Does woman need ex's permission to use frozen embryos from 4 years ago?



Life gets complicated for humans when they decide to play God and freeze embryos etc.
I feel sorry for the child if one is conceived this way. Not wanted by a father, no support from him if she “wins” that he can be a donor alone et .
Have Mercy on us and on the whole world.



Putting all the ethics aside, I don’t think the child is going to feel sorry to be alive.


Pretty much.

Trust me, life can still turn out pretty wonderful even if you are born into less than ideal circumstances.


Emotions can and do change. Contracts do not unless voluntarily modified by both parties according to state and federal law. In my opinion, as much as I feel for this woman and her desire to have babies, the contract she signed stated that the embryo’s couldn’t be used without the consent of both parties. One party does not consent. Should be open and shut.


Nobody said the child is going to feel sorry to be alive. Or did I miss something?


No of course not, I never said the child would be sorry to be alive. My point was simply a life without a father, child support etc, can be difficult. To explain to a child that he or she was an embryo, in the arrangement they have and that “daddy” wants no part of his life is not easy for a child. The children always suffer the most when adults make amoral and selfish decisions in my opinion.

The Church is clear about frozen embryos and for a reason easily found online.



I think from a legal standpoint, the contract said they would have to have his consent and they don’t. From a moral standpoint though…these are not just sperm anymore. They are already embryos. Does that make a difference?


What Mary said^^ exactly. Life is always precious especially in the eyes of God, but to deliberately bring a child into the world in circumstances like this(with no father,the father protesting) is selfish on the part of the adults involved.
Why not adopt children or foster children that need a loving home?


Please correct me if I am wrong, but we are talking about embryos. They are already “conceived”. To bring “a child into this world with no father etc. is selfish” also applies to rape victims.


As far as I can see it, there are three issues here:

(1) The legal question. The father, who has done his contribution already, doesn’t want the child(ren) anymore.

(2) The ethical question. The embryos were frozen. That’s done. We can’t change that, even if the Church sees it as immoral.

(3) The future of the embryo/child which is frozen, but alive. According to Church teaching it has a soul (I assume it survives the freeze). Shall we destroy it, or let it grow into a human?


The ramifications of our culture’s openness to IVF pains me and the “use”, or buying and selling of human embryos in a contractual way, is deeply disturbing.


They already are human. Perhaps you mean should we let it grow to be an adult?


No matter how they get here - ALL children are gifts from God.


And this is why contracts should not be so vague. Not that I am ever worried about my husband and I divorcing, but before we even started our IVF cycle we had to fill out a notarized document as to what would happen to our embryos in the event of divorce (aka who gets custody), what would happen if one of us died, and who would be legal guardian of our embryos should we both die before they are transferred.


Yes. It’s certainly not our own doing how we came about.


I meant BEFORE the act of creating the embryos -deliberately bringing children into the world in certain ways .i.e. no father, as in the case of sperm donation, or certain acts of IVF, ect. In the case of rape or even consensual sex when a pregnancy happens of course the child is wanted by God and precious in His eyes. Some of these AR practices are not fair to the child.
Of course these children, no matter how they were conceived, are precious in the eyes of God, and already exist now and IMO should be brought to term, or at least there should be an attempt to bring them to term by having them implanted in the mothers womb.(the natural mother) But look at the unique problems these brave new AR techniques are bringing. Now you have a man protesting that he doesn’t want to become a father. This is going to be a messy court case probably with him trying to have the embryos destroyed. Will he win? I hope not. These practices bring problems that natural conceptions don’t and I can understand the Catholic position frankly.
I have some friends who have had 3 beautiful daughters via IVF. This is a stable married couple who are Christians(protestant). These girls are very precious. But they still have leftover embryos that they have to decide what to do with.
Maybe laws should be passed like some European countries limiting the practice to only 2 created at a time and implanted.


We hear stories of violent rape every day, and that’s just a tiny fraction of a percent of what’s happening out there. I do have a problem with your view of “when a pregnancy happens of course the child is wanted by God and precious in His eyes”.

It comes very close to the thorny Problem of Evil: Why does God allow this immense amount of suffering in the natural world?

This is not for us to answer. But “the child is wanted by God” as a result of a violent rape? It sounds like God wanted that brutal rape to happen in order for that child to be born.


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