about this verse?

Matthew 10:28 (GNT)
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather be afraid of God, who can destroy both body and soul in hell.

That’s why what I know is that God puts people in hell.

Some Christians say something like: When you have faith, you automatically do works. I thought Christians need to use their will unlike what they say, study this verse:

James 2:19 (NIV)
In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

It reads “accompanied”, “accompanied” meaning, to be present or occur at the same time as (something else). So I know it’s not an after effect of faith like others says. Maybe that belief is for defending Sola Fide.

Am I right?


#2

For Matt 10:28 most translations say “him” not GOD.
People choose hell by their own doings.

as for your other question, yes. It is an error, and not Scriptural.


#3

Who’s the him then? Can’t be satan since he’s going there himself, can’t be yourself, since it doesn’t say “you”. I think it’s God. I think it’s the person’s fault for not believing but God put’s him in hell if he dies.


#4

I don’t know if it’s official doctrine that we ourselves put ourselves in Hell, but I find that concept to be dizzying logically, at least when it comes to people who really struggle with one or more kinds of mortal sin, but really do genuinely want to and try to get to Heaven…I had felt before hearing of this that all some of us can do is try to make it to Heaven (via Purgatory.) Of course, though, if someone dies with no time to repent of a mortal sin, and does not have perfect contrition and or is not planning on going to Confession as soon as possible (assuming they know about this responsibility at least,) and dies than automatically their spirit is entirely evil, for their spirit was killed by mortal sinning (hence the word “mortal”) and of course, there is only one appropriate place for evil spirits: Hell.

God still loves people once there (and yes, the demons too), and there being something very inherently good about existence, or else evil spirits would simply cease to exist, which is what they are at least said to very much want rather than suffer as they do, which would only make sense.


#5

Stephen Fry is on record as saying that he wouldn’t want to go to heaven if offered the chance. He describes God as an evil maniacal monster who allows children to suffer. Other famous atheists (Hitchens and Dawkins for 2) have expressed their unwillingness to spend eternity with God as they imagine him to be. I imagine lots of other not famous atheists feel the same way. They not only lack a belief in God, they hold him in utter contempt (so in a way they actually believe in him? :rolleyes:) My point is that some people do actually put themselves in hell because they have turned so far away from God they can’t even conceive of being with him for eternity. Hell is our final rejection of God, and yes we put ourselves there.


#6

Of course, in a way at least…and not just the kind of people you describe…a dead spirit is an evil spirit and it hates God…at least if and when it is separated from its body.


#7

Of course, all of us can make to Heaven if we try hard enough and we should take more responsibility for our actions than I may have implied…


#8

Ive heard this many times, but disagree…how is free will ‘free’, when people MUST commit themselves and accept/worship, God as the savior to keep out of hell?

TRUE free will would mean there are no punishments for the ‘wrong’ choices, there would not be any wrong choices, ANY decision we make would be OK.(as long as we are not infringing on the free will of another).

Furthermore, ( and I know this is not widely believed), but if we had been given true free will upon our creation, we all know God created us as immortal beings, our souls are us, and they are immortal, so the question is, did God give free will to our bodies or our souls?

If he gave it to our souls (which seems most logical to me, since that is what we truly are in Gods eyes, the human ‘meat suit’ is only used in the earthly world, wont matter much in the big picture), so our souls should still have free will when we die, thus being able to make choices after death as well.

If he gave us free will ONLY to be used on earth, then that would be a limited/temporary gift, this does not sound like the God I know


#9

At the end of time, the righteous in Heaven will get their bodies back again. A soul has both spiritual and physical elements and the whole of a person certainly does matter. This is official Catholic teaching you can look up and we do have free-will: free-will to choose God or sin and that too is official Catholic teaching.

I am sorry if you are not Catholic, but you do not specify if you are still Catholic, or simply raised Catholic. Certainly, regardless, you have the free-will to choose to believe anything you want.


#10

C**ourage under Persecution.
26 “Therefore do not be afraid of them. Nothing is concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known.
27 What I say to you in the darkness, speak in the light; what you hear whispered, proclaim on the housetops. 28 And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.*

Bold mine
The one spoken about here seems to me to Satan and his works. What I take aways from this is we are given a choice to embrace God or fall for Satan. While many things can destroy our bodies, sickness, accidents, and so on, only falling into Satan’s web can destroy our souls.

Some Christians say something like: When you have faith, you automatically do works. I thought Christians need to use their will unlike what they say, study this verse:

James 2:19 (NIV)
In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

It reads “accompanied”, “accompanied” meaning, to be present or occur at the same time as (something else). So I know it’s not an after effect of faith like others says. Maybe that belief is for defending Sola Fide.

Am I right?

Faith and Works.
14 What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister has nothing to wear and has no food for the day, 16 and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, keep warm, and eat well,” but you do not give them the necessities of the body, what good is it? 17 So also faith of itself, if it does not have works, is dead. 18 Indeed someone might say, “You have faith and I have works.” Demonstrate your faith to me without works, and I will demonstrate my faith to you from my works. 19 You believe that God is one. You do well. Even the demons believe that and tremble. 20 Do you want proof, you ignoramus, that faith without works is useless? 21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar? 22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by the works. 23 Thus the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,” and he was called “the friend of God.”l 24 See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone. 25 And in the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she welcomed the messengers and sent them out by a different route? 26 For just as a body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

I believe that our faith encourages us to do good works. I think the thing most often overlooked with this concept is the nature of good works. So many seem to think it has to be about helping the poor, giving to charity, or other societal norms of “good works”. But in reality it is using the gifts God gives us in a way that is positive. Take the farmer. To do good works he needs to be a good steward of the land he farms, do his best to produce crops to sell to others to provide for his family. A banker is doing good works when his career is one of honesty and supporting of his family.

The good works isn’t necessarily charity work, it’s using our gifts in a way that is pleasing to God.


#11

God created us in His own image, and in doing so, He didn’t make us little robots that just say “Yes Master, I will do as You command.” He wanted us to commit our love to Him. You are free to choose to love Him or not. God wanted us to be able to seek Him on our own accord.

Look at CCC 1730 - 1784 for more clarification.

Pax,

John


#12

Because God is love, God does not violate man’s free will.
Man is free to choose.
“Having faith” would describe man’s acceptance and trust in God’s grace and what he reveals. Faith is not the same thing as understanding. Faith is not a guarantee of perfection. Man’s acceptance of God’s gift of faith is not perfect. We are free to choose.

Claiming faith is not an inoculation against sin.


#13

Also God created Hell. It’s like if I dug a deep pit in my backyard and lined the bottom with spikes. Sure you walked into it, but I’m ultimately responsible for your pain.


#14

Psalm 25
Prayer for God’s favor and protection
Our hope will never be disappointed (Romans 5:5).

To you,O Lord,I lift up my soul. I trust in you, let me not be disappointed;
do not let my enemies triumph.
Those who hope in you shall not be disappointed,
but only those who wantonly break faith.

See more at: divineoffice.org/ord-w01-thu-dp2-current/?title=Jul+02%2C+Midday+Prayer+for+Thursday+in+the+13th+week+of+Ordinary+Time&date=20150702#sthash.0zn3f7Db.dpuf

Peace


#15

Matt 10 : 28 My Cath. Bible says “him.” My New International Bible says “the One.”


#16

I agree.
:signofcross:


#17

Me too !


#18

Pope Benedict on hell:

catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0701686.htm

Ed


#19

=souldiver;13094781]Some Christians say: God doesn’t put people in hell. But what about this verse?

Matthew 10:28 (GNT)
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather be afraid of God, who can destroy both body and soul in hell.

That’s why what I know is that God puts people in hell.

Some Christians say something like: When you have faith, you automatically do works. I thought Christians need to use their will unlike what they say, study this verse:

James 2:19 (NIV)
In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

It reads “accompanied”, “accompanied” meaning, to be present or occur at the same time as (something else). So I know it’s not an after effect of faith like others says. Maybe that belief is for defending Sola Fide.

Am I right?

Allow me my friend to first anwser you’re OPQ

No God does NOT send people to hell; that hell exist is a reality and WE choose for our selves by our lives choices eternal hell or eternal happiness in heaven.:thumbsup:

Here is why man exist:

Isaiah 43 verses 7 & 21
“And every one that calleth upon my name, I have created him for my glory, I have formed him, and made him. …This people have I formed for myself, they shall shew forth my praise”

We glorify God in great part by the charity we share with everyone we meet…

John 13:34
“A new commandment I give unto you: That you love one another, as I have loved you, that you also love one another”

No one can attain heaven without charity; without good works, which themselves give evidence of our faith beliefs and that God is working IN and THROUGH us.:slight_smile:

That said; works, even very GOOD works by themselves cannot and will not merit on their own sufficient cause to attain heaven. of God’s truths as taught by His Catholic Church

It is the the entirely of the truths Mt. 16:18-20, taught by the Church, and especially the frequent and right use of the Sacraments that salvation can be had.:thumbsup:

God Bless you,

Patrick


#20

You want to be able to go through life doing exactly as you like with no negative consequences? I’m sorry but that attitude seems very immature to me. We aren’t here for our pleasure but for God’s. He wants us to obey him but he gives us the freedom not to. But for those who chose to obey God there is no greater pleasure than to do simply that.


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