Don't call St John Paul and St Lucia "liars"


You have a car hood, not a car bonnet.
Chips are french fries and crisps are chips.
A waistcoat is a vest.
Trousers are pants.
An aubergine is an eggplant.
Biscuits are cookies.
You say 'erbs instead of herbs. :grin:


Like the 70,000 people who witnessed the inexplicable manifestation of the sun?


I would like to read the diary also.


It is a very interesting historical happening based in the modern world which I think shows the silliness of a lot of the liberal biblical criticists who tried to portray the New Testament as fiction, exaggerated stories and the products of disparate communities.

Such arguments cannot be used for Fatima and so shows up the irrationality of the rigid assumptions of such schools of thought on New Testament studies.


Y:es ! Any British person shopping in supermarket in the USA should refer to shopping trolley as Kart :upside_down_face:


In America do you have to put a coin in the trolley (kart) to use it?


I was there a coupe of years ago. I don’t think I had to pay for it.


Depends on if you live in a nice neighborhood or a bad one. Or if you shop at Aldi’s which seems to univerally require coin use no matter how upscale the neighborhood.


At Aldi’s you do!


I think the wikipwedia article has some ideas about what was seen at Fatima. In 1917, I don’t think people would be scientifically sophisticated enough to even describe what seemed to happen, with the appearance of the sun, much less to explain it. By the time it gets embellished into a film on EWTN I think the event is detached from history entirely. Would those 70,000 people all agree on what they saw? eyewitness testimony has proven to be unreliable in a court room.

On the 100th anniversary day AT FATIMA, in 2017, IT WAS FOGGY. It was hard to see across the plaza at Fatima, even with EWTN’s cameras. Does that give you a HINT about what people thought they saw in 1917?


And American take-out food is take-away in the UK. “Let’s get some Chinese take-away today.”


Personally, I believe Fatima and it’s my favorite Marian apparition. My sons watch Peppa Pig and I’ve caught them using British words. I think it’s cute. I wonder if Brits accept American immigrants; lol


At least we know which side of the road to drive on! :crazy_face:


If you have Netflix, then you watch EWTN and Catholic TV… both of them can be streamed or watched live for free on your computer or streaming device


n most places you don’t. The only place I’ve seen that happen is in Long Island, NY. And apparently at Aldi’s


I don’t believe in private revelation. It is like believing Joseph Smith saw something. It’s teenagers wanting attention and frankly the church would be better off without it.


The Wikipedia article on Fatima is a joke.

Mass hysteria: doesn’t apply for multiple reasons
Sundogs: nothing like what was described
Gas cloud: nothing like what was described, would take a miracle for an uneducated child to have predicted

In 1917 people weren’t scientifically sophisticated enough to describe what they saw? What?


I keep hearing about this book but can’t find it what is the name of the title?


HI Jas,

Private revelation isn’t necessary, because it isn’t telling us what public revelation hasn’t already told us.

Joseph Smith and Muhammad invented a new faith tradition from their mystical experiences (and personally, I believe their experiences really were supernatural in origin, but I don’t know that as an empirical fact) but mystics in the Church aren’t inventing a new faith tradition. They confirm what has already been taught for generations.

C.S. Lewis presented a case towards Jesus, that he was either a liar, a lunatic, or telling the truth. Since he was accepting being actually worshiped by people and calling himself the salvation of the human race, he was either a crazy person, or he was a nefarious liar, or he was telling the truth. But it’s not possible to just call him a good teacher, because a good teacher would never be worshiped as God unless he actually were God. It would be scandalous.

IMO I think the same applies to canonized mystics, because unless they really did accurately report their mystical experiences, the only alternatives are that they were delusional people with good intentions, or wicked liars. I don’t know how you can make a case that they are good, sane people, who said the things that they did.


You’re on mate, unless you fancy a Big Mac :hamburger:

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit