Exodus, Levitcus help


#1

People, I am reading the bible this year and I am quite shocked by what I read in Exodus and Leviticus. About death for sin and certain rules etc.

Was/is God really like that? Or, was all this changed when Jesus came among us?

I feel saddened by what I have read. It has really shocked me people!


#2

It was “changed” only in the sense that Jesus made it possible for people not to follow certain aspects of the Law, which I believe you are referring to, since He absolved them by means of fulfilling the Law (or possibly becoming the Law) due to His own vicarious sacrifice. However, the death penalty in the Hebrew Bible (Old Testament) had to meet a high threshold to be carried out: for example, two reliable eyewitnesses in the case of adultery. And the notion that children inherit the sins of their fathers is interpreted according to most Jewish scholars as meaning that since children are raised in the same household by their parents, they learn the same immoral (or moral) behaviors of their parents. Regarding the dietary laws, that too was elaborated upon in the Gospel of Matthew where it states that it is not what goes into one’s mouth that defiles one but what comes out. Christianity (including Catholicism) does not interpret this as G-d’s changing His mind–that idea would be heretical–but instead as a fulfillment or more complete explanation of the Law. Nazarene Jews, who accept Jesus as the Messiah but not as G-d, have a different take on this specific statement in Matthew and mainstream (Orthodox) Judaism, of course, still follows the Law as written. However, the Torah law applies only to Jews, not to Gentiles, who according to Jewish belief need only follow the seven Noachide laws rather than all 613 commandments in principle and fewer today in practice.


#3

You cannot attempt to evaluate God’s reasons for doing what He did in the Old Testament. God doesn’t respond to anyone or anything. We are his in our entirety, and if he wants to kill 10 million people, he can do so freely. He does not respond to moral codes or any other ‘rules’.

Certainly, He had good reasons to do what he did, even though it might seem horrible to us. It is not our duty to discern WHY God decides to do certain things. Why do millions of people die of hunger, thirst, and terrible illnesses every year? Does it mean that God is cruel? Not at all. He has a benevolent plan for human Salvation, and, since we are his property, he can do whatever he wants with us. We do not know his ways.

At the Second Coming, God will reveal his overall plan for human salvation. We can expect to find out WHY God did what he did then, and not before.

Ultimately, the Sacrifice of Jesus Christ showed God’s inherent goodness in a more tangible fashion than anything in the Old Testament. However, our mere existence, which God freely chose to bestow on every human life, is already proof of God’s goodness per se. If God wants to put us to death or reward us with wealth, or if he gives us 100 years to live - it is not up to us to discern why he did so.


#4

Today, we live in probably the most terrible time in human history. Why doesnt God act on that like he did in Old Testament times? The world is stuffed full of evil etc.

The rules he set in OT times were harsh so why should the world get away with the acts that its inhabitants do these days? God seemed very strict in OT times.


#5

gotquestions.org/Old-Testament-violence.html

We live under a new convent.

openbible.info/topics/new_covenant

jdisciple.wordpress.com/2009/05/19/tattoos-body-piercings/

This site addressees the topic of tattoos and piercings, but its pretty relevant to this topic too.

I suggest you read the whole article and then the discussion in the comments.

If you still do not understand ask God for comprehension.

Edit: Problems such as wars, hunger, injustice, etc are product of the wickedness and selfishness of man and its free will, nothing more. Cant blame God for makings us free.


#6

Thanks. Lots to read


#7

The Old Testament rules were very harsh compared to today.

BUT

they were extremely just and merciful compared to the cultures of the time !

For example,

It is taught in the OT, an eye for an eye, a life for a life, etc…

At that time if a member of your family was killed, the victims family might go and slaughter the perpetrators entire clan.

God says no, be merciful only seek punishment of the perpetrator.

So you really need to understand the culture of the time to understand the why of these things.

God only gives us what we can handle in his revelations. He has built us up and helped us along through the ages.

If he had given the full non violent message of Christianity at the time, likely it would have been rejected and/or unable to survive. So he gave them what they needed, which brutal as it was, was far less brutal than the way they behaved before the law.

God then revealed more and more to us until we were able to receive the fullness of his revelation in Christ.


#8

I would caution however, to be very discerning using the links Shynsup provided and find instead a truly Catholic Christian understanding of OT Scripture first and then maybe check out the non-Catholic Christian understanding.


#9

Well first, remember that we are living in the Age of Grace, so relax, okay. :console:

Second, imagine Jesus being nailed to the Cross, hanging there, the
scourging too, that should have been us! Truly! We are all nothing by
vile, corrupt, and sinful people, inclined towards evil from birth.

Here’s why: When Adam (Our First Covenantal Head) first sinned, he
CRIPPLED spiritually the rest of humanity from that time forth. Back
then, we had only one thing to expect, and ONLY one thing: DEATH. http://forums.relicnews.com/images/smilies/skull_125.gif

That is how seriously God takes Sin, so much that *we all deserve to
die *(think now that song from Sweeney Todd). I hope you won’t hold
that against God, because he provides the solution:. . .he was wounded for our transgressions, crushed
for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was
upon him, and by his wounds we are healed.
– (Isaiah 53:5)
One man had to do something that NO ONE ELSE could do, to be righteous before God,
offer him atonement and perfect sacrifice, blood of innocence, pure offering. This man, of
course, would have to be God himself, Emmanuel, Yehoshua Mashiach, Jesus Christ. For God so loved the world, as to give his only be-
gotten Son; that whosoever believeth in him, may
not perish, but may have life everlasting.
– (John 3:16)
Again, remember Jesus at the Cross, the scourging, the shame, pain, and death.
THAT is how God feels about Sin, nevertheless he loved us enough to come and
suffer on our behalf, IN OUR STEAD, and Jesus there on the Cross experienced
the full wrath of God, “Elohi, Elohi, lama sabachthani?” (Mark 15:34).

RIGHT NOW, however, ever since Jesus, we live in the Age of Grace, justice has
been served, all righteousness fulfilled, but only by one man, God, Jesus Christ.
The only way to salvation, therefore, is to be covered in the Blood of Christ, that
which was shed for us.

So again, those Mosaic Laws and penalties, gone, fulfilled in Christ Jesus.


#10

Any links?


#11

What? The links provided are not from a non-catholic perspective.

Why dont you read before criticizing?

And btw, try to be constructive if you going to critizise and post the links you consider better.
Thanks. Shyn


#12

Just because the links are from a non catholic source does not mean they are wrong.

There are lots of Protestant sources that are excellent for proving Gods existence, or Jesus resurrection, or a host of other things.

Further I am not sure the origins of Biblehub, but the little that was pasted here I saw no problem with.

No need to argue over nothing.


#13

I doubt it, protestants are deceived by satan, not good example to follow, they have numerous missconceptions.

Any of the links provided were from a protestant source.


#14

gotquestions.org is a very anti-Catholic website. If you type in some material about Catholic apologetics, they are usually the first website to pop-up attempting to lead people away from the Catholic faith. While not all protestant websites are bad, I don’t think we should send people to websites that attempt to blatantly lead people away from the Catholic Church. I know that wasn’t your intent, but it is important to point that out.


#15

Yeah I missed the got questions link.

I’d avoid that for the reasons you stated. It’s hard to trust the source.

There are plenty of Catholic sources out there.

That said, in this issue relating to the old verses new covenants, I’d say most of Christianity is pretty united on.


#16

Yup, my bad.

"We believe that salvation is a gift of God’s grace through faith in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross (Ephesians 2:8-9). Christ’s death fully accomplished justification through faith and redemption from sin. Christ died in our place (Romans 5:8-9) and bore our sins in His own body (1 Peter 2:24).

We believe salvation is received by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone. Good works and obedience are results of salvation, not requirements for salvation. Due to the greatness, sufficiency, and perfection of Christ’s sacrifice, all those who have truly received Christ as Savior are eternally secure in salvation, kept by God’s power, secured and sealed in Christ forever (John 6:37-40; 10:27-30; Romans 8:1, 38-39; Ephesians 1:13-14; 1 Peter 1:5; Jude 24). Just as salvation cannot be earned by good works, neither does it need good works to be maintained or sustained. Good works and changed lives are the inevitable results of salvation (James ) "

Totally wrong.

Still,its a fair explanation regarding the old testament brutality.


#17

Those websites are Protestant. I don’t recommend reading them.


#18

Only the first one is, and i have read it, and there is no conflict withe the actual truth.


#19

Ok, so in OT days things were very different and God had a different set of rules?

Jesus came to save us from our sins etc and thus has changed the way in which God wants things done?

On Leviticus now and boy, that is a hard read! All the blood of offerings and leprosy etc etc! Phew


#20

Its not as if God had a different set of rules per se, God doesn’t change. His rules are always and always have been “Love God” and “Love Neighbor”

How he tells us to pursue those goals has changed based on our human experience and ability, not because of God, but because of us.

When Jesus came it was the catalyst for a change. Just as when God spoke to Abraham things changed and when He called Moses things changed, and really throughout the OT things continually changed toward the culmination in Christ.


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